Warfare & Tactics

Pew is always good.

Thank you for the kind words, Jade. Yesterday was a good fight, even if we lost.

We came to fight, we're planning on staying to fight. We look forward to seeing you in space.

I don't buy it Cearain really. I think all this talk of mobs of plexing alts is completely overblown. The reality is that you guys collectively (The amarr militia) just didn't want to defensive plex or risk basing in the warzone post Inferno.) You had the numbers (in pvpers) you had the equipment, the firepower, the capital support (which could have been used for logistics efforts and lifts between staging systems rather than sitting on silly hotdrops).

You guys had massive numerical advantage at times but you squandered it (again collectively) by having the old school aversion to plex warfare and the idea of a caste division between "those that are here for pvp" and those that are here for the occupancy war.

I think the leading organizations in the Amarr militia are the ones that lost it for you. Blaming hordes of anonymous farming alts (lots of them from the amarr) is just missing the point. If you have your leaders and fc's saying they aren't interested in the occupancy war and your oldest established corps and alliances running for the hills and away from the vulnerable warzone then you end up building a culture of defeat that breeds only losers in the long term.

I have no idea whatsoever how with Fweddit, Nulli, Tears, and your USTZ dominance you guys were incapable of rolling Huola in the last month. That was the crux of the war really - nothing to do with alt farming characters in apocryphally-gunless t1 frigates.

I think the pvpers and their battles have everything to do with Faction War because that's the morale, the mythology, the heroism and the shared experience that bind a militia together and make it a fighting force with desire to fight and win - rather than being a channel full of greedy selfish whingers that refuse to defend their own staging systems without somebody else to hold their hands.

Sorry Cearain - I think you are a decent guy - but you are WAY too fixated on the alt-plexing farming stuff and I think your strategy of staking all on a vulnerability exploit (small "e") for a grand tier 5 cashout against an undefeated Matari militia with its staging systems intact was extremely poor. You made the mistake of going for the cynical money grab rather than trying to win the war and it cost you in the long term.

When you had the advantages of Fweddit Nullli Hun and the rest you guys should have been purging Auga, Dal, Huola and driving minmatar back to Bosboger and hisec. Your infinite vulnerability really misfired in a big way. Winning faction war is not about milking the system and making alts rich - its about breaking the will of enemy pvp corps and alliances and winning the occupancy fights that matter in the home systems.

In the future I think the Amarr Militia can recover, but it needs to forget ALL the things its veterans THINK they know. You need to start from the beginning - forget any concept of alt farming meta nonsense and work on building a good place to play for those that want to take joy in Eve PVP and are prepared to fly together and build a community. It might take years - but you have to get over this alt-plexing obsession or just walk yourself - because at the moment the Amarrian old guard are the worst enemies to Amarrian recovery in this warzone.

gunless plexing frigates do seem to exist :\

was looking at a fairly backwater system (Avenod) on Eve-kill. http://eve-kill.net/?a=system_detail&sys_id=2090

A whole lot of ships killed there have been gunless plexer frigates, on both sides, some from corporations that i wouldn't have thought would do that sort of thing :s

some of them aren't alts, since they have kills in other ships too.

Not sure that they matter in the wider scheme of things, but for such a big percentage of all the pvp activity in that system to be gunless plexer frigates with 0 offensive ability seems somewhat less than ideal. :\

You assume the "old guard" cares about system ownership. If my enjoyment comes from leading combat fleets and fighting the enemy I will focus my time and efforts doing so. You are so focused on the PVE side of FW I think you forgot why most of us are here.

Don't try to dictate how I play Eve. You can win the occupancy war all you want. I will keep doing what i have enjoyed doing the last two years.

Nope, many of us, even the bitter, are all for Faction warfare. If SOV was based on more than just orbiting buttons I'm sure far more of us would be on it.

I want consequence but that doesn't have to be based on a mechanic designed to waste my time in the dullest way possible.

If it were only that simple. Jade I challenge you to look at the Amarr/Minmatar map and tell me that it is remotely fair. Metro is almost impossible to break into without massive numbers of around the clock plexers. For the record I did push systems. My fleets did do as you suggested. But any gains made through hard fought pvp or mindless plexing boredom are so easily reversed.

If we have a strong four hours in our timezone and the euro time zone had their strong four hours that equals eight hours of plexing time. That leaves sixteen hours for the opposing side to deplex. Not to mention the time needed to deplex our home systems.

I have in the past commended the Minmatar on their foresight before inferno. Amarr just did not have the numbers to defend systems at the time. Kamela was being pushed so hard we had no choice but to throw everything we had at it to defend. After inferno Minmatar quickly reached a high level of warzone control drawing in many PVE players looking to make isk. The Amarr got combat pilots.

We may have been able to fight the Minmatar head to head again after many months of being outnumbered and out gunned but that in no way means system control. It is the plexers who hold the big stick when it comes to sov.

Just to give you an example. From the day inferno launched till Amarr cashed out at T4 I personally made 900k LP. If this number seems low its because i spend most of my eve time in or leading fleets. Many plexes I was in I never got to reap the rewards being at the warp in. The vast majority of my LP came from kills.

Now my Minmatar alt, at 30 hours training time has made 600k LP in three evenings plexing. Once Minmatar reach T5 I will have made more isk in that short time then all the time I spend fighting and dieing for Amarr. Now Jade, tell me how this system is working as intended. I would love o hear your thoughts on it.

And gallente have exactly 10 systems or so right now which are not vulnerable and this whole front is not massive farmville with everyone and their dogs alt piling on easy Caldari/Matar LP?

Try again moron. Then again, based on drivel you spout to local, calling you a moron is an insult to morons around the world.

I wonder if things would be better if your current tier only affected your LP payout, so that keeping the level up was beneficial. Hmmm. Then LP store items never changed prices. Hmmmm that would affect some things Im sure.

the sov/lockout/etc. is fine.

so most of you have herpmatar plexing alts...great who gives a sh*t...use the isk and adopt the following attitude about FW and the new mechanics or whatever:

it's about walking onto the front lawn of your enemy and dropping a deuce in their yard by taking their system, then moving in, then ravaging the remaining SOBs trying to flee the stations with their stuff

it's about giving the finger to everyone that even thinks about taking back the system you worked hard to take

it's about giving the finger to everyone that evens thinks about stepping foot in the systems around yours

it's about dictating what kind of fights you want to have using plexes

it's about doing something so insane, such as moving in behind enemy lines and pushing to take a system to set a foothold where no one expects


if people take this attitude in amarr militia then minmatar are in trouble because the blobmatar are lazy and can't be everywhere at all times and they won't be.

there are plenty of big corps that can make this happen. insofar as i know there are still 3 "active" and "big" corps left in amarr militia. these 3 corps, who probably only want to moan will not do what is necessary, but the following is an EXAMPLE of what might be necessary to permenantly f*ck up the minmatar:
1. major campaign to take avenod via audaerne as an initial staging point, or setting up a temporary POS in audarne. this will require whoever takes avenod to permenantly move to avenod and offensive plex all surrounding systems and defensive plex avenod

2. major campaign to take todifrauan via akkio. this will require whoever takes todifrauan to permenantly move to todifrauan and offensive plex all surrounding systems and defensive plex todifrauan

3. major campaign to take siseide via egghelende. this will require whoever takes siseide to permenantly move to siseide and offensive plex all surrounding systems and defensive plex siseide

4. all other corps work on pushing bleak lands and moving in as they take systems.

if you want to keep systems, you have to move there.

sadly, no one will do the above example or anything similar, so good luck, and continue "le b*tching" below