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high sec ice ?

First post
Author
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#41 - 2011-10-11 23:23:17 UTC
if ice was moved to 0.0 only that'd be pretty rad we could hire worthless pubbies to mine then whip them when they don't make quota

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.

The Apostle
Doomheim
#42 - 2011-10-11 23:25:12 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
The Apostle wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
and like 95% of highsec ice miners are bots

Not sure where the number comes from but seems fair , but how much of that is to fuel 0.0 and how much fuels highsec POS's... Who actually needs the yardstick taken to them? Highsec bears or 0.0 alliances?


I have no idea how I'd go about determining who owns a bot, but I do know that if you wanted to bot and had access to 0.0 you'd make much more money running a ratting bot or something else a lot more profitable. 0.0 buys its fuel in jita, and does not mine ice: it's far better to rat for ten minutes and purchase ice with isk than mine for an hour.

'Tis true but in some aspects you could be inadvertently assisting ice bots. If the price continues to climb you make the "risk v reward" argument a fait accompli.

Ice bots are simply a lazy option to either 1) make "passive" isk while you sleep or 2) fuel massive 0.0 logistics.

Both need a stick taken to them no doubt but you are making ice botting more attractive, not less.

The GSF campaign would have to last for so long, and be so concerted that the "Knight in Shining Armor" rhetoric will get very thin, very fast to a large number of your pilots.

Taking ice out of highsec would accomplish all of these objectives and much, much more.

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]

The Apostle
Doomheim
#43 - 2011-10-11 23:28:22 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
if ice was moved to 0.0 only that'd be pretty rad we could hire worthless pubbies to mine then whip them when they don't make quota

Where do I sign? I know for a fact that the whole DekCo network needs a LOT of ice. I could pretty well charge you whatever I damn well pleased P

And I like being whipped..... Is that a bonus?

TL;DR Sharpen up the Mack Axe boys..... Time to go get a slice of those Alliance funds...

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]

Name Family Name
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#44 - 2011-10-11 23:30:49 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
of course, right now gallente ice fields are mostly bot-free as those have been driven out, but if you were to take a stack of brutixes to some other ice space and proceeded to announce in local who you were going to gank, orbiting them in a blockade runner at 500m, then ganking them, then repeating the process for hours on end the only people warping out would be the people without an orca bot who are warping to station (who will come right back)



Lol - I don't care as I haven't ice mined in years, but the whole point in ice mining as a human was having a couple of minimized clients running whilst playing something else.

Gank them all the way - ice mining in hgh sec is a terrible mechanic, but having a bot Ice mining in high sec is a waste of CPU.
Name Family Name
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#45 - 2011-10-11 23:32:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Name Family Name
DP
Tore Vest
#46 - 2011-10-11 23:33:10 UTC
We are not going to need ice so mutch longer.
Only poses and some lone jumpfreigther i guess.
0.0 can have icebelts... i dont care

No troll.

Carceret Rinah
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2011-10-12 01:07:12 UTC
Andre Jean Sarpantis wrote:
Jooce McNasty wrote:
If its not do you really want to keep mining it in highsec while the Goons are on their current campaign? I support them in what they are doing but I do not know how long this will last and how wide spread it will get.

It would be cool to see them keep this campaign going for a year or more, especially if they are willing on spending the isk to keep the hulks dying.



You really have no clue what you're talking about HUH?......If they remove all curenntly in hisec located ice into lowsec and 0.0 you can expect the market break through the roof and then collapse in a big bang followed by hundreds of hisec players leaving the game if not thousands of them.....if ice can't get mined anymore in hisec and keep the price in a somwhat tolerable and affordable range most the hisec POSes in hisec and also lowsec will get removed and construction research and much other stuff will come to a nearly complete halt.

Simply due to the fact Hisec research facilitys will get swamped and blocked more for months from a few keeping their jobs within the queue while the rest can suffer their soon forseeable financial dead.

If you really want this happen...or talking about the remove without having a idea what the consequences will be of this totally unneeded move you better should stay quite and go in a corner and get ashamed by your incompetence.


I suggest adapting. Raise your prices to make up for the rising cost of fuel. If that's not possible, and nullsec industrialists destroy highsec research and industry... join a nullsec corp and do it there.

Otherwise start talking with people about maybe fighting back. Start securing those ice ops.
Russell Casey
Doomheim
#48 - 2011-10-12 02:45:40 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
if ice was moved to 0.0 only that'd be pretty rad we could hire worthless pubbies to mine then whip them when they don't make quota


Sad thing is, it would work or I should say, does work....Roll
Mortis vonShadow
Balanaz Mining and Development Inc.
#49 - 2011-10-12 03:25:35 UTC
As an Empire miner (Veldspar, Scordite, Pyroxeres, Kernite) I make approx 50-60mil a day. Yes, I sit for 4-5hours in front of my pc listening to the hum of the strip miners. I currently have two toons, one is industry and one is combat (pvp/pve).

