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Crime & Punishment

 
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C&P, this pertains to YOU

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Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#81 - 2012-08-03 20:54:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Zagdul
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

Edit - posting the text below alone is all you needed to do and is 1000% more effective, its the personal attacks that are counterproductive, devs tend to blow off those that just want to insult them.

Quote:
The problem isn't gate camping. The problem is gates in general. They create choke points. Choke points will always be where fights happen.

This is in Real Life with wars. You cut off supply chains.
This happens in EVE, you focus on high traffic areas.


There's nothing, zilch, zero - good that will come from this idea. It will push pvp away from the game, not draw more of it in.


Don't talk down to me duder.

You're just some nerd behind a computer just as I am.



The point remains. CCP Greyscale is bad for EVE and needs to stop even suggesting things as -every-single-time he opens his mouth it's utter facepalm, pants on head ~mental handicap~. There's a series of threads that follow with a bunch of irate customers who cannot believe someone would even consider the things that come from him.


I mean...

Deah Rays


NO REALLY

He said that at Fan Fest!

Are you kidding?


The dude does not get EVE.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#82 - 2012-08-03 20:57:38 UTC
And again. Yes, I'll go after Greyscale.

Because I'd rather attack his credibility than that of his co-workers who wear the same company logo he does. He's an embarrassment to them.

There are some fine developers in that company putting out quality ideas and top notch work only to have this guy come in and ruin what could be an amazing community and game. It ruins the community because of ~Death Rays ZOMG RAGE~ and the game because, anyone who has been PLAYING the game knows these kind of ideas break it. Without even giving it a second thought.

The dude is on some serious Kool-Aid.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#83 - 2012-08-03 21:01:02 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Zagdul wrote:

Drop the design. It's a horrible idea.

Also, quit and stop ruining the game. You don't understand it and shouldn't have any say in it's direction. Especially aspects you clearly have no clue about (pretty much all of it except carebearing in empire).

Just about every idea you've ever tried to implement has been hit with a 'wtf is this dude thinking' and I can only imagine that it's why CSM didn't say anything. They were dumbfounded by stupidity from your remarks on this completely bad idea.

Please do us all a favor and get out of the 'ideas department' of CCP. Furthermore, do not participate in public speeches and you should strongly consider not logging on to forums to respond to the community as you give your company a bad image and name.

You made a fool out of yourself at Fanfest (really... death rays?)
You made a fool out of yourself when you attempted to suggest titan fixes.
You are making a fool out of yourself right now for even suggesting that this is a good idea.


Hint: It's not. Scrap it.


And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.



If it's Greyscale, that would be an improvement.


You are so pathetic its not even funny.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#84 - 2012-08-03 21:02:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Zagdul
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Zagdul wrote:

Drop the design. It's a horrible idea.

Also, quit and stop ruining the game. You don't understand it and shouldn't have any say in it's direction. Especially aspects you clearly have no clue about (pretty much all of it except carebearing in empire).

Just about every idea you've ever tried to implement has been hit with a 'wtf is this dude thinking' and I can only imagine that it's why CSM didn't say anything. They were dumbfounded by stupidity from your remarks on this completely bad idea.

Please do us all a favor and get out of the 'ideas department' of CCP. Furthermore, do not participate in public speeches and you should strongly consider not logging on to forums to respond to the community as you give your company a bad image and name.

You made a fool out of yourself at Fanfest (really... death rays?)
You made a fool out of yourself when you attempted to suggest titan fixes.
You are making a fool out of yourself right now for even suggesting that this is a good idea.


Hint: It's not. Scrap it.


And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.



If it's Greyscale, that would be an improvement.


You are so pathetic its not even funny.



You're so ironic it's (kindergarten here) not even funny.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Eternal Error
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#85 - 2012-08-03 21:02:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternal Error
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.

I disagree. While I took a break from closely following eve during the latter half of 2011 and my memory is fuzzy from before that, everything I have seen Greyscale propose in 2012 has been consistently awful. I feel that his view of the game is flawed, and if the changes that he proposes or the ideologies that he represents make their way into Eve, I will be leaving.

I don't really enjoy flaming on the forums or making particularly vitriolic posts, but when the problem is with a certain developer or ideology, there is nothing wrong with pointing out exactly where the problem is.

They would do well to not ignore useful feedback, no matter how hateful, unless they want a (slightly smaller, but still very significant) repeat of Incarna.
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#86 - 2012-08-03 21:05:49 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Zagdul wrote:

Drop the design. It's a horrible idea.

