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Basic battleship question

Author
Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-07-28 00:16:33 UTC
I just had the pleasure of losing my first battleship a day or two ago, and I believe it was mostly due to my error in strategy. I was used to kiting everything in my Vexor with drones and extra range, but it didn't seem to work very well at all in my Domi.

So the question is... is it even helpful to move much, in a battleship, since they're such a big slow target, or is it best to just park, fit for heavy tanking, and just chew up the rats as they come to you? Just curious of peoples' basic strategies, and googling wasn't narrowing my search down very well.

This is mainly for L4 missions, btw, so if anybody has some helpful input, I'd appreciate it. Big smile
Gianath
Gallentian Legitimate Businessmen
#2 - 2012-07-28 01:19:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Gianath
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
I just had the pleasure of losing my first battleship a day or two ago, and I believe it was mostly due to my error in strategy. I was used to kiting everything in my Vexor with drones and extra range, but it didn't seem to work very well at all in my Domi.

So the question is... is it even helpful to move much, in a battleship, since they're such a big slow target, or is it best to just park, fit for heavy tanking, and just chew up the rats as they come to you? Just curious of peoples' basic strategies, and googling wasn't narrowing my search down very well.

This is mainly for L4 missions, btw, so if anybody has some helpful input, I'd appreciate it. Big smile


For a domi, you go heavy tank and sit still. Ideally you park next to T2 sentries, but even if you are just using T1 heavies the speed you pick trying to be mobile up won't be enough to mitigate damage even with an afterburner running.

Just use eve-survival.org to look up the mission triggers and recommend damage resists, then equip your Domi with 2 of each resist needed, and two Large Armor Repairers (Tech 2 should be a priority, but meta 4 work well enough). Fill the rest of your slots with cap rechargers and cap rigs until you are cap stable with both reps running, and anything you can throw into the highs that adds damage are just a bonus.

Tech 2 large guns are ideal, but not needed. You can get by with medium rails or even just a civilian gun to draw aggro while the other highs are just drone range extenders, salvagers and tractors to keep yourself occupied while you slowly crawl through your mission.

A dual large rep domi with 2x2 resists is darn near unkillable in PVE unless you go out of your way to aggro way more than necessary.
Vince Arron
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2012-07-28 01:22:51 UTC
Gianath wrote:
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
I just had the pleasure of losing my first battleship a day or two ago, and I believe it was mostly due to my error in strategy. I was used to kiting everything in my Vexor with drones and extra range, but it didn't seem to work very well at all in my Domi.

So the question is... is it even helpful to move much, in a battleship, since they're such a big slow target, or is it best to just park, fit for heavy tanking, and just chew up the rats as they come to you? Just curious of peoples' basic strategies, and googling wasn't narrowing my search down very well.

This is mainly for L4 missions, btw, so if anybody has some helpful input, I'd appreciate it. Big smile


For a domi, you go heavy tank and sit still. Ideally you park next to T2 sentries, but even if you are just using T1 heavies the speed you pick up won't be enough to mitigate damage.

Just use eve-survival.org to look up the mission triggers and recommend damage resists, then equip your Domi with 2 of each resist needed, and two Large Armor Repairers (Tech 2 should be a priority, but meta 4 work well enough). Fill the rest of your slots with cap rechargers and cap rigs until you are cap stable with both reps running, and anything you can throw into the highs that adds damage are just a bonus.

Tech 2 large guns are ideal, but not needed. You can get by with medium rails or even just a civilian gun to draw aggro while the other highs are just drone range extenders, salvagers and tractors to keep yourself occupied while you slowly crawl through your mission.

A dual large rep domi with 2x2 resists is darn near unkillable in PVE unless you go out of your way to aggro way more than necessary.


Confirming all pros fit civilian weapons to battleships.
Gianath
Gallentian Legitimate Businessmen
#4 - 2012-07-28 01:28:45 UTC
Vince Arron wrote:
[

Confirming all pros fit civilian weapons to battleships.


... to draw aggro.

Newbies aren't going to have the skills to equip up both drones and heavy rails. If you are flying a domi, you focus on getting T2 drones first since they are your main damage source, and you use the civilian gun to draw aggro so they don't get killed.

