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EVE Online: Inferno 1.2 Feedback

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Ephemeral Waves
Alfonso's Volunteers
#261 - 2012-08-11 01:14:46 UTC
How do I stop your new tutorial from popping up every. single. time. I log on?
Adam Winnchester
State War Academy
Caldari State
#262 - 2012-08-11 02:04:58 UTC
I'm liking a lot of the things in the 1.2 patch. I think the most useful thing for me so far has been the mission overlay. I did have one minor suggestion for it though. Would it be possible to add a small check mark next to the mission name once you have completed the objective similar to the check mark that appears in the mission details?
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#263 - 2012-08-11 07:46:54 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
We updated the new module button tooltips today, Friday, in Inferno 1.2.2, based on your feedback.

Please find information on the new and updated tooltips in this post from CCP Soundwave: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=142498

We'd love to hear your feedback on today's update in that thread.


We dont want tooltip delay we want an option for turning off!!!!
The crap tooltip stucking on screen time to time!!!
Zamrikus
Reckless-Endangerment
Manifesto.
#264 - 2012-08-11 08:39:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Zamrikus
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.

How can you remove a skill that had to be trained and replace it with a skill no one will train, as far as game balancing goes, you add this next to useless skill instead of changing or adding things that need to be changed.

I would like my SP back this is NOT a skill I trained for, this is a new skill, you REMOVED the old skill.

How is this the proper way of addressing the removal of a skill? Just because you said a skill is replacing another one, doesn't mean anything if they don't have even the smallest bit of related purpose.

Fix this, yes FIX! It is broken and a step backwards rather than forwards, which is what you'd expect from a patch eh?


On another note, I love the new barges. Smile
Olga Ivanovna
Doomheim
#265 - 2012-08-11 10:08:44 UTC
I love that agent missiona now are visble on screen when in space, and the menu with "warp to". Great change! Big smile

One thing is missing in the menu though... warp fleet to target.
CCP Punkturis
C C P
C C P Alliance
#266 - 2012-08-11 10:16:15 UTC
mkint wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Urgg Boolean wrote:
Maybe someone already asked this, but what happened to the switch to make "shift-click" windows the default? If it's there, I can't find it...


They hid it in each individual inventory window. Hash stack in upper left corner of the window.

I thought it was supposed to be a global switch in the Esc configuration space, but noooooo, they have to get their digs in.



it is a global "switch" but to make it more obvious we put in the settings for the window (if you change it in one inventory window it also changes in the other). we have window based settings in this exact place for a lot of windows. Fleet window, EVEMail, Drone window, Overview to name a few so it shouldn't be a total surprise to find settings options there.

I for one, have harder time finding settings in the esc menu all the time since there are more tabs there and a bunch of settings, but if you like to be angry about the placement of this, it's fine by me.

You see, that shows the inconsistency between how devs see the inventory versus how players see it. Players see inventory as a universal tool that is incorporated into everything they do, so they assume there should be a global setting in the escape menu.

Devs see inventory as a hammer... something you take out occasionally on your bi-annual "play EVE" day. Something you use so rarely that you'd hide the configuration for it not even in every inventory window but only "secondary" inventory windows.

No wonder it failed so badly, and continues to fail.


first of all, it's in every window, not just the secondary - not sure why you're saying different, maybe you just like to say random things that aren't true, maybe you haven't tried it out yourself.

and I think putting the settings in the window that you have open all the time says exactly the opposite of what you're saying. instead of hiding it in the esc menu where you'd configure it once (like for example UI Scaling, or take high quality screenshots) we put it in the window where you can constantly see it. I've given my reason for putting it there (both here and in my previous post), I get that you'd rather like it in some column in some tab in the esc menu and we're just going to have to agree on disagreeing where to put it.

hope you just use the setting if you like, and not, if you don't like it, regardless of where it's located.

I don't see a reason to waste more of my time to talk about a placement of a setting (since in the grand sceme of things I find it pretty minor) so this will be my final word on it.

♥ EVE Brogrammer ♥ Team Five 0 ♥ @CCP_Punkturis ♥
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#267 - 2012-08-11 10:50:54 UTC
Zamrikus wrote:
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.

How can you remove a skill that had to be trained and replace it with a skill no one will train, as far as game balancing goes, you add this next to useless skill instead of changing or adding things that need to be changed.

I would like my SP back this is NOT a skill I trained for, this is a new skill, you REMOVED the old skill.

How is this the proper way of addressing the removal of a skill? Just because you said a skill is replacing another one, doesn't mean anything if they don't have even the smallest bit of related purpose.

