Crime & Punishment

Hey guise. Lets put pvp flags in the game so we can shake hands before we engage in gentlemanly combat and by doing so, CCP will shut off the guns.


wut ya think guise?


Holy crap, we're playing the same game here right?

The cold dark harsh one... where things just aren't fair. If the objective is to get caps off gates, like triage carriers, then put capital turrets on the gate guns that have horrible tracking so BS/BC's need to move around.

I mean, it's not rocket surgery to just give the gate guns in low sex similar mechanics to those of pos modules where tracking, sig radius and other game mechanics THAT ALREADY EXIST and WORK come into play.

There, the... problem? is now fixed!

This guy for csm chairman

Because... He has to justify his paycheck?

The fact that you said absolutely nothing at the time, worries me greatly. Not one word came from anyone but Aleks, who said it would be great.

This alone, makes many of us very distrusting of your sudden need to jump on this bandwagon.

look how what you typed conflicts with your sig

moron

Gatecamping is piracy. Piracy is a career path in eve online according to CCP. If the devs namely greyscale fixed what was broken in thier game before trying to add useless content the majority of the player base doesnt want or need then CCP would be living up to what they claim to be aiming for. Right now they are talking the talk but they still aint walking the walk, i thought incarna was enough and things were looking up and CCP were actually listening to the playerbase again and not just sticking in useless content regardless of the feedback from us the players who at the end of the day pay these guys wages through subscriptions.

I challenge any of you to find content added to the game in the last 5 years that encourages ppl to take the piracy career path. Its a hard pill to swallow for older players who have subbed multiple accounts for over 6 years just to see CCP constantly nerf thier playstyle. Eve needs to be balanced but cmon, we got stabs, cov ops frigs, cruisers andhaulers, mwd cloak trick, drones are useless, sentry guns, system avoidance tool, target breaker modules and even a micro jump drive coming soon to contend with before we even think about engaging anything. Are those not enough of a disadvantage before we even undock and shoot anything without adding even more content that gimps what we do.

Oh and we got the CSM fighting our corner too and saying nothing when these ridiculas ideas are tabled by CCP. The CSM should represent ALL playstyles of eve online but right now apart from one guy i see no interest from the rest unless its about thier prefered style of play. Seriously whats the point of claiming to be a voice for us the players if u say nothing when something arises that doesnt directly affect your prefered style of play. I see lots of effort from the CSM writing blogs and going on radios for inerviews ect but thats just making yourself look good and is useless if u sit silent when issues or idiotic ideas are tabled by CCP.

I urge the pirate community to come together regardless of our differences and what we think of each other and be one loud voice against the nerf after nerf after nerf to our dying playstyle. We been promised low sex loving for over 5 years and i dont see anything not related to FW that encourages PPL to take up piracy in eve online.

I have created a channel for like minded corps/alliance to discuss the crusade by ccp to kill piracy. Join ingame "Stop the Rot"

Angry23

Your right, but the heart of my post is the psychological impact of piracy. I do not think that can be overstated. I think CCP HAS to be called out on this. Because, if I'm right, then a major drive to educate the next generation of players on how to pvp is the only answer. Not just the mechanic of pvp, but solid tactics based on experience. This comes down to the massive learning curve that is EVE. Its legendary. There are complete guides for every other aspect of eve except lowsec pvp and how to deal with it. If they exists they are not out in the open for NEW PEOPLE TO FIND. I also think its key that CCP put their stamp on it and post it as a pdf. Even better, intergrate it into the game. Without that its just another random guide that won't be taken seriously. It needs to be taken as seriously as any other "official" guide. It should be about pvp combat ONLY and should be clearly marked as such. I truly believe that is were they should put there efforts. We can't allow this game to become wow. We have the best players on the planet because of the challenging enviroment presented here. Give them the tools they need and they will step up.

Yeah, heaven forbid CCP would try to incorporate some innovative ideas from the most successful company in the history of online gaming.

Relax, EVE will never be wow, but that doesn't mean it has to be playable by middle aged gaming geeks only. Who have countless hours to review and perfect their gaming knowledge. Some of us only get a few hours online a week and don't want to spend those getting roasted at a gate so some other guy can 'enjoy' his game experience.