If you intend to focus on getting large hybrids to T2 first, you are better off in one of the other Gallente battleships that aren't drone boats.
Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-07-28 01:32:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Adalynne Rohks
Gianath wrote:
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
I just had the pleasure of losing my first battleship a day or two ago, and I believe it was mostly due to my error in strategy. I was used to kiting everything in my Vexor with drones and extra range, but it didn't seem to work very well at all in my Domi.

So the question is... is it even helpful to move much, in a battleship, since they're such a big slow target, or is it best to just park, fit for heavy tanking, and just chew up the rats as they come to you? Just curious of peoples' basic strategies, and googling wasn't narrowing my search down very well.

This is mainly for L4 missions, btw, so if anybody has some helpful input, I'd appreciate it. Big smile


For a domi, you go heavy tank and sit still. Ideally you park next to T2 sentries, but even if you are just using T1 heavies the speed you pick trying to be mobile up won't be enough to mitigate damage even with an afterburner running.

Just use eve-survival.org to look up the mission triggers and recommend damage resists, then equip your Domi with 2 of each resist needed, and two Large Armor Repairers (Tech 2 should be a priority, but meta 4 work well enough). Fill the rest of your slots with cap rechargers and cap rigs until you are cap stable with both reps running, and anything you can throw into the highs that adds damage are just a bonus.

Tech 2 large guns are ideal, but not needed. You can get by with medium rails or even just a civilian gun to draw aggro while the other highs are just drone range extenders, salvagers and tractors to keep yourself occupied while you slowly crawl through your mission.

A dual large rep domi with 2x2 resists is darn near unkillable in PVE unless you go out of your way to aggro way more than necessary.


Thanks a heap. This sounds like almost exactly what I was speculating. I was hoping that it would be confirmed. Kiting was just a grand failure for me last time, and I had way to many drone damage enhancers in the low slots, instead of more defense.

I was expecting to go with 2 nano's instead of 2 extra specific resists, but I guess if I read up ahead of time, it makes sense to specialize for each mission/race.

edit: one more thing, about fitting.... in the fitting screen, the rigs don't seem to contribute to the "cap stable" indicator thingy. Am I crazy, or is it bugged to not add to the cap time in the fitting screen?
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#6 - 2012-07-28 03:08:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
TLDR; It significantly reduces incoming damage when you are moving, even slowly.

For what it is worth, I kite in my battleship, a Navy Raven. I can kite all but fast moving Angels using just an afterburner.

With the long range of cruise missiles, I can even kite out to 105 km, where NPC can't touch me (NPC battleships don't seem to hit past about 90 km). Unfortunately, that is too far for drone use (I do use drones on things get within drone range though).

You can also orbit a warp-in beacon, or acceleration gate, or sentry drones.

Good reference so you can avoid pulling more aggro than you can handle:
http://eve-survival.org/wikka.php?wakka=MissionReports

A random fit from Battleclinic that looks decent (choose appropriate hardeners for the mission damage types):

[Dominix, Dominix: LVL 4 dual rep domi]
Large Armor Repairer II
Large Armor Repairer II
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II

Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II
Cap Recharger II

Dual Heavy Beam Laser I
Heavy Diminishing Power System Drain I
Heavy Diminishing Power System Drain I
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I


Hammerhead II
Ogre II
Hobgoblin II
Dirk Magnum
Spearhead Endeavors
#7 - 2012-07-28 03:27:51 UTC
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Dual Heavy Beam Laser I
Heavy Diminishing Power System Drain I
Heavy Diminishing Power System Drain I
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I
Drone Link Augmentor I


Three DLA's extend your drone control range beyond the targeting limit of the Dominix without a range mod. Probably better to put a remote repping mod so you can fix your drones if you aggro badly.

                      "LIVE FAST DIE." - traditional Minmatar ethos [citation needed]

malaire
#8 - 2012-07-28 05:55:38 UTC
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
edit: one more thing, about fitting.... in the fitting screen, the rigs don't seem to contribute to the "cap stable" indicator thingy. Am I crazy, or is it bugged to not add to the cap time in the fitting screen?

They should be counted just like any other cap mod. Are you using Large Capacitor Control Circuit I ? (I'm not sure if there are other capasitor rigs, but this is the most used.)

