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Tech Rebuff
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Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#141 - 2012-07-28 12:59:23 UTC
i have another great idea

all sov in the game should drop every three months so ~small alliances~ can get a chance

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Lady Zarrina
New Eden Browncoats
#142 - 2012-07-28 12:59:28 UTC
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)

EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#143 - 2012-07-28 12:59:47 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
I never said complete database.

Since they have put work into making one, we should not mess with anything that would nullify this work. Is that what I am hearing?

I don't care if there are 1 million moons, you don't need to know about every moon in the universe.


Yes you do. Every moon is potentially valuable, so every moon would need to be re-scanned.


Asuming that the mid-grade moon scanning probe was used & taking in to account flight & recording times, how many man-hours would you estimate that it would take to re-scan 160k moons every 3 months?


https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1708944#post1708944

I did a calculation including only flight times between moons. It discounted recording time, discounted the probe time at the end of each system, discounted resupply. Everything but the time it takes to align away, warp, land, align to moon, shot probe.

5300 Man Hours.


Somewhere beween 7 & 8 months.

Rotating moons every 3 months is clearly a great idea. It definately wouldn't give huge coalitions a reason to hold every single moon in the game, just in case.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Lady Zarrina
New Eden Browncoats
#144 - 2012-07-28 13:01:31 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
i have another great idea

all sov in the game should drop every three months so ~small alliances~ can get a chance



Wow never thought I would hear a goon suggest such a wonderful idea..... LOL

Now, where did I say a redistribution needs to be done every 3 months?

EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#145 - 2012-07-28 13:02:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Mallak Azaria
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)


The suggested change of rotating moons every 3 months would effectively cripple small alliances & just give the large ones another reason to hold a monopoly on everything. The idea is literally as stupid as the "Capital BPO's shouldn't be allowed to be copied so small alliances will stand a chance" idea that someone came up with last week.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Pipa Porto
#146 - 2012-07-28 13:18:00 UTC
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)



Why is it better to randomly redistribute the bottleneck product than to fix the bottleneck.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Phill Esteen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#147 - 2012-07-28 13:23:11 UTC
Many years ago I scanned one constellation for moon materials, probably less than 150 moons in total.

I was only deinstitutionalized very recently and I am still kept under close supervision for my own safety.

– postum faex est – 

never forget
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#148 - 2012-07-28 13:24:47 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)


The suggested change of rotating moons every 3 months would effectively cripple small alliances & just give the large ones another reason to hold a monopoly on everything. The idea is literally as stupid as the "Capital BPO's shouldn't be allowed to be copied so small alliances will stand a chance" idea that someone came up with last week.

Wait, what.

How expensive is a Moros BPO nowadays?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Pipa Porto
#149 - 2012-07-28 13:25:56 UTC
Phill Esteen wrote:
Many years ago I scanned one constellation for moon materials, probably less than 150 moons in total.

I was only deinstitutionalized very recently and I am still kept under close supervision for my own safety.


That's an awfully small constellation.

There are plenty of systems with ~80 moons.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Lady Zarrina
New Eden Browncoats
#150 - 2012-07-28 13:27:00 UTC
Phill Esteen wrote:
Many years ago I scanned one constellation for moon materials, probably less than 150 moons in total.

I was only deinstitutionalized very recently and I am still kept under close supervision for my own safety.



Sounds like moon scanning needs to be improved.

EVE: All about Flying Frisky and Making Iskie
Phill Esteen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#151 - 2012-07-28 13:27:35 UTC
:lowsec:

– postum faex est – 

never forget
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#152 - 2012-07-28 13:28:13 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)



Why is it better to randomly redistribute the bottleneck product than to fix the bottleneck.


because publords think that they will get a chance at a personal tech moon

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Pipa Porto
#153 - 2012-07-28 13:28:37 UTC
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Phill Esteen wrote:
Many years ago I scanned one constellation for moon materials, probably less than 150 moons in total.

I was only deinstitutionalized very recently and I am still kept under close supervision for my own safety.



Sounds like moon scanning needs to be improved.



