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mining barges good job ccp
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nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-07-30 13:22:50 UTC
I know people are going rage on this post but i don't care.Twisted

First off on the mack. yes its lost its 2x boost to pull ice but it mining 2.1x faster even with my low ice mining skills so in the same time you pull the same 4 blocks of ice. Add in the much larger ore hold and tank +1 ccp

Hulk better tank better mining yeld and ok smaller ore hold then the mack and less tank but the hulk is a fleet ship not a solo miner now.+1 ccp

As for the mining crystal there 15m3 now for t1 and 25m3 for t2 so there half the size they were. +1 ccp

so over all nice job on the over haul ccp.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#2 - 2012-07-30 13:26:24 UTC
I whole heartedly agree... good job!

...the Retr/Mack could use more powergrid, though.^^

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-07-30 13:32:59 UTC
oh one last thing before people yell about the tanks on the barges.

they should have tanks and not be paper thin like they were. just there size and ore hold they should have high hp given the large loads they carry.

oh and so for them getting there tanks Gankers thats all on you now you did your job so well so that ccp could not over look the sry state of the barges any longer all on you so thanks. Oh goons a 2nd thanks for the full time hulkaggeden you add to the move of the hp buff injoy your isk loss from less t2 barges dieing.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Royaldo
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch.
Clever Use of Neutral Toons
#4 - 2012-07-30 13:33:24 UTC
How are you getting more pr hour on the mackinaw?
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-07-30 13:38:38 UTC
Royaldo wrote:
How are you getting more pr hour on the mackinaw?


given the mack. gets 3 low slots now you can fit 3 ice mining mods to push it that fast add in the implant its even better yet.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Royaldo
Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch.
Clever Use of Neutral Toons
#6 - 2012-07-30 13:44:01 UTC
atm on tq i get 168 cycle time and 4 ice.

on sisi atm i get 2 ice every 103 sec's.

the mack on sisi got 3 ice harvester upgrade t2, t2 ice harvester. no implant on either server.

so again, how are you getting more?
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-07-30 13:53:58 UTC  |  Edited by: nat longshot
ok MY cycle in sisi is 248.50 vs 514 in the live game because i had to give up mining for tank were on sisi i can have 36k ehp buff and mine a hair faster then i do now.

like i said the change helps my low ice minig skills. now over all the hulk now on sisi is much better at ice mining then the mack.

so in the end the hulk is the top of the line when mining anything but you are more open to getting ganked.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Dave stark
#8 - 2012-07-30 14:51:59 UTC
nat longshot wrote:
mining crystal there 15m3 now for t1 and 25m3 for t2 so there half the size they were. +1 ccp


no, not +1 because they decided to reduce the hulk's cargo bay.
they in effect, didn't change a damn thing.
Dave stark
#9 - 2012-07-30 14:52:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Dave Stark
Royaldo wrote:
how are you getting more?

he's not.
even a max yield hulk is only *just* keeping up with a current mackinaw.
Ooda
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-07-30 23:08:27 UTC
- 1 on this changes, just because you can't carry enough crystals.

However, it's a +1 if the intend was to annoy peeps mining in lower secs - this mission couldn't have been done any better.
Yandrosia
Celtic Cartage And Hauling
#11 - 2012-07-30 23:39:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Yandrosia
So far with my testing I see that the yield is around the same on the test server as the live when you take into account the change with the ORE hold and the time it would take to go back to a station to offload (when Solo)

so working it back to an ICE amount per minute to keep the math easy between all options and adding on the new ICE rig to compensate I got the following results for cycles. (all fittings include ICE rig and Harvester upgrades, as cargo expanders do not impact the ORE hold and adding them does not make the cargo hold big enough to even store 1 ice block.

