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Tooltip update today!

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Author
CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#61 - 2012-08-10 19:07:35 UTC
Jim Era wrote:
I refuse, saw screenshots of how clunky and huge they were, I just don't even want to deal with them (got a long skill in que I think)
*not like I am capable of doing anything in-game anyways :P

I don't mind tooltips, they are actually helpful, especially when detailed, but these were over the top, more black space than information...which the information provided wasn't that useful :/ annnnd I hate to admit it, but I hate using my Fkeys, so I frequently mouse my modules so they would pop up and confuse the hell out of me.
Couldn't the tooltip just be along the lines of the "show info' options


EDIT: I'm not mad, just offering feedback

Could you pleeeeease try them out... just for me SadBear
There is a delay now, so now you can mouse your modules, and the tooltips don't appear right away (1 second is way longer than I thought it was... when I was implementing it I actually timed it to make sure it was only a second because in my head second is so short so I wasn't sure it was doing the right thing P)

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur

Salpun
Global Telstar Federation Offices
Masters of Flying Objects
#62 - 2012-08-10 19:10:32 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Jim Era wrote:
I refuse, saw screenshots of how clunky and huge they were, I just don't even want to deal with them (got a long skill in que I think)
*not like I am capable of doing anything in-game anyways :P

I don't mind tooltips, they are actually helpful, especially when detailed, but these were over the top, more black space than information...which the information provided wasn't that useful :/ annnnd I hate to admit it, but I hate using my Fkeys, so I frequently mouse my modules so they would pop up and confuse the hell out of me.
Couldn't the tooltip just be along the lines of the "show info' options


EDIT: I'm not mad, just offering feedback

Could you pleeeeease try them out... just for me SadBear
There is a delay now, so now you can mouse your modules, and the tooltips don't appear right away (1 second is way longer than I thought it was... when I was implementing it I actually timed it to make sure it was only a second because in my head second is so short so I wasn't sure it was doing the right thing P)

Half second would have worked just as well maybe.P

If i dont know something about EVE. I check https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/ISK_The_Guide

See you around the universe.

Jim Era
#63 - 2012-08-10 19:11:12 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
stuff n things


Ok, I'll test it out later tonight when I get off work. ( they made me stop bringing the laptop up here to play QQ)

ETA: 5h 20m til test sequence

Wat™

CCP karkur
C C P
C C P Alliance
#64 - 2012-08-10 19:17:55 UTC
Jim Era wrote:
CCP karkur wrote:
stuff n things


Ok, I'll test it out later tonight when I get off work. ( they made me stop bringing the laptop up here to play QQ)

ETA: 5h 20m til test sequence

Thank you Smile

Also curious where "up here" is

CCP karkur | Programmer | Team Five 0 | @CCP_karkur

Vilnius Zar
SDC Multi Ten
#65 - 2012-08-10 19:30:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Vilnius Zar
The delay as is just won't do. Some people like the tooltips and want them show up faster (although many of those posts are just trolls) and some people don't. Why doesn't CCP simply accept that fact and make it a yes/no option? The whole thing about "meh, our settings screen is already cluttered" is silly as that seems to mean they're more happy to have the game cluttered than the settings menu, and anyway you can slide it in just below the tutorials option.

Don't make something less good than it should be just because it's easier to code that way, that's showing contempt for both us players as the game itself. "Excellence", "no fear" and "honestly, we learned from our :incarna: mistakes" and all that.

Do it right on the first go or don't release it till you do.
Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#66 - 2012-08-10 19:59:55 UTC
Let us turn them off. They are a nice feature add, but relatively superfluous for most players and most situations.

Not to mention, I align my targets above my modules, so no matter what, they just get in the way. The weapon range and stats are great, but they don't change often enough to warrant being front and center all of the time. That info could have easily been put in the fitting screen.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.

Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#67 - 2012-08-10 20:02:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Chokichi Ozuwara
As a rule of thumb, you guys should be trying to make the UI more customizable and remove redundancy and bloat.

The wrong way to go, is to reimagine what thousands of players are already using and comfortable with. You run the risk of alienating a lot of users like with the Unified Inventory.

The right thing is to find those annoying little pain points, and to keep removing them, so that things get easier, rather than busier, harder or more "responsive for the sake of being responsive"

A prime example is the JUMP and DOCK commands allowing warp to zero and the subsequent action.

Another example, is the corp bookmarks.

These are changes that impact thousands of players in a very positive way.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.

Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#68 - 2012-08-10 20:37:31 UTC
"Disabling tooltips completely. This would basically be a button that lets you disable all tooltips in the game by selecting it. That means no more stuff popping up anywhere, giving you a cleaner UI if you feel the tips aren't helpful anymore.

This didn't occur to you during the DESIGN PHASE? Oops


Signature removed - CCP Eterne

Aludra Bel'Taran
Carbon Organics
#69 - 2012-08-10 22:54:21 UTC
A couple of thoughts on potential improvements....

- Personally, I'm not crazy on showing the module icon in the tootip...
- Put the control of the tooltips behavious in our hands, say via the ESC menu
- Consider implementingthese controls for the following:

Transparency (from almost see-through to current black box)

Size of Tooltip box (while probably keeping the scale of the Tootip)

Appearance Delay - from 0 = "Never appear", through steps from 0.1 to 2.0 seconds

Fade Delay (only enabled if Appearance Delay > 0) - from 0.5 seconds to 5 seconds, with final option of "Stay forever" - until mouse is moved off, as is current behaviour.

Toggle Icons on / off

Jim Era
#70 - 2012-08-10 23:31:38 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:

Thank you Smile

Also curious where "up here" is


"Up here" was referring to my place of work. They gave me the OK to bring my laptop as long as I participate in very minimal activities and focus on work, but lately have been overloaded so I can't bring it because we are so busy.