Got an idea for how to improve it?

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Phill Esteen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#154 - 2012-07-28 13:34:17 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Sounds like moon scanning needs to be improved.

Got an idea for how to improve it?

Remove it, put moon resources into the database dump instead.

After that no-one will be permitted to complain about null-sec being stagnant.

– postum faex est – 

never forget
Pipa Porto
#155 - 2012-07-28 13:36:24 UTC
Phill Esteen wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Sounds like moon scanning needs to be improved.

Got an idea for how to improve it?

Remove it, put moon resources into the database dump instead.

After that no-one will be permitted to complain about null-sec being stagnant.


I think that's a terrible idea from a lore perspective, but a wonderful idea from a humanitarian perspective.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#156 - 2012-07-28 13:41:41 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Phill Esteen wrote:
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Sounds like moon scanning needs to be improved.

Got an idea for how to improve it?

Remove it, put moon resources into the database dump instead.

After that no-one will be permitted to complain about null-sec being stagnant.


I think that's a terrible idea from a lore perspective, but a wonderful idea from a humanitarian perspective.


moon scanning is tedious, but not a huge PITA otherwise

however, whoever designed POS management should face charges for crimes against humanity

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#157 - 2012-07-28 13:47:05 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
Again, just cause you want to know about every moon, doesn't mean you need to know about every moon. These numbers are meaningless and at best spread across all of null/low sec.

But again, there is the fear factor of the unknown. Null sec is running scared :)


The suggested change of rotating moons every 3 months would effectively cripple small alliances & just give the large ones another reason to hold a monopoly on everything. The idea is literally as stupid as the "Capital BPO's shouldn't be allowed to be copied so small alliances will stand a chance" idea that someone came up with last week.

Wait, what.

How expensive is a Moros BPO nowadays?


Not too expensive, but it was more the context of the change. He basically wanted it so only BPO's could be used to produce any capital ship, module or component & only allow 1 run to be set, meaning manual input for say, 120 capital armour plate runs. Doesn't really affect established alliances, but would affect small not-so-organised alliances. I will try to find the thread.

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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#158 - 2012-07-28 13:49:39 UTC
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Not too expensive, but it was more the context of the change. He basically wanted it so only BPO's could be used to produce any capital ship, module or component & only allow 1 run to be set, meaning manual input for say, 120 capital armour plate runs. Doesn't really affect established alliances, but would affect small not-so-organised alliances. I will try to find the thread.

Uh.

So all the supercap producers will harm themselves?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Mallak Azaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#159 - 2012-07-28 13:56:08 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Mallak Azaria wrote:
Not too expensive, but it was more the context of the change. He basically wanted it so only BPO's could be used to produce any capital ship, module or component & only allow 1 run to be set, meaning manual input for say, 120 capital armour plate runs. Doesn't really affect established alliances, but would affect small not-so-organised alliances. I will try to find the thread.

Uh.

So all the supercap producers will harm themselves?


Probably not any less than POS refuellers currently do.

This post was lovingly crafted by a member of the Goonwaffe Posting Cabal, proud member of the popular gay hookup site somethingawful.com, Spelling Bee, Grammar Gestapo & #1 Official Gevlon Goblin Fanclub member.
Big Bossu
Primal Instinct Inc.
The Initiative.
#160 - 2012-07-28 13:56:43 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Lady Zarrina wrote:
So afraid of unknown. We might not be mining the most profitable moon..... Oh no. I need to know I am playing eve right (by the spreadsheet). Sigh.



Minimum 5300 Man hours every time it shuffles. And I made enough assumptions that I'd be comfortable quadrupling that to get a reasonable estimate. Then comes moving POSes around. Have you ever set up or taken down a Deathstar POS?


Moon scanning is also necessary to plan your attacks on a new region. So every time someone invades someone else's space that they haven't held before, you have scouts hunting down moons.


0.0 Region has like average of 80 systems. 40 moons is roughly average per system. That would take roughly 2 hours per system. Seeing how large 0.0 alliances are, this really isn't that much effort.