Also, quit and stop ruining the game. You don't understand it and shouldn't have any say in it's direction. Especially aspects you clearly have no clue about (pretty much all of it except carebearing in empire).

Just about every idea you've ever tried to implement has been hit with a 'wtf is this dude thinking' and I can only imagine that it's why CSM didn't say anything. They were dumbfounded by stupidity from your remarks on this completely bad idea.

Please do us all a favor and get out of the 'ideas department' of CCP. Furthermore, do not participate in public speeches and you should strongly consider not logging on to forums to respond to the community as you give your company a bad image and name.

You made a fool out of yourself at Fanfest (really... death rays?)
You made a fool out of yourself when you attempted to suggest titan fixes.
You are making a fool out of yourself right now for even suggesting that this is a good idea.


Hint: It's not. Scrap it.


And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.



If it's Greyscale, that would be an improvement.


You are so pathetic its not even funny.



You're so ironic it's (kindergarten here) not even funny.


Seriously, just stop embarrassing yourself, its not pretty.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#87 - 2012-08-03 21:08:02 UTC
@Hans

All seriousness.

Take a HARD line against this idea. You'll find yourself with more followers than arguing semantics with me about how I should behave on a forum.

Really, this idea needs to be dumped in the toilet and you need to wave the banner all the way to Iceland to make sure of it. Be the candidate that saved lowsec! Do it and you'll be back in seat again next year for free booze and shark meat.


Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#88 - 2012-08-03 21:09:56 UTC
Eternal Error wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.

I disagree. While I took a break from closely following eve during the latter half of 2011 and my memory is fuzzy from before that, everything I have seen Greyscale propose in 2012 has been consistently awful. I feel that his view of the game is flawed, and if the changes that he proposes or the ideologies that he represents make their way into Eve, I will be leaving.

I don't really enjoy flaming on the forums or making particularly vitriolic posts, but when the problem is with a certain developer or ideology, there is nothing wrong with pointing out exactly where the problem is.

They would do well to not ignore useful feedback, no matter how hateful, unless they want a (slightly smaller, but still very significant) repeat of Incarna.


I agree that the guy seems to go off script and is looking at things a different why. But it doesn't take much to say that. A simple "Greyscale has lost touch with EVE's mission" or "Greyscale's should focus on something else" are much more appropriate. This is a REAL person whose JOB is to try and make the game better. Bashing another player is one thing and I have no problem taking the heat, but bashing someone who could potentially lose his job is just low.

Constructive criticism isn't too much to ask.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2012-08-03 21:10:01 UTC
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.



If it's Greyscale, that would be an improvement.


You are so pathetic its not even funny.



You're so ironic it's (kindergarten here) not even funny.


Seriously, just stop embarrassing yourself, its not pretty.


I should heed your advice, it seems like it stems from someone with a lot of wisdom and intelligence.

ohseven meight.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#90 - 2012-08-03 21:14:34 UTC
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Eternal Error wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.

I disagree. While I took a break from closely following eve during the latter half of 2011 and my memory is fuzzy from before that, everything I have seen Greyscale propose in 2012 has been consistently awful. I feel that his view of the game is flawed, and if the changes that he proposes or the ideologies that he represents make their way into Eve, I will be leaving.

I don't really enjoy flaming on the forums or making particularly vitriolic posts, but when the problem is with a certain developer or ideology, there is nothing wrong with pointing out exactly where the problem is.

They would do well to not ignore useful feedback, no matter how hateful, unless they want a (slightly smaller, but still very significant) repeat of Incarna.


I agree that the guy seems to go off script and is looking at things a different why. But it doesn't take much to say that. A simple "Greyscale has lost touch with EVE's mission" or "Greyscale's should focus on something else" are much more appropriate. This is a REAL person whose JOB is to try and make the game better. Bashing another player is one thing and I have no problem taking the heat, but bashing someone who could potentially lose his job is just low.

Constructive criticism isn't too much to ask.


My friend.

He's never been IN TOUCH with eve to be out of touch with it. The only thing he and EVE have in common is that the core of both entities existence is has something to do with space.

The difference is that with EVE Online, it deals with space as the final frontier, with Greyscale it's something to do with the space between his ears.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#91 - 2012-08-03 21:14:36 UTC
Zagdul wrote:


I should heed your advice, it seems like it stems from someone with a lot of wisdom and intelligence.

ohseven meight.