Test sequence initiation will begin in 58 minutes.

Wat™

Jita Girl Ohayo
State War Academy
Caldari State
#71 - 2012-08-10 23:40:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Jita Girl Ohayo
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey everyone

First of all, we’re going to add a one second delay when hovering over modules, so the pop-up is less intrusive.


this delay tooltip, that add today, too long appear... annoying Oops

want fast see(for example how optimal+fallow), but now need long wait Sad
Melina Lin
Universal Frog
#72 - 2012-08-11 00:08:46 UTC
Aludra Bel'Taran wrote:
Appearance Delay - from 0 = "Never appear", through steps from 0.1 to 2.0 seconds


Sounds good to me. Make it so, pretty please.
mkint
#73 - 2012-08-11 00:57:53 UTC
Jita Girl Ohayo wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Hey everyone

First of all, we’re going to add a one second delay when hovering over modules, so the pop-up is less intrusive.


this delay tooltip, that add today, too long appear... annoying Oops

want fast see(for example how optimal+fallow), but now need long wait Sad

Why do you not already know it? Do you just throw a dart at your monitor to pick your ammo? I don't understand the point of the tooltip since optimal range is something deliberately chosen. Unless it's not, but then you're gonna die a lot anyway.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.

Jim Era
#74 - 2012-08-11 01:31:53 UTC
CCP Karkur, after a semi extensive test run I must say, it is actually far worse than I thought.
The box is unimaginably large, the information should be crammed with minimal space between, as well as losing the icons...they are a bit redundant and not necessary~icon flashing like that reminds me of WoW, I don't care what it looks like, just how it performs.

The delay is not too terrible actually. I would still prefer an option to disable, beit from 0-1-2 seconds or just its either on, or off I don't care, but I do not want to see it most of the time.

With that said, I'm about to put a long skill in queue in preparation of the next patch (or at least until they shrink a tad).
Cool

Wat™

Rengerel en Distel
#75 - 2012-08-11 02:17:00 UTC
If you won't let us customize the window ourselves, you can atleast meet us halfway:
1) Remove the icon graphics (we're mousing over the icon, if we've forgotten what module it was already, tooltips are the least of our problems)
1a) Removing the icons lets you reclaim all the extra space the icon is forcing you to add.
2) Create an actual tooltip window that players can move and it will remember that placement. A consistent place where info pops up is how most everything else is done.


Of course, my spring 2013 wishlist would be CCP letting us mod the UI ourselves.

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.

Crazy KSK
Tsunami Cartel
#76 - 2012-08-11 02:23:46 UTC
the power of paint
I think thats the size that it should be much less wasted space

Quote CCP Fozzie: ... The days of balance and forget are over.

Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#77 - 2012-08-11 02:25:25 UTC
One more thing. Moving the search in the market window, didn't solve a pain point.

Likewise, while these tooltips may add some utility for some users, it doesn't address a particular pain. No one needed persistent access to their ammo or module stats since those don't change very often.

Whenever you guys add in "new" functionality, please add a default option to disable it or avoid it altogether. Don't assume you know better than us how to play the game, because I can assure you, you don't.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.

Nyancat Audeles
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#78 - 2012-08-11 02:38:05 UTC
The Tooltips are perfectly fine!

I am a new player in EVE and these tooltips are so helpful! I have been playing for 2 months. I guess you could add a bit more transparency.

One thing that would be helpful is more information! Why can't I see how much my Remote Armor Repper repairs? Etc. Just work on getting more info for more modules, and turn give an option to turn the tooltips off for the people that don't like them (in the menu next to the capacitor where you can turn on numeric armor display amongst other stuff would be a convenient plac to do it).

But the tooltips serve their purpose just fine! I am a new player, and it made the game much more user friendly without dumbing it down..
Mhari Dson
Lazy Brothers Inc
#79 - 2012-08-11 04:59:49 UTC
CCP karkur wrote:
Jim Era wrote:
I refuse, saw screenshots of how clunky and huge they were, I just don't even want to deal with them (got a long skill in que I think)
*not like I am capable of doing anything in-game anyways :P

I don't mind tooltips, they are actually helpful, especially when detailed, but these were over the top, more black space than information...which the information provided wasn't that useful :/ annnnd I hate to admit it, but I hate using my Fkeys, so I frequently mouse my modules so they would pop up and confuse the hell out of me.
Couldn't the tooltip just be along the lines of the "show info' options


EDIT: I'm not mad, just offering feedback

Could you pleeeeease try them out... just for me SadBear
There is a delay now, so now you can mouse your modules, and the tooltips don't appear right away (1 second is way longer than I thought it was... when I was implementing it I actually timed it to make sure it was only a second because in my head second is so short so I wasn't sure it was doing the right thing P)


With the lackluster ui improvements and General ignoring of feedback I'm kinda glad I have another two weeks before I'm home to look at this tooltip again. Hopefully it will have reached a point by then where it is configurable and doesn't take more room than my chat.

Make it smaller, give it a configurable delay and an option to turn off. Covering all three of these would satisfy every argument I have read so far.

No apologies for the crappy typing, I'm on a !@?")'(")ing tablet that sucks.
Hannott Thanos
Squadron 15
#80 - 2012-08-11 08:35:03 UTC
Rengerel en Distel wrote:
if we've forgotten what module it was already, tooltips are the least of our problems

Made me lol. So true :P

while (CurrentSelectedTarget.Status == ShipStatus.Alive) {

     _myShip.FireAllGuns(CurrentSelectedTarget);

}