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Outlaws in highsec? Retire the Faction Navy in Crimewatch!
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Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#61 - 2012-08-07 02:19:41 UTC
I really think ccp should do this, it would bring back some morelife to eve, it would bring more action to high sec, people might intentionally become -10 just to get some action in high sec... only downside I can see is if someone accidentally attacked one of these -10 in their mission :) but I hope that would happen

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
Shukuzen Kiraa
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#62 - 2012-08-07 02:56:25 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Why do we need Faction Navy attacking outlaws? Serious question.

I'm hoping their removal is being considered for Crimewatch - placing security in the hands of the players, not automated scripts. Could have sworn I'd heard something about this mentioned, once - but its still vaporware at this point.
So far, most of it has been laughably bad, like Concord protected neutral RR and gate guns killing can flippers.

One thing I've never really understood is why it is necessary for NPC Navy to attack, when outlaws already have no protection from Concord....

A typical situation in highsec:

1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.
2. Miner gets mad, and hops in a Drake, and starts calling out the ganker.
3. Now...as much as I'd LOVE to deprive the angry miner of his failfit Drake....its not really possible to fight him because of Faction Navy interfering with the fight.

So, why is 'Concord's re-tarded half-brother' - the Navy needed?

-Concord already whacks you if you do anything aggressive, outlaw or not.
-ANY player is allowed to attack and pod you at any time....which means the fight will always be initiated by the 'good player'.
-The 'good player' can easily recruit more help...
-and last, currently the Faction Navy is completely incapable of stopping suicide ganks in highsec anyway.

Why is it necessary to make legit fights between pirates and high-sec 'vigilantes' mostly impossible?
Why do faction navy ships need to put their thumb on the scale?

Why NOT let -10 players 'move' through highsec, going about their business and/or trolling for fights with random players?

It creates no additional disadvantage for highsec players who wish to remain 'non-interactive' and it provides amble opportunities for budding 'vigilantes' to take a shot at PVP - without leaving the safety of highsec!
Its a risky endeavor for the outlaw, as they can move in highsec - but could easily be overwhelmed by high-sec players looking for a pirate killmail....

'Game lore arguments' and pointless real life comparisons need not apply.

If 'Crimewatch' is supposed to be about putting high-sec security into player hands - why not nerf the Navy?
Or is 'Crimewatch' merely going to be one more excuse to make highsec even safer, and further segregate the player base?


Why call it HIGH SECURITY space with no security force? Stop looking for PVP against people who 1. Are not looking for pvp, and 2. People you know you probably have an advantage over. You do nothing but complain and want the easiest targets possible. You are the worst type of person on EVE. Suicide ganking is fine, pirating is fine...but stop praying on the weak and then whining when you can't do it with even less effort.
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#63 - 2012-08-07 06:30:44 UTC
Shukuzen Kiraa wrote:


Why call it HIGH SECURITY space with no security force? Stop looking for PVP against people who 1. Are not looking for pvp, and 2. People you know you probably have an advantage over. You do nothing but complain and want the easiest targets possible. You are the worst type of person on EVE. Suicide ganking is fine, pirating is fine...but stop praying on the weak and then whining when you can't do it with even less effort.


Wow, really? CONCORD is not a security force? Damn, that was easy.

1. If they aren't looking for PVP, they don't have to shoot at a red player.
2. Explain how you have an advantage....if you can't initiate a fight. If someone does attack you are on your own..and THEY can have unlimited help?
3. 'Preying on the weak?' Allowing anyone in highsec to attack you without NPC's piling on - thats 'preying on the weak?'

Are you just mad because the barge buff was rolled back, just a bit?
rodyas
Tie Fighters Inc
#64 - 2012-08-07 09:43:02 UTC
Well not only is it hi sec. But is also the home for all the races that live in EVE. It would be annoying for a -10 pilot to fly around your home all the time. Probably why the navy attacks ya. You are being annoying in their home.

Signature removed for inappropriate language - CCP Eterne
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#65 - 2012-08-07 09:52:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Eugene Kerner
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Why do we need Faction Navy attacking outlaws? Serious question.