Fix this, yes FIX! It is broken and a step backwards rather than forwards, which is what you'd expect from a patch eh?

Greyscale is right - this is the way these things have consistently been handled in the past (e.g. the new probing system in Apocrypha) whether you like it or not.

.
Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
Masters of Flying Objects
#268 - 2012-08-11 10:57:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Salpun
Ephemeral Waves wrote:
How do I stop your new tutorial from popping up every. single. time. I log on?


First post in the issues thread has a work around.

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.
CCP Explorer
C C P
C C P Alliance
#269 - 2012-08-11 11:06:06 UTC
Zamrikus wrote:
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.
You trained the skill for the old effect, we re-balanced the game so that a skill isn't needed anymore and changed the effect of the skill to a new effect. You can still accomplish what you trained the skill for and now you can accomplish something new as well. You are better off after than before.

Erlendur S. Thorsteinsson | Senior Development Director | EVE Online // CCP Games | @CCP_Explorer
Akinesis
Black Rose Inc.
Black Rose.
#270 - 2012-08-11 11:06:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Akinesis
CCP Punkturis wrote:
mkint wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Urgg Boolean wrote:
Maybe someone already asked this, but what happened to the switch to make "shift-click" windows the default? If it's there, I can't find it...


They hid it in each individual inventory window. Hash stack in upper left corner of the window.

I thought it was supposed to be a global switch in the Esc configuration space, but noooooo, they have to get their digs in.



it is a global "switch" but to make it more obvious we put in the settings for the window (if you change it in one inventory window it also changes in the other). we have window based settings in this exact place for a lot of windows. Fleet window, EVEMail, Drone window, Overview to name a few so it shouldn't be a total surprise to find settings options there.

I for one, have harder time finding settings in the esc menu all the time since there are more tabs there and a bunch of settings, but if you like to be angry about the placement of this, it's fine by me.

You see, that shows the inconsistency between how devs see the inventory versus how players see it. Players see inventory as a universal tool that is incorporated into everything they do, so they assume there should be a global setting in the escape menu.

Devs see inventory as a hammer... something you take out occasionally on your bi-annual "play EVE" day. Something you use so rarely that you'd hide the configuration for it not even in every inventory window but only "secondary" inventory windows.

No wonder it failed so badly, and continues to fail.


first of all, it's in every window, not just the secondary - not sure why you're saying different, maybe you just like to say random things that aren't true, maybe you haven't tried it out yourself.

and I think putting the settings in the window that you have open all the time says exactly the opposite of what you're saying. instead of hiding it in the esc menu where you'd configure it once (like for example UI Scaling, or take high quality screenshots) we put it in the window where you can constantly see it. I've given my reason for putting it there (both here and in my previous post), I get that you'd rather like it in some column in some tab in the esc menu and we're just going to have to agree on disagreeing where to put it.

hope you just use the setting if you like, and not, if you don't like it, regardless of where it's located.

I don't see a reason to waste more of my time to talk about a placement of a setting (since in the grand sceme of things I find it pretty minor) so this will be my final word on it.


My entire Corp is cheering over this option. And the setting placement is perfect. If people read the patch notes properly there would be no issue. And other people don't understand convenience. For people that may need to alternate between the setting regularly, having the option in the escape menu would truly be a pain. Having it in it's current location is the obvious and logical choice.

I say well done, Dev team! Would have been nice to have it earlier tho Blink
CCP Explorer
C C P
C C P Alliance
#271 - 2012-08-11 11:07:48 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
mkint wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Urgg Boolean wrote:
Maybe someone already asked this, but what happened to the switch to make "shift-click" windows the default? If it's there, I can't find it...


They hid it in each individual inventory window. Hash stack in upper left corner of the window.

I thought it was supposed to be a global switch in the Esc configuration space, but noooooo, they have to get their digs in.



it is a global "switch" but to make it more obvious we put in the settings for the window (if you change it in one inventory window it also changes in the other). we have window based settings in this exact place for a lot of windows. Fleet window, EVEMail, Drone window, Overview to name a few so it shouldn't be a total surprise to find settings options there.

I for one, have harder time finding settings in the esc menu all the time since there are more tabs there and a bunch of settings, but if you like to be angry about the placement of this, it's fine by me.

You see, that shows the inconsistency between how devs see the inventory versus how players see it. Players see inventory as a universal tool that is incorporated into everything they do, so they assume there should be a global setting in the escape menu.