Yeah I agree about the guides, though there is a lot of content online these days, just have to poke around for it. I don't play wow much, but there's no denying they are making bank. I think it's a smart move on CCP's part to compete in the market as a whole, it's a big universe, plenty of room to do what you want in Eve. Adding something to help low sec travel is a great way to get people out of high sec, will increase perps targets, perhaps getting them off the gates and into roid fields, etc to kill that unsuspecting and helpless target. besides this doesn't really stop a HIC from grabbing you, so whats the big deal.

Hey again.

I understand that this is all design stage stuff. So, let's talk about design and stop worrying about what was said.

Personally, I think we have to go back to the basics when it comes to why do we have Sentries? I really haven't seen an answer that tackled in a good way. Let's look at WHY we have them and look at what results they create.

#1, Sentry guns are clearly designed to deter aggression on gates and stations as a form of soft policing in low sec.

#2, Sentry Guns fill a "lore/role" play purpose by making low sec feel more like a part of empire space than the lawless parts of 0.0 space.

#3, Sentry guns make it somewhat safer for smaller ships to move through low sec on a general day because you can't have fast interceptors last too long (I have seen them used though), and the typical gate camp isn't equipped for super fast locking (remote sensor boosters, etc, etc), but some major camp locations are --I'm looking at you Amamake.

What should be the major design goals of a Sentry gun rewrite?

#1 - Fresh Pros vs Cons for Pirates and Travellers

For Pirates :
Pros - Easier to get fights, less interference from sentry guns on low sec vs low sec scuffles
Cons - Make it difficult to interfere with high sec day trippers.

For Travellers :
Pros - Still be able to get past some gate camps in a frigate/small frigate. Should not be total travel lock out as with warp bubbles.
Cons - Promotes the idea that Evil Pirates are in low sec enough that they're still a bit scared of low sec being dangerous.

---
So, basically, my ideal gate gun system wouldn't interfere with me when I'm doing my day to day PVP vs other pirates/low seccers (even if they're not -5). But would give some protection against other travellers.

It would deter certain kinds of gate camps (interceptors, etc)

On a fringe case, when there ARE carriers/titans, etc on the Stargate, maybe THEN add the escalating DPS to deter heavy logistics RR and capital ships on the Stargates for "static" gate camps such as Amamake.

The major issue with changng the sentry guns in low sec is there is no other place for us to "Get a fight" on a typical day. And on top of it, we have to deal with Sentries being a pain in the ass (already). And then you're designing for a fringe issue which will basically wallop the **** out of any non-capital ship.

We don't have warp bubbles in low sec. And we want to get fights. So how do you recommend that we do this? You aren't going to "Fix" the low sec population issue by stopping the killing going on, and fixing it that way is the WORST way to fix low sec "population issues anyways.

And on TOP of it, it sounds like you're going to have sentries be hitting ALL red/flashies for the some damage at all times and escalating(Rather than a rotating limited damage model as right now).


Major design flaws in the escalating DPS of sentry guns :

#1 - They don't take into account that a typical big fight can and will last longer than 10 minutes, and you're just applying more NPC interference to our player interaction sandbox.

#2 - The fight goes from being a matter of combat tactics on the defender (non-GCC), to a matter of scramming the ship with the sentry guns so they can't warp away until uBerDPS takes over (this happens somewhat alright, but rotating sentries make it difficult).

#3 - The "warp out to reset aggression" is a broken model due to #2 and warp scrams.

To address specific things :


We don't drop carriers on Stargates. We definitely do NOT triage them. Do not implement ideas that force specific mechanics as "cool dynamics" for us. Lay the rules down, we'll play ball.

As well, noone ever ever EVER does this, and noone will SUDDENLY start doing this. Low Sec dwellers don't Triage Carriers on gates. If there was even a pattern of behavior that indicated this fine, but seriously, we don't do it. You ever heard of Pandemic Legion hot dropping **** for ***** and giggles? Ya, we don't do this because of super caps, because carriers are huge freaking targets. And because we don't have billions of ISK of income to throw away in low sec.



I agree with this design element mainly for major gate camp places. /me glares at Amamake. When PL puts 8 freaking titans on a stargate and doesn't give a **** because they know noone will **** up their day (even if they kill a titan, a la Wolfsbrigade, they'll laugh off the loss). This becomes stupid.

But honestly, by and large, MOST low sec entries aren't perma-camped. They just seem that way because of Murphy's law. And it's nothing that a scout can't work around. And then you'll just have pirates sitting at tacticals off the gate with an interceptor tackle waiting for the targets to jump in.

So, do I think it's a horrible idea? no. But just work it into a bigger concept for carriers/capitals specifically.