New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else

Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-07-28 06:49:28 UTC
malaire wrote:
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
edit: one more thing, about fitting.... in the fitting screen, the rigs don't seem to contribute to the "cap stable" indicator thingy. Am I crazy, or is it bugged to not add to the cap time in the fitting screen?

They should be counted just like any other cap mod. Are you using Large Capacitor Control Circuit I ? (I'm not sure if there are other capasitor rigs, but this is the most used.)


It's something I noticed in my Vexor all the time, and my Domi once. Cap recharge modules would give me more time on the timer, while rigs wouldn't affect the display at all. It felt like they were functioning, during my missions, it just didn't seem to be displaying properly in the fit window.

Or it could just be from too much drugs, I guess... Smile
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#10 - 2012-07-28 10:37:24 UTC
Dirk Magnum wrote:
Three DLA's extend your drone control range beyond the targeting limit of the Dominix without a range mod. Probably better to put a remote repping mod so you can fix your drones if you aggro badly.

Probably. Though drones will respond to things you cannot target. More useful with sentry drones though.

Also, I did warn it was a random Battleclinic fit Blink
Louis deGuerre
The Dark Tribe
#11 - 2012-07-28 11:55:25 UTC
As mentioned earlier, unless you rely on godlike tank and/or sentry drones, always keep moving.

If you are using guns, you will also want to move to reduce your tracking penalty. Either head straight toward your target if it is far or fly straight away (using keep at range). Both will reduce your tracking penalty (so will flying parallel but that won't happen with NPCs).
Eija-Riitta Veitonen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-07-28 15:49:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Eija-Riitta Veitonen
Been doing level 4s in a battleship since before i can remember, and the only situation where i move on the mission is when i need to get to the other accel. gate.
This said, however, kiting in battleship is pretty much possible, however, you'd most likely need a long or very-long range weaponry, such as cruise missiles, tachyon beam lasers, 1400mm artillery or 425mm railguns to accomplish that. However, it requires more skill as a player and as a character, because the mentioned weapons (save for cruise missiles) require greater fitting than their close range counterparts (drones need no skill). And kiting while using sentries isn't exactly a good idea, because you'll get to scoot back over to them to pick them up. Unless you use disposable sentries.
As for missioning in domi (done that myself, and still sometimes do), it's usually way more straight-forward. You just slap as much tank on it as you can get - usually dual-rep armor tank, although as of lately i'm more inclined to fit shield spiders or active burst shield tank, but those are more advanced fitting strategies and spiders always involve more than one character.
And don't forget to add some of those shiny new drone damage modules as well.
Keno Skir
#13 - 2012-07-29 16:45:27 UTC
I tend to kite high damage lvl4's in my abaddon with a mwd, dispite heavy armor plates. While i realise a battleship won't go fast enough to notice damage reduction, it will go fast enough to stay ahead of most mission rats bigger than a destroyer. I aggro everything then fly round in wide circles trailing the herd behind me to mitigate my bad tracking and keep dps low from everything not long range fit. Eventually it's just a case of popping frigs at range soon as you warp in, then orbiting at 500m/s trailing the flock and popping them in order of dps on me.

Hope that helps o/
Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-07-29 18:34:39 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:
I tend to kite high damage lvl4's in my abaddon with a mwd, dispite heavy armor plates. While i realise a battleship won't go fast enough to notice damage reduction, it will go fast enough to stay ahead of most mission rats bigger than a destroyer. I aggro everything then fly round in wide circles trailing the herd behind me to mitigate my bad tracking and keep dps low from everything not long range fit. Eventually it's just a case of popping frigs at range soon as you warp in, then orbiting at 500m/s trailing the flock and popping them in order of dps on me.

Hope that helps o/


I think I ran into a bad combo of sentry towers, web frigs, and battleships. Took out the sentry towers first, since they normally tore me up bad, but then the frigs caught me... So I'm sure there's more that I did wrong than just kiting, but for now, I'll try a slow and steady tanking approach. Thanks for all the help folks.
Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#15 - 2012-07-29 20:49:11 UTC
Drone interfacing V, gallente BS V and T2 hobgoblins and frigates are least of your worries. Blink
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#16 - 2012-07-29 20:58:37 UTC
I am just going to drop this here as an idea. I run active-shield tanked mission ships myself. I build them to have at least 10 minutes of cap, but I never complain if I can make them cap stable. Below is a active shield tanked Domi that is based on having no skills but uses low-skill items and is already cap stable (remove capacitor flux units as skills permit). You would switch out the hardeners depending on the mission, but at base this is a 71/60/40/50 (em/th/kn/ex).


