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Running WH's from an Orca. Viable?
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Captain Spyrow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-08-04 13:43:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Spyrow
So a few of my friends and I have been thinking about doing mobile ops in a WH. Basically it would be finding an unoccupied c3/c4 with a large amount of anoms, moving an Orca alt or two in, and start running sites/sucking gas until it is depleted of sites or we get bored. I assume, with the number of people that will be going/ships we can use, we can clear anywhere from 15-20 sites during our play time per day.

Is this something that would be a viable way of running them without setting a POS, or are we going to run into some larger, unforeseen problems? Would it be better just to toss a medium POS up?



Thanks in advance for the input.
Masikari
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-08-04 16:17:41 UTC
Yes, you can use an Orca. But don't count on it carry the gas from Ladar sites. The gas takes up a lot of space, unless you turn it into Fullerene's, but you need a POS for that. Sleeper sites are fine, tho.

But good luck keeping the Orca alive for an extended amount of time.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-08-04 16:25:08 UTC
Captain Spyrow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-08-04 17:29:15 UTC
Masikari wrote:
Yes, you can use an Orca. But don't count on it carry the gas from Ladar sites. The gas takes up a lot of space, unless you turn it into Fullerene's, but you need a POS for that. Sleeper sites are fine, tho.

But good luck keeping the Orca alive for an extended amount of time.




The Orcas would be cloaked up in a safe spot if/when logged in and not not being used for fitting/unfitting/changing ships.
Gudrun Ellecon
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-08-04 22:09:26 UTC
If people find you doing that, they will camp you mercilessly. Keeping it cloaked up in a safe and logging at the first sign of danger sounds like a good plan, but doing it when a small gang comes into your WH is nerve racking.

I did it for a while, works fine until people find you.
chris elliot
Treasury Department
Plug N Play
#6 - 2012-08-05 02:55:54 UTC
If you are clever your plan can be a lot of fun. Shouldn't take you more than a day or so to clear out even a full wh.
Marsan
#7 - 2012-08-05 04:06:34 UTC
Honestly this is a horrible idea your Orca is going to get ganked. You are better off setting up a large POS, and anchoring a few Shield Hardening Arrays. Taking out such a POS is annoying, and it's unlikely anyone will want to unless you flaunt your wealth or **** someone off. Not to mention it will cost 1/3-1/2 of an Orca. Sure if you buy hangers and maintaince arrays it will cost more, but you can just leave the Orca in the POS, or use cans and leave the ships hanging in inside the POS FF.

PS- Don't even bother with a small POS, and a medium POS will attract newbie gankers.

Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a grumpy small portion of the community.
Pancake King
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-08-05 06:25:40 UTC
Just try it imo. My first time in a WH was me and a buddy in a small tower and no defences. We were in that C2 for three months and one person shot at the POS once.

Granted, that's not a great set up and we were probably lucky, but it was good fun and lead us to expand the people in our WH before moving to a high class and doing it properly this time.

Don't be afraid to try it and see if it works - worst case you lose the Orca and get podded back to K-space. Then try something different.
Captain Spyrow
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-08-05 14:00:18 UTC
Marsan wrote:
Honestly this is a horrible idea your Orca is going to get ganked. You are better off setting up a large POS, and anchoring a few Shield Hardening Arrays. Taking out such a POS is annoying, and it's unlikely anyone will want to unless you flaunt your wealth or **** someone off. Not to mention it will cost 1/3-1/2 of an Orca. Sure if you buy hangers and maintaince arrays it will cost more, but you can just leave the Orca in the POS, or use cans and leave the ships hanging in inside the POS FF.

PS- Don't even bother with a small POS, and a medium POS will attract newbie gankers.



I thought about running a POS, but the task of hauling it + fuel + stront + modules sounded like a pain in the left testicle. That + fuel costs for a large Amarr tower per month runs 475m.
Irya Boone
The Scope
#10 - 2012-08-05 14:47:29 UTC
depending on what you want to in the WH somes solutions.

If you want to prod in it .. a large is a good solution but the logistic for hauling fuel and stront and bleuprints .... have to be more than 8 persons running it to enjoy the WH .

if you just want to sell raws and produce small amount of modules .. set a medium POS and just need to be 4 to enjoy it but the 4 has to have a lot of various skills , gaz harvesting, mining , and serious pve tanking for running the sleepers site solo.
and one With seriou serious skills in hauling ...

But seriously an orca ... don't do that !!

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Cu3ball
Edge of Darkness
#11 - 2012-08-05 15:51:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Cu3ball
I would suggest you and your friends try this out on test for a week or 2 first. Everything is free and other players don't shoot you. it will give you are really good idea if this will work for you and your friends. You will find out exactly how long it will take you to clear a WH. You can try C2's, C3 or C4's, just to see what fits your skill level/playing style. What to harvest gas, go ahead. It will show you the logistics of doing so. The list goes on. Learn how to run WH's without the stress of being hunted.


After 1-2 weeks, you guys will be veterans of WH living. At least as far as the game mechanics are involved. Now you need to learn how to play with others :) And that is a different story.