They in fact of use when they web a Dominix at a gate to get in warp faster.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
pussnheels
Viziam
#66 - 2012-08-07 10:27:00 UTC  |  Edited by: pussnheels
Think OP should remember this is not HIS game , and that hje is only a small but loud minority
in his selfish arrogance he believes it is his divine right to demand that CCP should tailor this game to his views and his need to grief others alone

The OP should also remember that there are plenty of arcade game , yes even online, where he can go and kill , burn , plunder as much and without restrictions

The OP should remember that he is not playing this game alone and has no right to insult other players like he did in a previous thread , they will only treat him the same like he treat others

Or is it that the OP finds the game too difficult for his liking

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
TheSkeptic
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#67 - 2012-08-07 10:37:30 UTC
OP just wants to do away with having to use an alt & eject/board for his hi-sec ganks

Also probably wants to be able to sit at an offgrid bounce on hi-sec gates, scanning with 1 char at the other gate, then warping down to dest gate in time to suicide on the auto pilot-er. Also allowing him to use the -10 char for AP indy ganks. (while possible now the timing is much more difficult)

...

Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#68 - 2012-08-07 10:38:35 UTC
pussnheels wrote:
Or is it that the OP finds the game too difficult for his liking


lmao

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#69 - 2012-08-07 10:41:53 UTC
I think CONCORD or Navy should pod outlaws in hisec.

Naturally rats should pod in L4s as well.

.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#70 - 2012-08-07 10:44:53 UTC
pussnheels wrote:
in his selfish arrogance he believes it is his divine right to demand that CCP should tailor this game to his views
So you agree, then, that things like the barge buff and this idea of broken gate guns in lowsec is detrimental to the game…?
Cadfael Maelgwyn
Doomheim
#71 - 2012-08-07 10:49:19 UTC
Red pirates in hisec should spawn NPC pirate ships as strong as CONCORD of the faction of their choice when fired upon, which then engage all Navy, CONCORD and player ships in the area.

Both SuperPirate and CONCORD ships will not stop spawning until all player ships on grid are dead or have fled.
Garven Dreis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#72 - 2012-08-07 10:49:38 UTC
pussnheels wrote:
Think OP should remember this is not HIS game , and that hje is only a small but loud minority


Also please remember it is also not YOUR game, so please refrain from defecating all over the very valid and fun play style of a pirate and or suicide ganker.

Something about miners and selfish arrogance as well.

Terrible Poster Runner-up 2014
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2012-08-07 11:18:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Oh it's great to see so many valid opinions of people having actual experience..... NOT !

It's a bad idea. I can tell, i'm the resident outlaw of hek.


First of all ... most people in highsec are cowards.

They rely on the faction police to kill me when they manage to point me
and then they run away, because i can come back and kick their candy asses.

They never grab a can if i offer it to them ... because they don't want to fight ...
they want easy kills to brag about, ignoring the lack of actual achievement.

Some manage to kill me and run away as soon as i come back in a new ship,
giving them a fight they can't even win, because i'm actually hard to catch ... (Guerilla tactics and grid-fu ftw !)
unless i **** up or the person has actual skills.

Rarely somebody actually dares to fight. To hunt me. To catch me.
These are the brave warriors ... and they are *very* rare ! (Hi Glauqolc o/)


Removing the faction police would only lead to the cowards not even TRYING to get me.


Without the faction police, being in highsec would be much less a challenge than it is now.
Boring ****. Why do i live in highsec and not lowsec ? Because lowsec is boring as hell.

I can't cloak as -10.
No tracking links.
No remote sebos.
No shield/armor reppers.
Faction police on my ass all day.
FFA for those who dare.


There are quite a few reasons why there aren't more outlaws living in highsec, like i do.

One of them ... and that's the biggest ... is that most people have no actual clue about the game mechanics involved.

It's not impossible to fly around in highsec. It's not impossible to fight in highsec.
It's quite a bit of work ... but it's great to do and have the faction police on my ass.

