EVE General Discussion

You should ask provi ppl and AAA members instead of random talking **** that comes up in your failbrain

lol as if i care.
The fact is still fact the blackops are good at what they do and many well known entities have said so too in this thread and the CSM have said so too.
Enjoy that cookie
And yes AAA are not known for their black ops so you should be the last person to talk about black ops ... Laugh about that one too

Back from vacation and thought this thread could use some dev love.


Yes, Black Ops definitely need some attention; the main problem with them is the lack of role focus. Some (like the Redeemer or Window) are trying to achieve a purpose directly on the battlefield, similar with recons by having an electronic warfare or damage related bonus. On top of that, they also are trying to fulfill a fleet support role with their cyno capability, which is quite in contradiction with the previous one.

And they aren't great at both: their raw HP is quite lower than tech 1 battleships (and tech 2 resistance boosts aren't stellar either), have less turret and missile hardpoints than tech 1 counterparts and remain more expensive to run, which doesn't make them appealing for direct engagement purposes. They also lack autonomy in their support role, as they are quite short ranged, fuel hungry and this issue is amplified by their small fuel bay forcing them to rely on other ships to resupply frequently during an operation.

The current plan is to take one these two listed roles out of the Black Ops ship class and reshape them to do the remaining one well. If they are disruption ships using EW, they should have more presence on the battlefield for their pricetag. If they are support tools for surprise attacks and small gang movement into enemy space, then they should have the proper bay, range and tools to do so accordingly.

The role dropped out of the Black Ops would then be moved to a new class in the tech 2 battleship range to replace for the loss.

We acknowledge some entities out there are using Black Ops with great effect when backed up with the proper organization, structure and out-of-the-box thinking to make use of them in unorthodox situations. While we don't want to take that away, Black Ops should be more effective without such heavy commitment into them (a statistic query we ran at the beginning of this year shown there are more Titan than Block Ops pilot on TQ). They should be great force multiplier tools for small groups to take on larger ones by surprise, and should be able to do so relatively well without relying on a dedicated support structure.

So, when would this be coming out? Unfortunately, not for a while. As explained in the various blogs before, our current priority is to fix tech 1 ships as a whole before moving to more advanced hulls. That is because we need a solid frame of reference to rely on and compare hulls to before we can move to more delicate and complex ships, like Black Ops or tech 3 hulls.


Also don't forget this is just our long term plan for now, and things may change in the future. In all cases they are not forgotten, but will take time to get to.

Hope that helps!

if you would have read my posts, you would realise that I dont mind it doing what it is suppose to do. BUT when BO can do so well atm with freaking amazing kill ration, you have to realise its a problem.
My point is actually very simple. BOs have done bloody well for the last 4 years at least in the kill ratio department.
If we are to buff they jump range or other present functionality then we must nerf other areas of it. Otherwise its no longer a support ship . We already know that it is capable of tanking very well and unleshing dps (besides the Sin). Otherwise the whole package its too powerfull. The game is only gonna become even more based on jump technology! To me this is also wrong. Too many ship jumping too many and no actually going through gates. I mean e got jump bridges, we got titans and soon we will have an even better BOs jumping stuff in masses. Its too focused on jumping stuff in.

It is obvious I am not the only one that knows that BOs are very good. There is a lot of posts in this thread from other mayor alliances who agree that thy are very good atm.

what are you talking about bro? its not only me that has said this in this thread.
Its not hard at all to jump release remote repper drones spider tank and fire! Just cos you are too dumb to know how to operate BO effectively, it does not mean the rest dont get it. The above i posted is again related to how Burn Eden does it. And since you are well aware that noone atm does it better than BE at BO and they hav been doing it for like 4 years.

You can try and stirr it anyway you want from the truth but the fact is that BO are very powerfull. Just cos AAA does not know how to use them well, it does not mean BO suck. It just means AAA is not the best place for BO pilots!

well this is an alt so obviously you dont know who is behind it?

Besides I dont think you should be talking about black ops with all your respect.
After all you claim that black ops was originally designed to:
If the ship is supposed to jump to a hostile POS and take out the jammer, it should be able to tank the freaking POS guns.
source >>
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=411677#post411677
To say that black ops were originally designed to take down POS and jammers and tank pos guns.
which is faaaar from truth. I think you need to spend more time using black ops cos you clearly dont know about black ops even with your vast experince in dns

Ytterbium,

I'm a bit concerned by your post that you guys are going to do the old 'sledgehammer to crack a nut' job on Black Ops and break something in the process. They aren't as 'broken' as a lot of the masses would have (Covert Ops cloak - god no, they don't need that at all) and actually tweaking is the order of the day.

As Emperor Ryan has already eluded to, these are very specialist ships for specialist roles; Mildy have great success with their BOPS doctrine, Noir. has slowly been developing our own take on Black Ops, Dirt Nap Squad do completely their own thing too. The biggest issue, which I think all would agree on, is the fuel usage - it simply isn't sustainable for longer term, larger scale operations. Range could possibly do with a tweak upwards, HP's might do well to also be included.

They aren't exactly slouches in the DPS department - I've flown my Sin on combat drops and in-system fights since 2010 (sadly, kill-mails were broken in the early days and show as ‘unknown’), recently it just got a whole lot better and a well flown, properly fitted Sin is a beast. I do hope you don’t turn it into a glorified taxi service.

If I had one general complaint it’s that they're too expensive for what they are, in my opinion the simplest solution is to reduce the build costs, with a [wet finger in the air] target market price of 350-400M, making their use more palatable. It would also from a game balance be much less risker than tearing up the script and going off on a tangent making new ships.

TL:DR

Don't go OTT on 're-balancing' Black Ops, tweaks now, don't break in the longer run.

what if i say that i have another main in burn eden, would you still be ******** enough to think that it matters what alliance soneone is in to be good in a ship? And btw how could you possibly know? You are just a forum warrior / ingame carebear that prolly got ganked in you 5b ship because you were dumm enough to not dock when neitral in local and now your just trolling the **** out of it... You do realise your the only one right? Makes you think doesnt it...