All I know is that I know nothing. Unlike you who believe you know what is best for everyone. Take your self-righteous banter elsewhere.

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.
Ristlin Wakefield
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#92 - 2012-08-03 21:15:46 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
Ristlin Wakefield wrote:
Eternal Error wrote:
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

And THIS, my friends, is how to make one's opinion irrelevent in CCP's eyes. Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.

I disagree. While I took a break from closely following eve during the latter half of 2011 and my memory is fuzzy from before that, everything I have seen Greyscale propose in 2012 has been consistently awful. I feel that his view of the game is flawed, and if the changes that he proposes or the ideologies that he represents make their way into Eve, I will be leaving.

I don't really enjoy flaming on the forums or making particularly vitriolic posts, but when the problem is with a certain developer or ideology, there is nothing wrong with pointing out exactly where the problem is.

They would do well to not ignore useful feedback, no matter how hateful, unless they want a (slightly smaller, but still very significant) repeat of Incarna.


I agree that the guy seems to go off script and is looking at things a different why. But it doesn't take much to say that. A simple "Greyscale has lost touch with EVE's mission" or "Greyscale's should focus on something else" are much more appropriate. This is a REAL person whose JOB is to try and make the game better. Bashing another player is one thing and I have no problem taking the heat, but bashing someone who could potentially lose his job is just low.

Constructive criticism isn't too much to ask.


My friend.

He's never been IN TOUCH with eve to be out of touch with it. The only thing he and EVE have in common is that the core of both entities existence is has something to do with space.

The difference is that with EVE Online, it deals with space as the final frontier, with Greyscale it's something to do with the space between his ears.


What did he do? Reject one of your ideas and now you are butt-hurt over it?

I have a lover, her name is EVE. I see her every night and all she asks in return is that I have a pilot's license.
Copine Callmeknau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#93 - 2012-08-03 22:55:12 UTC
Shocked

this thread right here

There should be a rather awesome pic here
MrWhitei God
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#94 - 2012-08-03 23:07:24 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:
Especially to all you low sec residents - GET IN TOUCH WITH ME ABOUT THESE ISSUES.

As Greyscale said, this is on the table for discussion, nothing is final. I understand many are rightfully concerned about the gate changes, and personally I think there's some outstanding player proposals surrounding GCC and sentry guns that are worthy of consideration.

I'll be taking point on this stuff myself, along with Alekseyev Karrde, no doubt. It matters too much to me not to monitor the progress here with a magnifying glass. Don't be afraid to throw us some walls of text in an email if you have something on your mind!


Hans: the guy that helped kill lowsec roaming
or
Hans: Glorious saviour of lowsec

They took our jaorbs!


I got no problem with ramping up sentry dps over time, but I think it would be better if the dps reset on mutual fights

There needs to be something to make the outcome of a fight not depend on who shot first.
Otherwise it will become the 0.0 fights i remember where two fleets in the same system and no action because it was certain death for the guys that had to warp to the grid.
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#95 - 2012-08-03 23:08:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Tarryn Nightstorm
What they should have done --years ago-- is bloody well nerf gate-guns' tracking and optimal range to something approximating "real" (IE, available to players) guns,but oh no:

That would be a buff to something other than sov-nullsec, at the expense of...well, no-one really, who doesn't want to go to losec, at least...and we can't have that, now can we.

It is becoming painfully obvious to me that CCP is saying "**** the sandbox" with every patch since Crucible, and trying to force everyone into sov-nullsec, as if that's really something emotionally-mature adults with a shred of self-respect would want to aspire to.Roll

No new content exclusive to losec with balanced risk<--->reward axis. In almost 10 years.

No simple, logical solution --namely nerfing gate-guns' optimal and tracking to something halfway-realistic, and/or making them incapacitate-able, if not destructible-- to what is fundamentally a very simple problem. In almost 10 years.

No thought given to the fact that losec --both PvP and PvE-- is also an endgame to many, but that there is not, nor should there ever be any one explicit endgame in a ******* sandbox. Probably ever.

And their little pets on the CSM just lap it up...****, I actually trusted some of those to represent people like me, thought they were for real.

Because **** the sandbox, that's why.

/Me sighs...Infinity: Quest for Earth, why aren't you out of vapour-ware yet?

E:

[/rant]

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.
Poetic Stanziel
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#96 - 2012-08-03 23:24:20 UTC
MrWhitei God wrote:
... who shot first.