Sometimes I buy two PLEX to pay for my time, others, I pay good ol' fashion American $$. With two accounts at 14.95ea. and a $2.00 forgien transaction fee as well, I pay roughly $37 a month to play EVE. And I'm happy to do it, too. My wife, not so much.

Even with all the screaming and hollering about how broken the game is with nullsec sov mechanics or with the supercap issues, or even with the Goons trying to corner the blue ice market. I love this game. I love the community of it. For better or worse, I will always be here to play.

What does concern me, tho, is all this talk about real money transfers and bots. I don't pretend to know if those out in nullsec do use bots. I don't pretend to know that the Goons are the biggest user of bot programs. But, what I do know is that CCP has started a player driven organization called the Council of Stellar Management. The CSM was started as a way for the players to voice their concerns with CCP about game related issues. If the CSM is comprised mainly of players from the Goons, and the Goons are one of the largest, if not the defacto largest player base in the game, then its not hard to come to a conclusion that somewhere along the way the CSM has lost the voice of the players, and become the voice of the Goons.

On any other subject I wouldn't care less if the entire CSM was comprised of all Goons. But, with all this talk of moving more mining related stuff out of Empire space to nullsec, where the Goons control most of it anyways, then we are just putting more ISK into the Goons wallets. By itself, its nothing, and I could give two ***** about it. But, with all this talk about RMT's taking place out in nullsec, and CCP wanting to put more ISK into the Goons hands, or any other large alliance out in nullsec (Sorry Goonies, I'm just using you guys as an example), I have to begin to wonder if some sort of duplicity, whether intentional or not, on CCP's part isn't taking place.

If CCP is oblivious to the fact that quite possibly they are being taken advantage of for RMT's, then the best solution for them, so there is no question in anyones mind, is to immediately do away with botting. I know they can trace their own clients from their servers, so its not an unrealistic ability. However, if they are complicit in their dealings with the Goons, or any other large alliance out in nullsec, who are using bots for the sole purpose of RMT's and if they are in some fashion getting returns for this, then this is nothing more than perpatrating fraud on the player base, which is against the law, everywhere in the world, except for Somalia.

I'm not accusing anyone of botting, and I'm definately not accusing anyone of RMT's or CCP's hand in any of it. I'm just drawing a possible conclusion based on what I've read in the last two weeks here on the forums and in the blogs by the Devs about moving mining related stuff out of Empire to nullsec.

I love my sandbox, and I love the other kids that play in it. Goons too. They add a spice to the game that you can't find anywhere else. But, it scares the hell out of me that quite possibly CCP is being taken advantage of all in the name of "better game mechanics".

You may commence flamming this post now. Enjoy. I know I'm going to.

Some days you're the bug, and some days your the windscreen.                   And some days, you're just a man with a gun.

Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#50 - 2011-10-12 03:32:31 UTC
That's a whole lot of :words: to say "Wahhhh the Goons are running my game!!!"

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Sri Nova
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2011-10-12 03:33:14 UTC
throwing out the old roid system and implementing a new roid system would be ideal .

make the belts true belts they actually form rings around the stars moons and planets.

remove the way points to belts . either use the current probing system to find roids or put that roid scanner to some actual use.

then to to top it all off increase the number of roids in these belts several fold . reduce the respawn to once a week .

and then to add a lil flavor scatter some hard to find junk around certain celestials nothing major and nothing to get rich by . but just enough to tantalize .
The Apostle
Doomheim
#52 - 2011-10-12 03:39:04 UTC
Ladie Harlot wrote:
That's a whole lot of :words: to say "Wahhhh the Goons are ruining my game!!!"

Fixed it for ya.

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]

Circumstantial Evidence
#53 - 2011-10-12 04:07:07 UTC
CCP Greyscale - 2011.08.19 13:55:00 wrote:
for anyone who's not following we're leaning towards just making ice in empire non-infinite rather than removing it

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1565827&page=10#291
The Apostle
Doomheim
#54 - 2011-10-12 04:16:53 UTC
Circumstantial Evidence wrote:
CCP Greyscale - 2011.08.19 13:55:00 wrote:
for anyone who's not following we're leaning towards just making ice in empire non-infinite rather than removing it

http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1565827&page=10#291

Evidence of their intent? All circumstantial at best.

[i]Take an aspirin. If pain persists consult your local priest. WTB: An Austrian kangaroo![/i]

Terminal Entry
New Fnord Industries
#55 - 2011-10-12 06:10:36 UTC
Just remove all Ice from the game and have POSes powered from a reactor, just like the capacitor is in ships.

The less 'Logistics-Online' the better.

Oswald Patsee
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#56 - 2011-10-12 06:49:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Oswald Patsee
^ This.

Ok, so lets see...

- CCP is lookibng at rebalancing hisec ice in the interests of improving nullsec "risk v reward"

- Hisec ice is the least profitable thing anyone can mine.

- CCP wants to limit something that is worth basically nothing in hisec to help nullsec?

I'm not seeing the logic here. Unless, of course, this is about choking off the supply of Blue Ice so nullsec alliances can fight over the one in game resource we all need for capship blobfests. Ok, so lets get rid of any need for blue ice in hisec.