Devs see inventory as a hammer... something you take out occasionally on your bi-annual "play EVE" day. Something you use so rarely that you'd hide the configuration for it not even in every inventory window but only "secondary" inventory windows.

No wonder it failed so badly, and continues to fail.


first of all, it's in every window, not just the secondary - not sure why you're saying different, maybe you just like to say random things that aren't true, maybe you haven't tried it out yourself.

and I think putting the settings in the window that you have open all the time says exactly the opposite of what you're saying. instead of hiding it in the esc menu where you'd configure it once (like for example UI Scaling, or take high quality screenshots) we put it in the window where you can constantly see it. I've given my reason for putting it there (both here and in my previous post), I get that you'd rather like it in some column in some tab in the esc menu and we're just going to have to agree on disagreeing where to put it.

hope you just use the setting if you like, and not, if you don't like it, regardless of where it's located.

I don't see a reason to waste more of my time to talk about a placement of a setting (since in the grand sceme of things I find it pretty minor) so this will be my final word on it.
A quick follow-up, we are in general aiming to reduce the number of settings in the ESC menu and moving them where they are actually used.

Erlendur S. Thorsteinsson | Senior Development Director | EVE Online // CCP Games | @CCP_Explorer
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#272 - 2012-08-11 11:10:41 UTC  |  Edited by: KIller Wabbit
CCP Explorer wrote:
Zamrikus wrote:
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.
You trained the skill for the old effect, we re-balanced the game so that a skill isn't needed anymore and changed the effect of the skill to a new effect. You can still accomplish what you trained the skill for and now you can accomplish something new as well. You are better off after than before.



You made a choice for us. That's what's wrong here. The old skill we needed. For many of us, we would not need the new one, therefore would not have chosen it to start with.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#273 - 2012-08-11 11:11:27 UTC
CCP Punkturis wrote:
mkint wrote:
CCP Punkturis wrote:
KIller Wabbit wrote:
Urgg Boolean wrote:
Maybe someone already asked this, but what happened to the switch to make "shift-click" windows the default? If it's there, I can't find it...


They hid it in each individual inventory window. Hash stack in upper left corner of the window.

I thought it was supposed to be a global switch in the Esc configuration space, but noooooo, they have to get their digs in.



it is a global "switch" but to make it more obvious we put in the settings for the window (if you change it in one inventory window it also changes in the other). we have window based settings in this exact place for a lot of windows. Fleet window, EVEMail, Drone window, Overview to name a few so it shouldn't be a total surprise to find settings options there.

I for one, have harder time finding settings in the esc menu all the time since there are more tabs there and a bunch of settings, but if you like to be angry about the placement of this, it's fine by me.

You see, that shows the inconsistency between how devs see the inventory versus how players see it. Players see inventory as a universal tool that is incorporated into everything they do, so they assume there should be a global setting in the escape menu.

Devs see inventory as a hammer... something you take out occasionally on your bi-annual "play EVE" day. Something you use so rarely that you'd hide the configuration for it not even in every inventory window but only "secondary" inventory windows.

No wonder it failed so badly, and continues to fail.


first of all, it's in every window, not just the secondary - not sure why you're saying different, maybe you just like to say random things that aren't true, maybe you haven't tried it out yourself.

and I think putting the settings in the window that you have open all the time says exactly the opposite of what you're saying. instead of hiding it in the esc menu where you'd configure it once (like for example UI Scaling, or take high quality screenshots) we put it in the window where you can constantly see it. I've given my reason for putting it there (both here and in my previous post), I get that you'd rather like it in some column in some tab in the esc menu and we're just going to have to agree on disagreeing where to put it.

hope you just use the setting if you like, and not, if you don't like it, regardless of where it's located.

I don't see a reason to waste more of my time to talk about a placement of a setting (since in the grand sceme of things I find it pretty minor) so this will be my final word on it.


You are just thinking of those of us already in the game. For new users this is a bad place to put it.
KIller Wabbit
MEME Thoughts
#274 - 2012-08-11 11:13:18 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
A quick follow-up, we are in general aiming to reduce the number of settings in the ESC menu and moving them where they are actually used.


Exactly the wrong approach. You are just trying to create a situation where people will play the way you want them to. Not the way *they* want to.
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#275 - 2012-08-11 11:17:27 UTC
Zamrikus wrote:
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.

How can you remove a skill that had to be trained and replace it with a skill no one will train, as far as game balancing goes, you add this next to useless skill instead of changing or adding things that need to be changed.

I would like my SP back this is NOT a skill I trained for, this is a new skill, you REMOVED the old skill.

