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Outlaws in highsec? Retire the Faction Navy in Crimewatch!
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Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#21 - 2012-08-06 21:10:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Epeen
Herr Wilkus wrote:

A typical situation in highsec:

1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.


Well there is the real problem. Bad game mechanics.

You should be pod nuked as soon as you cross in to 0.5 space.

Mr Epeen Cool
Metal Icarus
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#22 - 2012-08-06 21:14:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Metal Icarus
retire the faction navy and make it so that +sec players can engage -5.0 and lower sec players at will. Pods too.

High sec is for high security ppls.

I want to see anti pirate corporations using remote sensor boosting intys/lach/arazus to catch pirate pods and shuttles.

EDIT: They deserve the treatment they need.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#23 - 2012-08-06 21:15:30 UTC
"abloobloobloo there's no risk in suicide ganking despite it being literally the only risk left to anyone in hisec outside of getting popped by rats"

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2012-08-06 21:16:37 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
"getting popped by rats"


I know we have people losing carriers to rats out in Deklein, but highsec how do you lose even a shitfit ship to highsec rats?

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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2012-08-06 21:18:08 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
"getting popped by rats"


I know we have people losing carriers to rats out in Deklein, but highsec how do you lose even a shitfit ship to highsec rats?


by virtue of being absolutely terrible

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-08-06 21:19:04 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
"getting popped by rats"


I know we have people losing carriers to rats out in Deklein, but highsec how do you lose even a shitfit ship to highsec rats?


by virtue of being absolutely terrible


Don't we hold the crown for that?

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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#27 - 2012-08-06 21:20:19 UTC
La Nariz wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
La Nariz wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
"getting popped by rats"


I know we have people losing carriers to rats out in Deklein, but highsec how do you lose even a shitfit ship to highsec rats?


by virtue of being absolutely terrible


Don't we hold the crown for that?


considering that we don't get many dudes showing up to fleet in armor tanked laser rokhs, no

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Arrs Grazznic
Poena Executive Solutions
#28 - 2012-08-06 21:24:29 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.

Have to admit this is the bit I'm confused about -- should a -10 sec status pilot be allowed enough time in high sec to board a ship and blow something up?
Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-08-06 21:24:34 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Why do we need Faction Navy attacking outlaws? Serious question.

I'm hoping their removal is being considered for Crimewatch - placing security in the hands of the players, not automated scripts. Could have sworn I'd heard something about this mentioned, once - but its still vaporware at this point.
So far, most of it has been laughably bad, like Concord protected neutral RR and gate guns killing can flippers.

One thing I've never really understood is why it is necessary for NPC Navy to attack, when outlaws already have no protection from Concord....

A typical situation in highsec:

1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.
2. Miner gets mad, and hops in a Drake, and starts calling out the ganker.
3. Now...as much as I'd LOVE to deprive the angry miner of his failfit Drake....its not really possible to fight him because of Faction Navy interfering with the fight.

So, why is 'Concord's re-tarded half-brother' - the Navy needed?

-Concord already whacks you if you do anything aggressive, outlaw or not.
-ANY player is allowed to attack and pod you at any time....which means the fight will always be initiated by the 'good player'.
-The 'good player' can easily recruit more help...
-and last, currently the Faction Navy is completely incapable of stopping suicide ganks in highsec anyway.

Why is it necessary to make legit fights between pirates and high-sec 'vigilantes' mostly impossible?
Why do faction navy ships need to put their thumb on the scale?

Why NOT let -10 players 'move' through highsec, going about their business and/or trolling for fights with random players?

It creates no additional disadvantage for highsec players who wish to remain 'non-interactive' and it provides amble opportunities for budding 'vigilantes' to take a shot at PVP - without leaving the safety of highsec!
Its a risky endeavor for the outlaw, as they can move in highsec - but could easily be overwhelmed by high-sec players looking for a pirate killmail....

'Game lore arguments' and pointless real life comparisons need not apply.

If 'Crimewatch' is supposed to be about putting high-sec security into player hands - why not nerf the Navy?
Or is 'Crimewatch' merely going to be one more excuse to make highsec even safer, and further segregate the player base?


Translation: Derpity derp derp? Sniffity sniffety derp! Sniffy derpy sniffle sniffle.....

I sure wish general discussion would get rid of these "avatar above me" threads, so that we can have more room for cries from The Herr.
Johan Civire
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#30 - 2012-08-06 21:25:04 UTC
Pankas Carter wrote:
Perhaps you should go fight someone willing to fight, instead of inciting people who were minding their own business?


i almost pissed my self laughing at this post /trolling or what Lol
Thor Kerrigan
Guardians of Asceticism
#31 - 2012-08-06 21:30:33 UTC
This is equivalent to the "infinite allies possibility if wardecced" while the pirate can never get any outside help other than off-grid boosting.

CONCORD will still annihilate any criminal who shoots first, or assists a red flashy player.

Why carebears say this can't work because they are too incompetent is beyond me, however. Stop being so incompetent much, I dunno?
Karl Hobb
Imperial Margarine
#32 - 2012-08-06 21:39:52 UTC
This is actually a pretty good idea. Since neutral RR is on its way out and we're on our way to a new (terrible) Crimewatch system, there's no reason why vigilantes or bounty hunters can't get a break. Right now criminals in high-sec won't loiter around because of the faction police, this would give them the oppotunity to do so.