[Dominix, Domi Simple Shield Tank xl]
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I
Beta Reactor Control: Capacitor Flux I
[empty low slot]
[empty low slot]

'Copasetic' Particle Field Acceleration
Large C5-L Emergency Shield Overload I
Heat Dissipation Field I
Photon Scattering Field I
Photon Scattering Field I

[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]
[empty high slot]

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I

I had some something simialr once as a drone boat/aggro tanking boat for a new group of players I was working wiith (cap stable)

[Dominix, USS Wolverine]
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II
Capacitor Flux Coil II

Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
100MN Afterburner II
X-Large Shield Booster II

Drone Link Augmentor I
200mm AutoCannon II, EMP S <- Never trained hybrids, was dealing with frigates that attacked the group
200mm AutoCannon II, EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, EMP S

Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I
Large Drone Control Range Augmentor I

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet

Keno Skir
#17 - 2012-07-30 04:26:32 UTC
Adalynne Rohks wrote:
I think I ran into a bad combo of sentry towers, web frigs, and battleships. Took out the sentry towers first, since they normally tore me up bad, but then the frigs caught me... So I'm sure there's more that I did wrong than just kiting, but for now, I'll try a slow and steady tanking approach. Thanks for all the help folks.


My general mission rule is that all frigates are primary until i'm satisfied all the ones with webs or scrams are dead. Gotta jump straight on em soon as you land before they get a chance to aggro and approach. That said once they start to approach your targeting computers gonna have a much easier time popping them due to reduced orbital velocity.

In missions where there is no initial pocket aggro (Eve Survival.com) turn180 as you land and burn away to max targeting range. Target all the frigates in your selected group and pop off a shot to aggro. With a mwd active or even pulsed a battleship can maintain well over 500m/s, it's not going to outrun the frigates but it will dramaticaly increase their intercept time giving you plenty of time to 1-shot them as they approach from extreme range. Once all the frigates are dead you can relax (assuming no spawns, again see eve survival) and kite the rest as normal. No need to worry about damage so much by that point since you can warp in and out with no scrams on you.
Lost Greybeard
Drunken Yordles
#18 - 2012-07-30 05:05:56 UTC
A dominix specifically is slow and heavy. Fit a very heavy tank and rely primarily on drones for damage. A double-repper armor tank with capacitor rigs works well, as does a lighter but still pretty hefty shield tank. You probably don't want to worry about your railguns too much... honestly, at low skill levels, you may not even want to bother putting full-sized guns on, small or medium blasters to kill tackling frigates or even saying "**** it" and just filling your highs with tractor beams and salvagers (and one civilian blaster for getting aggro) will serve you as well or better.

Once you have better secondary skills and you don't need to itemize as hard to do decent damage, you'll likely want to move to a somewhat lighter tank (for armor, a single repper with repair rigs) and some large T2 rails and start relying on DPS instead of tank for survival (just killing stuff before it kills you). You're still not going to be able to kite much, though, the ship is just too heavy and doesn't have enough base speed to kite anything but other BSes without an MWD (which is probably a waste of your time, though you're welcome to build an MWD Domi if you want, obviously).

This doesn't necessarily apply to all or even most battleships, though, the other two Gal BSes rely on hybrids primarily rather than drones so they need to be run a bit more mobile.
Lilliana Stelles
#19 - 2012-07-30 13:07:23 UTC
MadMuppet wrote:
-snip-


Autocannons and ABs work wonders on a machariel, but this isn't what Domi's are designed for.

The shield tank+kiting works much better in a faster ship.

Not a forum alt. 

Adalynne Rohks
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-07-30 16:53:56 UTC
I'd just like to thank all the helpful folk, again. Big smile

So far, my new Domi has lasted approximately 300% longer than the first iteration. Seems alot safer now, too! Hopefully I'll be able to finish at least 5 L4 missions before I blow it up, this time. Smile
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