Zooming around in a 5kmsec vigil ... check. Works up to 0.7sec systems.
Fighting people in thrashers ... check.
Fighting people in cruisers ... check.
Fighting people in b/c ... with istabs ... check.
Fighting people in tier3 b/c ... with istabs ... check.
Fighting people in battleships ... well ... still have to try that one out. :)


I'd actually prefer if the spawntime would be REDUCED, so they engage EARLIER,
but instead got ECM removed, because THAT's the REAL problem !

If you, OP, had any actual clue about how it is to live as -10 in highsec ... not using a stupid, cowardish alt,
but your main ... the only char you got ... no help ... and not hiding in station,
but actually PARTICIPATING, INTERACTING with people, you'd know that the
only real problem regarding the faction police is the ECM they use and thus make
defense very hard and sometimes even impossible, if an outlaw sits too long on one spot
shooting somebody.

More than once i've tried killing an aggressor and got soo close, but then i've got jammed !


Most of you have *no* experience and shouldn't have any say on this at all !


Edit: Hey, actually i'm not done yet.

I'm all for the future CrimeWatch changes, btw !
It would remove sooo many cowards of the game, it would make the whole game actually BETTER !

Too scared to be FFA ? Too afraid of shooting an outlaw ?
Too afraid to grab from a can ?

Well ... then gtfo, noob !
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#74 - 2012-08-07 12:48:17 UTC
i couldn't care less about ganing miners, gankers and outlaws.....

However i would agree with Herr Wilkus about his idea. I don't see any problems for anyone

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Shukuzen Kiraa
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#75 - 2012-08-07 13:55:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Shukuzen Kiraa
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Shukuzen Kiraa wrote:


Why call it HIGH SECURITY space with no security force? Stop looking for PVP against people who 1. Are not looking for pvp, and 2. People you know you probably have an advantage over. You do nothing but complain and want the easiest targets possible. You are the worst type of person on EVE. Suicide ganking is fine, pirating is fine...but stop praying on the weak and then whining when you can't do it with even less effort.


Wow, really? CONCORD is not a security force? Damn, that was easy.

1. If they aren't looking for PVP, they don't have to shoot at a red player.
2. Explain how you have an advantage....if you can't initiate a fight. If someone does attack you are on your own..and THEY can have unlimited help?
3. 'Preying on the weak?' Allowing anyone in highsec to attack you without NPC's piling on - thats 'preying on the weak?'

Are you just mad because the barge buff was rolled back, just a bit?



I am not a miner...

But back to the original topic, outlaws being allowed in high sec gives less reason for some of us to go looking to kill pirates in low sec. Why take away yet another reason to go there? I actually will admit I did not think of it before but since you can't RR an outlaw without being concorded...your idea actually does sound more appealing letting the players police their own space. Though I think it will make low sec even more empty than it is now.
I wan't Navy Ships removed, but for Faction Warfare in high sec.

Only problem is, people like you who are obsessed with killing easy prey (miners) are only going to have an easier time doing it if you were allowed to roam freely through high sec. Easier time finding your targets, and if you're already -10 you have nothing to lose. There would need to be some security NPC's in 1.0 space to protect rookies from outlaws. Because they will shoot at you not knowing what they are getting in to, and would end up possibly driving players who just started away.
Gabrielle Lamb
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#76 - 2012-08-07 14:20:31 UTC
If this was implented everyone and their mothers would have a -10 sitting around ready to gank whoever annoys them the least. It would basically triple the suicide ganking activities in highsec which are already pretty rampant.

And don't give me that "0.0" bullshit, 0.0 in Sovereign territory or a low population system is generally a lot safer then highsec. Because in highsec, when you're ganked it's one out of 50 other people in same system jumping straight in to zero on you. In 0.0 you pretty much know if somebody else enters system not from your alliance you need to bugger off to safespot or fight them.

Comparing highsec to 0.0 is borderline comparing awoxing to normal PVP. We all know what scores the easier kills.
Hammer Borne
Doomheim
#77 - 2012-08-07 14:49:41 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
...snip...


Prime example of the terrible community right there in Solstice Project's post. This is, in fact, one of the things that keeps me from engaging in even more pvp than I do. When someone obliterates my ship and I hit them with a "Whoah, nice fight!" I am often greeted with terrible attitude like the above quoted trash.