A professional astro-bastard was not available so they sent me.
Garreth Vlox
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#33 - 2012-08-06 21:40:58 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Why do we need Faction Navy attacking outlaws? Serious question.

I'm hoping their removal is being considered for Crimewatch - placing security in the hands of the players, not automated scripts. Could have sworn I'd heard something about this mentioned, once - but its still vaporware at this point.
So far, most of it has been laughably bad, like Concord protected neutral RR and gate guns killing can flippers.

One thing I've never really understood is why it is necessary for NPC Navy to attack, when outlaws already have no protection from Concord....

A typical situation in highsec:

1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.
2. Miner gets mad, and hops in a Drake, and starts calling out the ganker.
3. Now...as much as I'd LOVE to deprive the angry miner of his failfit Drake....its not really possible to fight him because of Faction Navy interfering with the fight.

So, why is 'Concord's re-tarded half-brother' - the Navy needed?

-Concord already whacks you if you do anything aggressive, outlaw or not.
-ANY player is allowed to attack and pod you at any time....which means the fight will always be initiated by the 'good player'.
-The 'good player' can easily recruit more help...
-and last, currently the Faction Navy is completely incapable of stopping suicide ganks in highsec anyway.

Why is it necessary to make legit fights between pirates and high-sec 'vigilantes' mostly impossible?
Why do faction navy ships need to put their thumb on the scale?

Why NOT let -10 players 'move' through highsec, going about their business and/or trolling for fights with random players?

It creates no additional disadvantage for highsec players who wish to remain 'non-interactive' and it provides amble opportunities for budding 'vigilantes' to take a shot at PVP - without leaving the safety of highsec!
Its a risky endeavor for the outlaw, as they can move in highsec - but could easily be overwhelmed by high-sec players looking for a pirate killmail....

'Game lore arguments' and pointless real life comparisons need not apply.

If 'Crimewatch' is supposed to be about putting high-sec security into player hands - why not nerf the Navy?
Or is 'Crimewatch' merely going to be one more excuse to make highsec even safer, and further segregate the player base?


This idea is AWESOME and will NEVER happen cause if it did the care bears would rage like the player base did over incarna.

The LULZ Boat.
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#34 - 2012-08-06 21:49:38 UTC
Wow. So gratifying to have my fan club of trolls.

I'm not really seeing a whole lot of argument against my position, however.

A lot of judgement. Yeah, sure I'm a dirty miner ganker - but plenty of people get ridiculously low sec status simply from fighting skirmishes in low-sec.

Hey, I could be wrong - there could be something really gamebreaking that would occur if the Faction Navy suddenly went away, but I'm not seeing it in these troll-posts.

And I'm trying to come up with a game breaking situation.

Pirate fleet, complete with RR and max skills, 25 or 30 of them.
They go take up positions outside Jita 4-4. Then what? What is the worst they could do?

They sit there until they get picked apart by other players or another fleet shows up?
Play station games? So what? Doesn't hurt anyone.
Suicide Gank someone? They can do that already, with or without the Navy.

My point stands:
If the highsec players want to be left alone, they just 'ignore the red guys' and go about their business.
If they want to fight - they fight on their terms.

I don't see where high-sec players 'lose' on this one. Paint me a picture.

Only thing I can possibly think of is needing them to enforce FW battlelines in highsec.....but that has nothing to do with 'outlaw' status....

Perhaps some actual -10 pirates can enlighten me why this would be a bad idea, rather than just carebear miner trolls?
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#35 - 2012-08-06 21:53:28 UTC
Arrs Grazznic wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:
1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.

Have to admit this is the bit I'm confused about -- should a -10 sec status pilot be allowed enough time in high sec to board a ship and blow something up?


If you eliminate the predators, the prey population will expand until it dies from starvation. Sad but true.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2012-08-06 21:55:24 UTC
Arrs Grazznic wrote:
Have to admit this is the bit I'm confused about -- should a -10 sec status pilot be allowed enough time in high sec to board a ship and blow something up?


you realize that a -10 character in hisec has to be /quick/ before it gets tackled by the cops and blown up, right?

it's not like they're ganking under a GCC

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Garreth Vlox
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2012-08-06 21:57:05 UTC
Arrs Grazznic wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:
1. My -10 suicide ganker alt blows up a Hulk.

Have to admit this is the bit I'm confused about -- should a -10 sec status pilot be allowed enough time in high sec to board a ship and blow something up?

You can still dock and last I checked you can not be concorded while docked and while docked you can switch ships.

The LULZ Boat.
King Rothgar
Deadly Solutions
#38 - 2012-08-06 22:01:27 UTC
8/10, please continue.Cool

[u]Fireworks and snowballs are great, but what I really want is a corpse launcher.[/u]
Fairren
HellrisCorp
#39 - 2012-08-06 22:02:23 UTC
yes
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#40 - 2012-08-06 22:15:09 UTC
I like this idea... maybe keep the empire navy's in 0.9 and 1.0 space though, for ambiance/storyline as well as for the kids. Other than that I think players should be enforcing the laws wherever possible.

Big smile

Signatures should be used responsibly...