These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Gate Gun Fairy Tale: CCP Saving Oblivous Hi Sec Dwellers From Themselves

First post
Author
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#41 - 2012-08-03 11:36:25 UTC
Cannibal Kane wrote:
You should not have to spend extra extra oney on a second account just to be safe.


...or to mine efficiently... uh, pesky logic.^^

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)

Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#42 - 2012-08-03 11:43:28 UTC
So, I can no longer engage anyone solo on a lowsec gate in my Myrmidon?

Maybe I can now ask if the randomly encountered neutral wishes to warp to a celestial, so we can have some sweet consensual pvp.

.

baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#43 - 2012-08-03 11:48:17 UTC
Roime wrote:
So, I can no longer engage anyone solo on a lowsec gate in my Myrmidon?

Maybe I can now ask if the randomly encountered neutral wishes to warp to a celestial, so we can have some sweet consensual pvp.


I'm sure the badger would agree to that.
Arkturus McFadden
Anukar
#44 - 2012-08-03 11:53:07 UTC
Suddenly Forums ForumKings wrote:
and Darwin rewards those who adapt to the challenge of their environment.



Gosh, with that type of thought process you could say the same damn thing about pirates.. but no! We need to make a hundred whine threads! We can't have a challenge!


Plus, it ain't null and I have the slightest idea as to why people think low sec should be null sec with training wheels. Low security means LOW SECURITY (relative safety).


Just adapt or die off and let another breed of pirate have his playground.
baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#45 - 2012-08-03 11:55:24 UTC
Arkturus McFadden wrote:
Suddenly Forums ForumKings wrote:
and Darwin rewards those who adapt to the challenge of their environment.



Gosh, with that type of thought process you could say the same damn thing about pirates.. but no! We need to make a hundred whine threads! We can't have a challenge!


Plus, it ain't null and I have the slightest idea as to why people think low sec should be null sec with training wheels. Low security means LOW SECURITY (relative safety).


Just adapt or die off and let another breed of pirate have his playground.


Just to point out, the people camping the gates are going to benefit from this the most.
Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#46 - 2012-08-03 12:04:20 UTC
Cannibal Kane wrote:
The problem I have with the 3rd Hi-seccer.

He needed an alt to savely traverse through low sec. For a person to use a second account just to be safe is the issue.

You should not have to spend extra extra oney on a second account just to be safe.


But how would one go about solving this? I mean, short of traveling through the gate and seeing what's on the other side, there's no way of knowing what you're about to face. Losing a single Tengu hull without any mods whatsoever = 1 month plex for the alt + all the shuttle losses incured, so it's a small price to pay unless you somehow completely remove the risk of the jump, which, frankly, won't happen. Well... unless you could somehow scan the other side of the stargate...

Quote:
Either way, people will still be caught and will still die. All it means, pro campers can no longer sit there until they decide to log to allow somebody to come through.


Exactly, it's EvE, nothing's 100% safe here.
baltec1
Bat Country
The Initiative.
#47 - 2012-08-03 12:08:31 UTC
Caitlyn Tufy wrote:

But how would one go about solving this? I mean, short of traveling through the gate and seeing what's on the other side, there's no way of knowing what you're about to face. Losing a single Tengu hull without any mods whatsoever = 1 month plex for the alt + all the shuttle losses incured, so it's a small price to pay unless you somehow completely remove the risk of the jump, which, frankly, won't happen. Well... unless you could somehow scan the other side of the stargate...



Use a fast cloaky frigate or even your pod to go take a look.
Josef Djugashvilis
#48 - 2012-08-03 12:18:21 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Away from the stations and gates, ratting, exploring, running missions etc, kill me by all means, but if I can be more or less insta-popped at the stations and gates, I may as well be in 0.0. which kind of defeats the point of having lo-sec.


Same story, same conclusion... and it doesn't matter what kind of ship you fly or what you do...

- T1 hauler doing lvl 2(!) distribution mission - one jump into 0.4 - gate popped
- Brannew Buzzard - one jump into 0.4 to pick up some cheap sensor scripts - station popped

... all in one week.

The lesson: Never go into low again, for anything.

EDIT: Needless to say, it wasn't like that a couple of years ago...