Just my 2 isk, hope it helps.
QT McWhiskers
MultiPass Inc.
The 5th Seal
#12 - 2012-08-06 00:42:03 UTC
This kind of tactic is one of those ideas that work best when you act in a way no one will expect. You see a cloaked orca will get Ganked eventually. Your best bet is to keep hopping safes. Once you keep moving around and never sit still, you are unkillable. Once you see combats all you have to do is keep moving and laughing in local. Works every time, every time. Guaranteed.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-08-06 01:10:47 UTC
It's a bad idea, setup a POS.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

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FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#14 - 2012-08-06 14:51:16 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Derath Ellecon wrote:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=101419&find=unread

Cool

Marsan wrote:
Honestly this is a horrible idea your Orca is going to get ganked.

Not if you scout properly and keep your orca cloaked in safe spots. Cloaked orcas are actually quite hard to find if you know what you're doing.

The trouble with a tower is your investment is quite vulnerable while you set the tower up or take it down. It also kills your mobility if you find a better system.

Here's a variation on my current orca:

[Orca, Traveler]

Warp Core Stabilizer II
Warp Core Stabilizer II

Prototype 100MN MicroWarpdrive I
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Prototype Cloaking Device I
Sisters Expanded Probe Launcher
Small Tractor Beam II

Large Ancillary Current Router I
Large Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Large Polycarbon Engine Housing I

The WCS keep you from being caught by a lone scout. It won't save you from HICs or bubbles or a large fleet, but it's worth the precaution. Some people have tried to convince me that this is a terrible idea, but I'm supported by the tears of would-be gankers. The *only* orca I ever lost in more than a year of living in w-space was when I carelessly left it sitting uncloaked near a C5 that we were closing. Everyone thought someone else had security probes out, we didn't see the new wormhole open up :(

The MWD allows your orca to make a quick warp. Decloak, give the warp command, and cycle the WMD once. With those rigs, you should warp in about 10 seconds...nowhere near enough time for probes to catch you unless they already know where to look.

Why the probe launcher? Because I can. Because putting a ship into w-space without a way to get itself out is a recipe for bad things.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Terrorfrodo
Interbus Universal
#15 - 2012-08-06 15:08:08 UTC
Use a small POS with nothing but 4-8 ECMs. Such a POS is almost worthless and if it has no hangars then would-be attacker can see right away that they won't get anything from shooting it And the jammers just make it hard enough to shoot it as to discourage really bored visitors. And you can put the whole POS into a single hauler.

At the end of the day you could even put all your loot in your ship's cargo, offline the POS and log off at safespots. If people visit during the night they just see a dead tower on d-scan and won't even look at it.

.
Maker Atavuli
Atavuli Exploration Society
#16 - 2012-08-07 14:43:40 UTC
If you really want to do this I strongly suggest you set up at least a small pos with hardeners. It will not take more than 30 miniutes to set up a small with a few hardeners and 2 days of fuel. Since you have friends to help split the start up cost of the pos and fuel. Once that is done you will use the Orca instead of a corp array and hanger, fill it up move on to the next hole. It is a nice viable option for day tripping. Just make for sure you are alone.
Fly Safe

I am NOT crazy they made me take my medication this morning!
Marsan
#17 - 2012-08-07 15:27:13 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Derath Ellecon wrote:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=101419&find=unread

Cool

Marsan wrote:
Honestly this is a horrible idea your Orca is going to get ganked.

Not if you scout properly and keep your orca cloaked in safe spots. Cloaked orcas are actually quite hard to find if you know what you're doing.

The trouble with a tower is your investment is quite vulnerable while you set the tower up or take it down. It also kills your mobility if you find a better system.


The problem is the original poster doesn't know what they are doing. A POS is fairly mobile if you don't have lot modules. Very few players new to wspace have the required paranoia, and skill to survive without a POS. Simple things like developing a proper network of safe spots don't occur to them. They are going to get sloppy and hang out by the decloaked Orca in a poor safe spot. A good scanner can use dscan to figure out good placement for his probes and get a hit on a single scan. Then it's game over. No amount of stabs will stop a group determined attackers who keep bumping you offline until the HIC lands.

Also for the guy who is saying it's 475m for fuel. Yes, but only if you don't do PI. It's pretty simple to produce fuel only importing the ice. That said personally I'm more of a fan of producing the most valuable PI I can and buying fuel blocks. If the fuel cost for a large is too much a small or medium with hardeners or ecm will also work. Just don't have obviously valuable ships floating around it 24/7. I'm always amazed by the people who leave Orcas, and Carriers floating in the POS. It's like painting a big target on yourself.

Former forum cheerleader CCP, now just a grumpy small portion of the community.
Giorgos Rbs
Lead Head Inc
#18 - 2012-08-07 21:04:54 UTC
If i were you (and as other ppl suggested) i would carry a medium pos, a couple of hardeners and few days of fuel (and nothing else for POS) inside the orca. You can setup at target system rather quickly so you have a safe return point for your fleet and a safe parking spot for the Orca if hostiles enter the system - its quite priceless. Even if they bother to shoot at the POS (which i doupt) you have bought yourselves time to plan your escape or a fight.Throwing in a few hours of stront - if you feel safer with it - will give better results IF ppl bother to attack the POS. IF is a word that gets stronger if you setup a POS in this case :P

After you are done with the system unanchor and move on. Everything is quite fast