Hate to say it, but this is self serving sh*t. Yet another reason why a lot of players choose to stay out of nullspace and stay in hisec - They'd rather get treated like crap on their own terms than ours. Leave them and their ice alone. They don't really change the nullsec game, and nullsec doesn't need to change theirs.

And yes. This is an alt. Obvious.
Thorn Galen
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#57 - 2011-10-12 07:14:37 UTC
Mortis vonShadow wrote:
As an Empire miner (Veldspar, Scordite, Pyroxeres, Kernite) I make approx 50-60mil a day. Yes, I sit for 4-5hours in front of my pc listening to the hum of the strip miners. I currently have two toons, one is industry and one is combat (pvp/pve). etc etc etc


I'm not going to repost a large amount of text.

All I would like to say is - Well written Sir, very well said indeed. It worries me too and one certainly hopes that CCP is fully aware of the RMT going on.

Cheers.
Ladie Harlot
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#58 - 2011-10-12 08:12:45 UTC
Thorn Galen wrote:
Mortis vonShadow wrote:
As an Empire miner (Veldspar, Scordite, Pyroxeres, Kernite) I make approx 50-60mil a day. Yes, I sit for 4-5hours in front of my pc listening to the hum of the strip miners. I currently have two toons, one is industry and one is combat (pvp/pve). etc etc etc


I'm not going to repost a large amount of text.

All I would like to say is - Well written Sir, very well said indeed. It worries me too and one certainly hopes that CCP is fully aware of the RMT going on.

Cheers.

That was a horrible, horrible post. Don't encourage him.

The artist formerly known as Ladie Scarlet.

Herold Oldtimer
State War Academy
Caldari State
#59 - 2011-10-12 09:16:24 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
if ice was moved to 0.0 only that'd be pretty rad we could hire worthless pubbies to mine then whip them when they don't make quota


Won't this contradict with your NBSI policy?

Or do you plan to start liking worthless pubbies now.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#60 - 2011-10-12 09:38:58 UTC
Mortis vonShadow wrote:
As an Empire miner (Veldspar, Scordite, Pyroxeres, Kernite) I make approx 50-60mil a day. Yes, I sit for 4-5hours in front of my pc listening to the hum of the strip miners. I currently have two toons, one is industry and one is combat (pvp/pve).

Sometimes I buy two PLEX to pay for my time, others, I pay good ol' fashion American $$. With two accounts at 14.95ea. and a $2.00 forgien transaction fee as well, I pay roughly $37 a month to play EVE. And I'm happy to do it, too. My wife, not so much.

Even with all the screaming and hollering about how broken the game is with nullsec sov mechanics or with the supercap issues, or even with the Goons trying to corner the blue ice market. I love this game. I love the community of it. For better or worse, I will always be here to play.

What does concern me, tho, is all this talk about real money transfers and bots. I don't pretend to know if those out in nullsec do use bots. I don't pretend to know that the Goons are the biggest user of bot programs. But, what I do know is that CCP has started a player driven organization called the Council of Stellar Management. The CSM was started as a way for the players to voice their concerns with CCP about game related issues. If the CSM is comprised mainly of players from the Goons, and the Goons are one of the largest, if not the defacto largest player base in the game, then its not hard to come to a conclusion that somewhere along the way the CSM has lost the voice of the players, and become the voice of the Goons.

On any other subject I wouldn't care less if the entire CSM was comprised of all Goons. But, with all this talk of moving more mining related stuff out of Empire space to nullsec, where the Goons control most of it anyways, then we are just putting more ISK into the Goons wallets. By itself, its nothing, and I could give two ***** about it. But, with all this talk about RMT's taking place out in nullsec, and CCP wanting to put more ISK into the Goons hands, or any other large alliance out in nullsec (Sorry Goonies, I'm just using you guys as an example), I have to begin to wonder if some sort of duplicity, whether intentional or not, on CCP's part isn't taking place.

If CCP is oblivious to the fact that quite possibly they are being taken advantage of for RMT's, then the best solution for them, so there is no question in anyones mind, is to immediately do away with botting. I know they can trace their own clients from their servers, so its not an unrealistic ability. However, if they are complicit in their dealings with the Goons, or any other large alliance out in nullsec, who are using bots for the sole purpose of RMT's and if they are in some fashion getting returns for this, then this is nothing more than perpatrating fraud on the player base, which is against the law, everywhere in the world, except for Somalia.

I'm not accusing anyone of botting, and I'm definately not accusing anyone of RMT's or CCP's hand in any of it. I'm just drawing a possible conclusion based on what I've read in the last two weeks here on the forums and in the blogs by the Devs about moving mining related stuff out of Empire to nullsec.

I love my sandbox, and I love the other kids that play in it. Goons too. They add a spice to the game that you can't find anywhere else. But, it scares the hell out of me that quite possibly CCP is being taken advantage of all in the name of "better game mechanics".

You may commence flamming this post now. Enjoy. I know I'm going to.


Two out of the 9 CSMs are in Goonswarm.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016