Ore per min / secs per 1 ice
Higher = better / Lower = better

Ship Solo / Fleet
Hulk 439 / 112
Mackinaw 513 / 117
Skiff 480 / 123
covetor 451 / 108
retriever 493 / 121
Procurer 466 / 127

so from my testing based on my skills the Mackinaw will be better for SOLO mining where I get a big benefit from not having to head back to a station as often and for working with a fleet or having a hauler nearby the covetor will work out better

on the live server the Mackinaw worked out as 511 so its the same as far as i am concerned.

Now this only takes into account the ICE mining cycle times/efficiency. it does not take into account any tanking/defense considerations.
Tassian Marrix
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-07-31 05:36:20 UTC
The current hulk can carry 14 crystals in the hold and 3 in the strips for a total of 17. That is 4 sets of 4 with 1 open space to allow you to swap crystals. That is easily enough crystal space. I really don't get the crying on this one.

As for the rest of the changes i say good job. It is nice to finally have a choice when mining besides the hulk.

Ooda
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-07-31 06:16:46 UTC
Tassian Marrix wrote:
That is easily enough crystal space.



It's not - don't talk about stuff you obviously have no clue about, ty!
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-07-31 08:52:54 UTC
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Dave stark
#15 - 2012-07-31 10:15:11 UTC
nat longshot wrote:
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.



it has been done to death why the orca isn't the answer.
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2012-07-31 10:23:30 UTC  |  Edited by: nat longshot
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.



it has been done to death why the orca isn't the answer.


no people just dont want to deal with the facts point blank. they want everything and for some unknow reason think they should. Hell my Navy Mega should have 8 low 8 med and 8 high slots then if you give that much out to the barges you better do it for all.

People wanted built in tank they got it but like every ship and build there a traded off. Stop crying about not have the cargo room for a full set of crystals you want that bigger hold use cargo rigs and use cargo exp. but that will hurt your ehp big time.
You pick on your fit what it worth to you.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Dave stark
#17 - 2012-07-31 10:30:02 UTC
nat longshot wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.



it has been done to death why the orca isn't the answer.


no people just dont want to deal with the facts point blank. they want everything and for some unknow reason think they should. Hell my Navy Mega should have 8 low 8 med and 8 high slots then if you give that much out to the barges you better do it for all.

People wanted built in tank they got it but like every ship and build there a traded off. Stop crying about not have the cargo room for a full set of crystals you want that bigger hold use cargo rigs and use cargo exp. but that will hurt your ehp big time.
You pick on your fit what it worth to you.


what facts? having an orca makes no difference. it's an absolute nightmare to set up the corp hangars so people can take stuff out and out of corp fleet members can't use it at all. multi corp mining ops are extremely frequent.

why we think we should have it? mainly because we already do have it. there's no logical reason to take it away from us. it's in no way skewing game balance. in fact ccp think so because they actually reduced mining crystal amounts. however they also stupidly lowered the cargo hold [which must be a mistake since the ore hold didn't go up, and the covetor also still has 500m3 of space].

there's absolutely no reason why the hulk's cargo bay should not be returned to it's 500m3 capacity. it would solve the issue instantly.
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2012-07-31 10:37:16 UTC  |  Edited by: nat longshot
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.



it has been done to death why the orca isn't the answer.


no people just dont want to deal with the facts point blank. they want everything and for some unknow reason think they should. Hell my Navy Mega should have 8 low 8 med and 8 high slots then if you give that much out to the barges you better do it for all.

People wanted built in tank they got it but like every ship and build there a traded off. Stop crying about not have the cargo room for a full set of crystals you want that bigger hold use cargo rigs and use cargo exp. but that will hurt your ehp big time.
You pick on your fit what it worth to you.


what facts? having an orca makes no difference. it's an absolute nightmare to set up the corp hangars so people can take stuff out and out of corp fleet members can't use it at all. multi corp mining ops are extremely frequent.



why we think we should have it? mainly because we already do have it. there's no logical reason to take it away from us. it's in no way skewing game balance. in fact ccp think so because they actually reduced mining crystal amounts. however they also stupidly lowered the cargo hold [which must be a mistake since the ore hold didn't go up, and the covetor also still has 500m3 of space].

there's absolutely no reason why the hulk's cargo bay should not be returned to it's 500m3 capacity. it would solve the issue instantly.