The lesson: consider that if other people manage to move around and survive in lo-sec, but you cant...


...immediately give up trying and don't bother even trying to learn anything because obviously those other guys are exploiting or something. Obviously it's utterly impossible that you did something wrong and could somehow improve your gameplay.


Dear Malcanis, you have managed to completely miss the point of my post.

It was about risk versus reward.

Some times you seem to post just for the sake of posting.

Please resist this tempation.

Kind regards, Josef.

This is not a signature.

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#49 - 2012-08-03 12:27:56 UTC
I caught the point of the post but it's based on incorrect axioms. If nothing else you're equated the possibility of losing a ship with being in nullsec space, whereas it's just a possibility from being in any space.

Moving in lo-sec is incredibly much easier and safer than moving in 0.0. Far from "every lo-sec enterence being permacaped", even seeing another ship on a gate is a rarity in all by a very few, very well-known systems.

So the risks of being in lo-sec are far, far lower than in null. Any argument about this is based either on ignorance or dishonesty.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#50 - 2012-08-03 12:31:10 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Roime wrote:
So, I can no longer engage anyone solo on a lowsec gate in my Myrmidon?

Maybe I can now ask if the randomly encountered neutral wishes to warp to a celestial, so we can have some sweet consensual pvp.


I'm sure the badger would agree to that.


I don't normally engage industrial ships... unless I'm in a Helios.

.

Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#51 - 2012-08-03 12:32:34 UTC
Malcanis wrote:


Moving in lo-sec is incredibly much easier and safer than moving in 0.0. Far from "every lo-sec enterence being permacaped", even seeing another ship on a gate is a rarity in all by a very few, very well-known systems.

So the risks of being in lo-sec are far, far lower than in null. Any argument about this is based either on ignorance or dishonesty.


In my experience the chance of running into a gate camp in lowsec is less than 1%.

.

Frying Doom
#52 - 2012-08-03 12:33:09 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Moving in lo-sec is incredibly much easier and safer than moving in 0.0. Far from "every lo-sec enterence being permacaped", even seeing another ship on a gate is a rarity in all by a very few, very well-known systems.

Ok I'm lost are you for or against the gate guns killing the stupid?

You seem to say that only a few players who permacamp gates would be affected and that seeing another ship on a gate is a rarity.

So if its rare, you believe its a minor change and you are for it?

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#53 - 2012-08-03 12:46:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
There seems to be a wrong idea floating about that gate guns are meant to ensure safe travel through lo-sec gates. They aren't. The point of gate guns is to raise the barrier to aggressing on a lo-sec gate, not to make it impossible. You can't do it in a solo interceptor like you can in 0.0, but currently you can, if you're determined enough, have RSB'd HICs that more or less emulate that efficiency - the point being that instead of one guy in a 50 mill Inty, you need 5 or 6 guys with a bill or so worth of ships to do the same job.

So the number of gates that can be camped by a given number of pirates is reduced, or said pirates have to use ships capable of tanking gate guns, which is to say that they're going to be slower locking, slower moving ships.

Given that my experience is that only a tiny minority of lo-sec gates are camped, and that it's trivial to route around them, I'd say that there's simply no need for this increase in sentry power. It's a pointless piracy nerf.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Varshok
Doomheim
#54 - 2012-08-03 12:47:05 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Away from the stations and gates, ratting, exploring, running missions etc, kill me by all means, but if I can be more or less insta-popped at the stations and gates, I may as well be in 0.0. which kind of defeats the point of having lo-sec.


Same story, same conclusion... and it doesn't matter what kind of ship you fly or what you do...

- T1 hauler doing lvl 2(!) distribution mission - one jump into 0.4 - gate popped
- Brannew Buzzard - one jump into 0.4 to pick up some cheap sensor scripts - station popped

... all in one week.

The lesson: Never go into low again, for anything.

EDIT: Needless to say, it wasn't like that a couple of years ago...


Bingo!

I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#55 - 2012-08-03 12:49:20 UTC
Varshok wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Away from the stations and gates, ratting, exploring, running missions etc, kill me by all means, but if I can be more or less insta-popped at the stations and gates, I may as well be in 0.0. which kind of defeats the point of having lo-sec.