How is this the proper way of addressing the removal of a skill? Just because you said a skill is replacing another one, doesn't mean anything if they don't have even the smallest bit of related purpose.

Fix this, yes FIX! It is broken and a step backwards rather than forwards, which is what you'd expect from a patch eh?


On another note, I love the new barges. Smile


+1
Ribikoka
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#276 - 2012-08-11 11:29:39 UTC
Dirigo laForma wrote:
I agree whole heartedly with being able to turn off and on the mouse over stuff. Sometimes it's useful. But alot of the time it gets in the way. Especially in the contextual menus. Also, I would like the "search" tab put back in the market interface with the "Browse" and "Quickbar" tabs. It is a pain to operate as you have to clear the search to get back to the browse. You can't do more than one thing at a time such as loke at ships in browse and check out modules or ore prices in the search etc. Please! Put back my beloved search tab!

Dirigo out.



Yup another clickfest after fail uni-inventory.
Everywhere those fail trees, and the players just repeating clicks time to time.
Search browse folders + click to open, search and again clicks,clicks,clicks,clicks to open new folders.

Now i feel pain in my fingertip from this crap clickfest.

With the new ui and this crap tree idiocracy bring more than 10 times clicks than before.
whosafraid
Eura MoFo
#277 - 2012-08-11 11:33:12 UTC
Seriously mouse over modules needs a unchecked button....
you have just created a Logi pilot nightmare..
distance and target names blocked for PVP..


PRO TIP :
There is a old Irish saying that CCP should learn ( IF IT AINT BROKE DONT TRY TO FIX IT )

Plaude Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#278 - 2012-08-11 12:31:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Plaude Pollard
Mhari Dson wrote:
removing the market search tab: fail, put it back dammit.

The Market Search-function is still present. They just moved it to the Browse tab, which I actually think makes it easier than having to switch tab between "Browse" and "Search" constantly.

New to EVE? Want to learn? The Crimson Cartel will train you in the fields of _**your **_choice. Mainly active in EU afternoons and evenings. Contact me for more info.
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#279 - 2012-08-11 12:49:46 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP karkur
Ribikoka wrote:
Dirigo laForma wrote:
I agree whole heartedly with being able to turn off and on the mouse over stuff. Sometimes it's useful. But alot of the time it gets in the way. Especially in the contextual menus. Also, I would like the "search" tab put back in the market interface with the "Browse" and "Quickbar" tabs. It is a pain to operate as you have to clear the search to get back to the browse. You can't do more than one thing at a time such as loke at ships in browse and check out modules or ore prices in the search etc. Please! Put back my beloved search tab!

Dirigo out.



Yup another clickfest after fail uni-inventory.
Everywhere those fail trees, and the players just repeating clicks time to time.
Search browse folders + click to open, search and again clicks,clicks,clicks,clicks to open new folders.

Now i feel pain in my fingertip from this crap clickfest.

With the new ui and this crap tree idiocracy bring more than 10 times clicks than before.

Well... if you expand for example the "blueprint" group, and next time you search something and the "blueprint" group doesn't expand, that is just a bug, and it would be great if you could file a big report on it (because it works just fine for me) Smile

The new search shouldn't require more clicking... yes, you will have to open the groups you are interested in the first time, but if you don't collapse them they should just stay open on your next search.
But grouping the results like this does allow you to just ignore some groups you are not interested in... for example if you rarely use blueprints, having them mixed in with all the modules/ships was in my opinion pretty annoying, but now you can just collapse that group, and won't have to scroll as much to get to the stuff you are actually interested in.

I also hope your poor fingertips will recover soonSmile

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur
Zed Jackelope
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#280 - 2012-08-11 13:42:09 UTC
CCP Explorer wrote:
Zamrikus wrote:
CCP Greyscale says this....really now?

I'm just trying to explain why the patchnotes say what they do. We understand that some players will be unhappy with this as they feel that some skills they've trained are less useful to them. This is however something that happens pretty much every time we make any serious balance changes, and it's been long-standing policy that we don't reimburse skill points due to this kind of change. We appreciate that this is not to everyone's liking but we currently feel it's the best way to deal with these situations overall.

I would have never trained the skill ethnic relations was changed to.
You trained the skill for the old effect, we re-balanced the game so that a skill isn't needed anymore and changed the effect of the skill to a new effect. You can still accomplish what you trained the skill for and now you can accomplish something new as well. You are better off after than before.


Nope... re-balancing a skill is one thing. You basically deleted a skill and put a different on in its place. There should've been a sp refund for this skill. If people wanted the new skill, they would've used the refund on it.