Well then sound like your corp dont hand out rolls to there member for the fact there lasy. As for mulit corp mining ops then you need some carrying crystal for those ships that dont have them. No you can have it all deal with it. they made the hulk like it is for a reason deal with it add cargo rigs and cargo exp if you need all crystal in your damn hold.

Plus there still working the barges even if your hulk cargo is only 350m3 big deal that 3-4 sets of crystals so you have to leave to get other crystal big deal if your corp/allinace is that big just have someone bring them to you. when doing anything with large numbers of people you should have more then the orca and your mining ships there to start with your only looking and ok we need this yout not looking at to get this we need barges orcas and ships for carrying other thing we need like rr cover , combat and trasport for crystals and other thing the fleet will need.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
Dave stark
#19 - 2012-07-31 10:39:08 UTC
nat longshot wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
nat longshot wrote:
for those of you cry about the hulk's cargo bay and ore hold. What part of fleet mining barge dont you understand you keep extra crystal's in a orca.

Roll's for all ships are changing deal with it. First it was the t1 frig's now its the mining ships,next cruisers, then battle cruisers and after that battle ships get ready for alot of changes.

Stop crying about the hulk changes its a fleet mining ship not a solo miner after the changes you want solo get a skiff or a mack. or get a 2nd account with a orca pilot to fly with your hulk. Deal with the changes or stop playing but before you go contract me your stuff.



it has been done to death why the orca isn't the answer.


no people just dont want to deal with the facts point blank. they want everything and for some unknow reason think they should. Hell my Navy Mega should have 8 low 8 med and 8 high slots then if you give that much out to the barges you better do it for all.

People wanted built in tank they got it but like every ship and build there a traded off. Stop crying about not have the cargo room for a full set of crystals you want that bigger hold use cargo rigs and use cargo exp. but that will hurt your ehp big time.
You pick on your fit what it worth to you.


what facts? having an orca makes no difference. it's an absolute nightmare to set up the corp hangars so people can take stuff out and out of corp fleet members can't use it at all. multi corp mining ops are extremely frequent.

why we think we should have it? mainly because we already do have it. there's no logical reason to take it away from us. it's in no way skewing game balance. in fact ccp think so because they actually reduced mining crystal amounts. however they also stupidly lowered the cargo hold [which must be a mistake since the ore hold didn't go up, and the covetor also still has 500m3 of space].

there's absolutely no reason why the hulk's cargo bay should not be returned to it's 500m3 capacity. it would solve the issue instantly.


Well then sound like your corp dont hand out rolls to there member for the fact there lasy. As for mulit corp mining ops then you need some carrying crystal for those ships that dont have them. No you can have it all deal with it. they made the hulk like it is for a reason deal with it add cargo rigs and cargo exp if you need all crystal in your damn hold.



i don't want it all, if i wanted it all i'd be crying about the entire rebalance to begin with.

my corp itself doesn't matter, besides in regards for multi corp... that's the point; you can't carry enough crystals in a hulk, you're also not intended to be anchored on the orca for jetcans either as evident by the tractor bonus on the orca.
nat longshot
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-07-31 10:46:45 UTC
Dave stark wrote:

you're also not intended to be anchored on the orca for jetcans either as evident by the tractor bonus on the orca.


your right on that then you need to sort out your mining fleet to handle the size of the belt and what crystal each barge should have to get the rocks you want. Meaning you have think before you act just like in pvp. Not just going out there and clear a belt because you could before with out thinking what you needed. welcome to them reworkiing the ships deal with it.

Do real miners head out with all there gear no they carry what they can and have other bring the rest of what they need youll have to do the same its that easy.

 [13:12:18] CCP Punkturis nat longshot you're a cutie.. OH YAH I WIN!!
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