Hans.
Tetsel
House Amamake
#97 - 2012-08-04 00:22:41 UTC
Hans Jagerblitzen wrote:

Not sure if you're seriously interested in seeing the game fixed Zagdul, but this exactly the kind of dribble that CCP not only ignores completely, but makes them not want to log into the forums to begin with.


So you want him (us) to help ccp to fix an idea, they came up in the first place, idea that will break/unbalance/etc something that is actually working fine and nobody complain about (aka sentry guns) ? Are you ******* kidding us Hans ? So your balls don't worth more to you than a free Iceland trip and/or some CCP bounding ?

Loyal servent to Mother Amamake. @EVE_Tetsel

Another Bittervet Please Ignore
Mane Frehm
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#98 - 2012-08-04 02:01:33 UTC
Sigh - I can appreciate that some folks in this thread are frustrated. That being said......

Being passionate about something is great, but personal attacks are a childish waste of time and will in no way get you what you want. I can tell you that if anyone threw that kind of crap at one of my developers, the "ignore" button would be used.

So identify your concerns and make your points - but do it in a reasonable/rational manner. You have a far better chance of getting your voice heard.
Xylorn Hasher
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#99 - 2012-08-04 02:34:26 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
CCP Greyscale wrote:
Just to clarify a few points, given that this thread seems to be the only one that's not gone off the deep end already:

  • First and foremost, this is an idea we were spitballing at the time and ran past the CSM just to see what their reaction was. It's still "in the design" right now, but that part of the design isn't going to get implemented for a while, and there will be further discussion with the CSM and the community before that happens. The CSM minutes are *NOT* a devblog, please don't treat them as such Smile
  • "Suspect" is an aggression flag, and has nothing to do with sec status
  • The general thinking behind this potential change (and again, it's just general thinking, we've not seriously reviewed it yet) is to try and break up "static" gatecamps a little and generally *discourage* hanging around on a gate all day.
  • Yes, we know people are just going to yo-yo back in, and if they're dedicated enough to do that for a couple of hours then more power to them, they get to camp the gate for a few hours.
  • The thinking specifically with carriers was that it'd be an interesting dynamic that you had to essentially "pre-commit" with a triage carrier, by dropping into triage, waiting 30-40s (times obviously subject to some actual balancing work) and then starting to rep, so you've still got the window to get out again before the damage becomes high enough to kill you. This lets you use carriers on lowsec gates but gives the other side a bit of time to go "oh crap, that carrier's gone into triage, we'd better either double down or start running".
  • Damage ramping as currently envisioned would be strictly per-ship, per-engagement - as soon as you warp off, it resets back to base. This could of course be redesigned in many ways to get it to do other interesting things - or as should hopefully be clear by now, dropped entirely if we decide it's a rubbish idea after all.


Drop the design. It's a horrible idea.

Also, quit and stop ruining the game. You don't understand it and shouldn't have any say in it's direction. Especially aspects you clearly have no clue about (pretty much all of it except carebearing in empire).

Just about every idea you've ever tried to implement has been hit with a 'wtf is this dude thinking' and I can only imagine that it's why CSM didn't say anything. They were dumbfounded by stupidity from your remarks on this completely bad idea.

Please do us all a favor and get out of the 'ideas department' of CCP. Furthermore, do not participate in public speeches and you should strongly consider not logging on to forums to respond to the community as you give your company a bad image and name.

You made a fool out of yourself at Fanfest (really... death rays?)
You made a fool out of yourself when you attempted to suggest titan fixes.
You are making a fool out of yourself right now for even suggesting that this is a good idea.


Hint: It's not. Scrap it.


Holy! Ruthless sharp tounge and all she said is actually true.

All my posts are made shortly after Marihuana consumption.
Tarryn Nightstorm
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#100 - 2012-08-04 04:33:01 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
@Hans

All seriousness.

Take a HARD line against this idea. You'll find yourself with more followers than arguing semantics with me about how I should behave on a forum.

[...]



^^That.^^

Unlike my...perhaps a bit emotionally-delivered...last post, I'll just take a deep breath, and quote this for great justice.

Hans, seriously:

Please do this, because Greyscale--quelle surprise!--appears so hilariously out of touch, it's...well, it beggars words, really.

Star Wars: the Old Republic may not be EVE. But I'll take the sound of dual blaster-pistols over "NURVV CLAOKING NAOW!!!11oneone!!" any day of the week.