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The new Mackinkaw, new king miner, better than a hauler, all in one, afk mining machine.
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Tigress Tionese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-08-12 09:51:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Tigress Tionese
Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy
Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy
Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy

I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered. Able to mine on ice roids for over half an hour as a semi afk income, it can't be beaten, it has taken the role of the Hulk as the primary choice of barge. Failing that, the retriever, which is almost as good.

There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA. Does anyone else think that the devs didn't think this through too well? I can't see many miners not taking a Mackinkaw over a Hulk even with Orca support, because 35k m3 ore hold allows them to do other things while your Mackinkaw pulls in what is basically an afk income for at least half an hour at a time.

It's already apparent what effect this is having on the ice market. If the trend continues, soon the only people mining ice will be bots and afk alts.

Someone pointed out below that the Mackinkaw hauls ore better than an actual hauler does now. It takes the primary role of a hauler and does it better. You may aswell have just taken the Iteron MK5/Occator and given it mining lasers and hulk like yield. That's what we have now, a super industrial all in one miner and hauler

A poster also took screenshots of roid belts and proved that mackinkaw is now the most used barge by far, copying the shots here so they're not so hidden. Even orca fleets prefer to use mackinkaws.

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3889/vaurent.jpg
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Crimsonjade
Reikoku
Plug N Play
#2 - 2012-08-12 09:54:57 UTC
thanks. now i know what to train on my alt. fueling 4 carriers is a pain.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#3 - 2012-08-12 10:03:42 UTC
Tigress Tionese wrote:
There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA.
A quarter the amount counts as “not far below” these days? Wow…
Frying Doom
#4 - 2012-08-12 10:10:24 UTC
Tigress Tionese wrote:

Does anyone else think that the devs didn't think this through too well?

It's already apparent what effect this is having on the ice market. If the trend continues, soon the only people mining ice will be bots and afk alts.

Actually I think they thought it out very well. Everyone knows the mack is an AFK machine and that there operators are probably not there, now we wait for the effect... Gankers to design an effective and cheap way of killing them on mass.

So Risk vs. Reward.

Yes we will have spikes and drops as things settle down but it will all work out right in the end. As to bots there are a hell of a lot less of them than there used to be.

Yes the mack has become the tool for people who don't want to do much and make isk so the cost of ice will fall, so they get compensated to a lesser degree because they are not there. For people who do want to sit at your keyboard, DON'T ice mine, you don't need to lock new targets or move if you mine ICE so it is worth less per hour.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#5 - 2012-08-12 10:10:34 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Tigress Tionese wrote:
There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA.
A quarter the amount counts as “not far below” these days? Wow…


Well, technically the ore hold of the Orca is 50k, the Corp Hangar is 40k, and on a tanked Orca the cargo hold is 35k or so. So yes, the Mackinaw's ore hold is in the same size range as any of the individual nooks and crannies of the Orca :)

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Jacob Holland
Weyland-Vulcan Industries
#6 - 2012-08-12 10:12:12 UTC
With specific regard to the Ore hold the difference is not that significant...

However the OP ignores the cargo and corp hangar of the Orca - Which can amount to more than double the ore bay.

Of course that may be a side-long swipe at the broken corp hangar mechanics ATM...
Antal Jozsef
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2012-08-12 10:14:11 UTC
Thank you for pointing out how small the Orca's ore bay is.
Frying Doom
#8 - 2012-08-12 10:15:03 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Tigress Tionese wrote:
There's one main reason for this. 35k m3 ore hold, not far below that of an ORCA.
A quarter the amount counts as “not far below” these days? Wow…

Now, Now, lets not confuse things with mathematics.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Alara IonStorm
#9 - 2012-08-12 10:18:53 UTC
Honestly I think they should just dump the Cargohold down to 2000 for Crystals and increase the ORE Bay to around 200k.

Then introduce light freighters if people miss their improvised hauler so much.
Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#10 - 2012-08-12 10:31:27 UTC
Best thing is that you dock your full mack in the orca that is also full to carry even more ore

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Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar'

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Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-08-12 10:43:54 UTC
Chribba wrote:
Best thing is that you dock your full mack in the orca that is also full to carry even more ore


Yeah pretty sure that's not intentional

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#12 - 2012-08-12 10:50:29 UTC
Andski wrote:
Chribba wrote:
Best thing is that you dock your full mack in the orca that is also full to carry even more ore
Yeah pretty sure that's not intentional
Shhh!
Being able to stuff 183,000m³ worth of ore into a single Orca without any modifications (206k if you abuse the hell out of cans) just makes the eventual loss that much more fun… P
darkenspace
Imperial AMARR White Kights
#13 - 2012-08-12 10:53:48 UTC
i am reading this so go on it is all i have going right now
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-08-12 10:55:33 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Andski wrote:
Chribba wrote:
Best thing is that you dock your full mack in the orca that is also full to carry even more ore
Yeah pretty sure that's not intentional
Shhh!
Being able to stuff 183,000m³ worth of ore into a single Orca without any modifications (206k if you abuse the hell out of cans) just makes the eventual loss that much more fun… P


650k m3 of ore in a Rorqual says ~hi~

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#15 - 2012-08-12 11:00:09 UTC
Andski wrote:
650k m3 of ore in a Rorqual says ~hi~
Sure, but those Orcas will be used in “safe” areas. You know what that means… P

(And of course, someone will go full rtard and expand it up to 290k with only 66k EHP to protect it.)
Grumpymunky
Monkey Steals The Peach
#16 - 2012-08-12 11:10:31 UTC
These changes aren't enough. I won't be happy until I have auto-targeting strip miners, and my ore-hold is big enough for 23 hours' worth of non-stop mining.

Post with your monkey.

Thread locked due to lack of pants.
Suddenly Boom
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#17 - 2012-08-12 11:41:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Suddenly Boom
Nobody has pointed out that mackinkaw now holds more ore than an industrial hauler? How has nobody seen the fail logic in this? It takes the role of miner and hauler and does both better. The only thing industrials do is haul, that is their primary role and is what they do best. Wait, it was, until the patch? TROLOLOL

They've turned it into a miner and industrial all in one, the best of both worlds, a true solo pwnmobile.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#18 - 2012-08-12 11:44:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Suddenly Boom wrote:
Nobody has pointed out that mackinkaw now holds more ore than an industrial hauler? How has nobody seen the fail logic in this?
Seeing as how you can't use the Mack as an industrial hauler, the fail logic lies in comparing it to one.

That was the entire reason for giving it a specific ore hold: so it can't be used that way, because all it ever will (and can) carry is space-wasting ore. If you want to haul stuff, the best ship for it is an industrial, since they can carry far more (both in terms of stuff and in terms of variety) than a simple mining ship can.
Suddenly Boom
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2012-08-12 11:47:48 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Suddenly Boom wrote:
Nobody has pointed out that mackinkaw now holds more ore than an industrial hauler? How has nobody seen the fail logic in this?
Seeing as how you can't use the Mack as an industrial hauler, the fail logic lies in comparing it to one.

That was the entire reason for giving it a specific ore hold: so it can't be used that way, because all it ever will (and can) carry is space-wasting ore. If you want to haul stuff, the best ship for it is an industrial, since they can carry far more (both in terms of stuff and in terms of variety) than a simple mining ship can.


Unless you're using that industrial ship to haul ore from the belt, which is more its primary use.
Zera Kerrigan
The 420th Token
#20 - 2012-08-12 11:53:28 UTC
Don't say this stuff out loud! I like my AFK ISK machines! Don't ruin them, please? Sad
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