Same story, same conclusion... and it doesn't matter what kind of ship you fly or what you do...

- T1 hauler doing lvl 2(!) distribution mission - one jump into 0.4 - gate popped
- Brannew Buzzard - one jump into 0.4 to pick up some cheap sensor scripts - station popped

... all in one week.

The lesson: Never go into low again, for anything.

EDIT: Needless to say, it wasn't like that a couple of years ago...


Bingo!

I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...


(1) Blockade Runners. They exist for a reason.

(2) Do you think that pirates will be more likely or less likely to spend time "scanning" you if sentry power is increased?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#56 - 2012-08-03 13:00:08 UTC
Varshok wrote:


I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...


I collected my PI for 5 months in lowsec, in two regions. I got caught exactly once, tackled by a stealth bomber on a customs office and popped by rest of their gang. Kudos to them, he had done his homework about my PI and managed to surprise me.

In lowsec, risk is 90% of the fun. And don't get mad, get even, if losing cheap ships really bothers you that much.

.

Josef Djugashvilis
#57 - 2012-08-03 13:08:51 UTC
Roime wrote:
Varshok wrote:


I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...


I collected my PI for 5 months in lowsec, in two regions. I got caught exactly once, tackled by a stealth bomber on a customs office and popped by rest of their gang. Kudos to them, he had done his homework about my PI and managed to surprise me.

In lowsec, risk is 90% of the fun. And don't get mad, get even, if losing cheap ships really bothers you that much.


Sir, I resent you suggesting that my Velator was a cheap ship!Smile

This is not a signature.

ISD TYPE40
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#58 - 2012-08-03 13:25:27 UTC
Thread cleaned of troll posting. Please post responsibly, thank you - ISD Type40.

[b]ISD Type40 Lt. Commander Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]

Varshok
Doomheim
#59 - 2012-08-03 13:42:42 UTC
Roime wrote:
Varshok wrote:


I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...


I collected my PI for 5 months in lowsec, in two regions. I got caught exactly once, tackled by a stealth bomber on a customs office and popped by rest of their gang. Kudos to them, he had done his homework about my PI and managed to surprise me.

In lowsec, risk is 90% of the fun. And don't get mad, get even, if losing cheap ships really bothers you that much.


Not mad. I live in a wh with a 40m sp and 25m sp toon, lost ships worth billions. I just don't waste my time in low sec anymore... Also have plenty of money... The point is, which you missed by a mile, gate camping is preventing a target rich environment in low and null sec, it is also done because of this... Which further grows the problem. In addition, it's due to laziness, which I consider a tremendously "looserish", quality. And let's say I am a new player and I want to build a transport empire... Good luck keeping him from giving this game a shot after crap like that.

Again... Fewer people ---- more boredom.
Varshok
Doomheim
#60 - 2012-08-03 13:49:17 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Varshok wrote:
Shalua Rui wrote:
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
Away from the stations and gates, ratting, exploring, running missions etc, kill me by all means, but if I can be more or less insta-popped at the stations and gates, I may as well be in 0.0. which kind of defeats the point of having lo-sec.


Same story, same conclusion... and it doesn't matter what kind of ship you fly or what you do...

- T1 hauler doing lvl 2(!) distribution mission - one jump into 0.4 - gate popped
- Brannew Buzzard - one jump into 0.4 to pick up some cheap sensor scripts - station popped

... all in one week.

The lesson: Never go into low again, for anything.

EDIT: Needless to say, it wasn't like that a couple of years ago...


Bingo!

I was trying to collect some PI, my indi poped with 350 mechanical part in the hull, they don't even scan you to see if it's worth it. De comissioned the PI and decide to let the lazy gate campers wack there puds...

Welcome to a more boring Eve because a bunch of loosers can't figure out how to probe down people who can fight back...


(1) Blockade Runners. They exist for a reason.

(2) Do you think that pirates will be more likely or less likely to spend time "scanning" you if sentry power is increased?



Starting players can't afford or have the skills for a blockade runner.

They don't now... So what is your point?

Seriously, are you guys that adverse to actually hunting down your prey? Is "pirateing" just sitting at a gate now days? Sad....