This removes the fun of a good bout of pvp or the surprise of a well-planned gank.

No wonder why I hear so many people speak ill of "pvpers" as a group. I really hate being associated with them too.
pussnheels
Viziam
#78 - 2012-08-07 15:42:12 UTC  |  Edited by: pussnheels
imagine Osama Bin laden alive today and walking down Time Square New York today

Complaining about how everybody who he meets there wants to kill him and demanding they should stop ttrying to kill him so he can plan his next vile terrorist attack in peace and unmolested

that is what the OP is demanding

If you allow to let your securityrating drop to *-10 fine that is your choice
if you can't be bother to repair that rating ; again fine that is your choice

BUT DO NOT COME COMPLAINING THAT YOU DO NOT LIKE THE CONSEQUINCES OF YOUR OWN ACTIONS

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Benjamin Eastwood
#79 - 2012-08-07 15:52:19 UTC
I believe you are confusing high sec with null sec. Remember, null sec is where you are the police. High sec is where leet pirate blobs get nuked by concord and the navies.

"Endless ISK, the sinews of war"
Benjamin Eastwood
#80 - 2012-08-07 15:54:54 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
Oh it's great to see so many valid opinions of people having actual experience..... NOT !

It's a bad idea. I can tell, i'm the resident outlaw of hek.


First of all ... most people in highsec are cowards.

They rely on the faction police to kill me when they manage to point me
and then they run away, because i can come back and kick their candy asses.

They never grab a can if i offer it to them ... because they don't want to fight ...
they want easy kills to brag about, ignoring the lack of actual achievement.

Some manage to kill me and run away as soon as i come back in a new ship,
giving them a fight they can't even win, because i'm actually hard to catch ... (Guerilla tactics and grid-fu ftw !)
unless i **** up or the person has actual skills.

Rarely somebody actually dares to fight. To hunt me. To catch me.
These are the brave warriors ... and they are *very* rare ! (Hi Glauqolc o/)


Removing the faction police would only lead to the cowards not even TRYING to get me.


Without the faction police, being in highsec would be much less a challenge than it is now.
Boring ****. Why do i live in highsec and not lowsec ? Because lowsec is boring as hell.

I can't cloak as -10.
No tracking links.
No remote sebos.
No shield/armor reppers.
Faction police on my ass all day.
FFA for those who dare.


There are quite a few reasons why there aren't more outlaws living in highsec, like i do.

One of them ... and that's the biggest ... is that most people have no actual clue about the game mechanics involved.

It's not impossible to fly around in highsec. It's not impossible to fight in highsec.
It's quite a bit of work ... but it's great to do and have the faction police on my ass.

Zooming around in a 5kmsec vigil ... check. Works up to 0.7sec systems.
Fighting people in thrashers ... check.
Fighting people in cruisers ... check.
Fighting people in b/c ... with istabs ... check.
Fighting people in tier3 b/c ... with istabs ... check.
Fighting people in battleships ... well ... still have to try that one out. :)


I'd actually prefer if the spawntime would be REDUCED, so they engage EARLIER,
but instead got ECM removed, because THAT's the REAL problem !

If you, OP, had any actual clue about how it is to live as -10 in highsec ... not using a stupid, cowardish alt,
but your main ... the only char you got ... no help ... and not hiding in station,
but actually PARTICIPATING, INTERACTING with people, you'd know that the
only real problem regarding the faction police is the ECM they use and thus make
defense very hard and sometimes even impossible, if an outlaw sits too long on one spot
shooting somebody.

More than once i've tried killing an aggressor and got soo close, but then i've got jammed !


Most of you have *no* experience and shouldn't have any say on this at all !


Edit: Hey, actually i'm not done yet.

I'm all for the future CrimeWatch changes, btw !
It would remove sooo many cowards of the game, it would make the whole game actually BETTER !

Too scared to be FFA ? Too afraid of shooting an outlaw ?
Too afraid to grab from a can ?

Well ... then gtfo, noob !



You complain because people know that you're a worthless griefer who's only interested in an easy kill?

Wow.

"Endless ISK, the sinews of war"