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Barge Fairy Tale

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James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1021 - 2012-07-27 05:53:56 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
did it predate crucible? did it have its hardeners running? did it have an obscene number of ships on its killmail? was it at war with the dudes who killed it?


All points are Irrelevant. Kill is a kill. Titan or 5000 Catalysts... Doesn't matter.

"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.

No... it's not...


I've ganked highsec mining barges a total of (I think) twice, while can flipping a handful of others. I don't even do any pvp at all in empire anymore, except for very rare excursions into lowsec. I'm not against this change because I'm a ganker myself and want to keep doing it, since I'm not a ganker (and my corp doesn't allow ganking of neuts in highsec anyway under most circumstances). I'm against this change because I realize how bad it is for the game, just as Mara Rinn is a MINER who recognizes what a stupid change this is.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Suqq Madiq
#1022 - 2012-07-27 05:55:41 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
This is a bad change and it stands on the objective fact that it essentially nerfs intelligent gameplay (read: tanking your miner) and rewards lazy, stupid gameplay (going AFK with a max-yield mining barge fitting absolutely no tank).


Except that this change in no way "nerfs intelligent gameplay". At the very worst this re-balance forces gankers to make a few more friends (crazy idea in an MMO, I know) and at best it diminishes the profitability of ganking. Miners are still going to be gankable in all but the most extreme circumstances that the chicken little crowd you're apart of seem to think will be the new norm.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1023 - 2012-07-27 05:56:30 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
did it predate crucible? did it have its hardeners running? did it have an obscene number of ships on its killmail? was it at war with the dudes who killed it?


All points are Irrelevant. Kill is a kill. Titan or 5000 Catalysts... Doesn't matter.

"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.


the height of irony is when the risk-averse hisec miner complains about "nullbears" who face infinitely more risk than he does for the marginally higher reward

nobody said that a tanked hulk cannot be ganked, please don't put words in our mouths

we said that a tanked hulk would not be worth bothering with unless somebody was hell-bent on killing you anyway

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Pipa Porto
#1024 - 2012-07-27 05:56:43 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
did it predate crucible? did it have its hardeners running? did it have an obscene number of ships on its killmail? was it at war with the dudes who killed it?


All points are Irrelevant. Kill is a kill. Titan or 5000 Catalysts... Doesn't matter.

"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.


Nope. Never said that.

We said it cannot be ganked profitably if properly fit (the kill in question had a Roid Scanner as part of his tankRoll). In addition, if you go to a higher sec band, the cost to gank a properly tanked hulk quickly becomes prohibitive.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1025 - 2012-07-27 05:56:57 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:
Travis117 wrote:
Waaa waaaaa were going to have a harder time ganking like the l33t pvpers waaaaaaa. Wanna kill people? Go to lowsec or nullsec


You need to understand how Trammel ruined Ultima Online. The designers gave the whingers such as yourself what they asked for, and the game died. Sure you could still log in and head out into the forest to kill NPCs and take their gold, but there was no longer any danger in playing the game. There was no need to interact with other people: you didn't need a posse to have a chance of coming back from a hunting expedition alive.

Those who do not learn history are doomed to repeat it.
...
We're doomed.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Suqq Madiq
#1026 - 2012-07-27 05:58:50 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.

No... it's not...


To be fair, a large number of your cronies, including Ruby and Richard have been beating this nugget of dead horse around for quite awhile. It's been proven incorrect on a number of occasions, but they still believe it.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1027 - 2012-07-27 05:59:35 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
This is a bad change and it stands on the objective fact that it essentially nerfs intelligent gameplay (read: tanking your miner) and rewards lazy, stupid gameplay (going AFK with a max-yield mining barge fitting absolutely no tank).


Except that this change in no way "nerfs intelligent gameplay". At the very worst this re-balance forces gankers to make a few more friends (crazy idea in an MMO, I know) and at best it diminishes the profitability of ganking. Miners are still going to be gankable in all but the most extreme circumstances that the chicken little crowd you're apart of seem to think will be the new norm.

It absolutely does, because there's no longer any incentive for miners to make intelligent choices about defending themselves.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1028 - 2012-07-27 05:59:35 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
Except that this change in no way "nerfs intelligent gameplay". At the very worst this re-balance forces gankers to make a few more friends (crazy idea in an MMO, I know) and at best it diminishes the profitability of ganking. Miners are still going to be gankable in all but the most extreme circumstances that the chicken little crowd you're apart of seem to think will be the new norm.


except that the miners themselves are hypocrites who refuse to work with other players, refuse to take active measures to protect themselves, refuse to adapt in any way, shape or form, while telling those who hunt them that they should adapt like "everyone else" - except the miners, of course, who should never have to adapt to a hostile environment because they should not need to play the game

the gankers will adapt, they will continue preying on you and you will continue to whine

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1029 - 2012-07-27 06:00:18 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
To be fair, a large number of your cronies, including Ruby and Richard have been beating this nugget of dead horse around for quite awhile. It's been proven incorrect on a number of occasions, but they still believe it.


please don't put words in my mouth, npc alt

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1030 - 2012-07-27 06:01:39 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
did it predate crucible? did it have its hardeners running? did it have an obscene number of ships on its killmail? was it at war with the dudes who killed it?


All points are Irrelevant. Kill is a kill. Titan or 5000 Catalysts... Doesn't matter.

"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.


Nope. Never said that.

We said it cannot be ganked profitably if properly fit (the kill in question had a Roid Scanner as part of his tankRoll). In addition, if you go to a higher sec band, the cost to gank a properly tanked hulk quickly becomes prohibitive.


hahahaha "why should I bother fitting a thermic hardener which substantially increases my ability to survive a gank attempt by the most popular exhumer hunting ship in the game, no, I should use that midslot for a roid scanner that works just as well on an ibis"

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1031 - 2012-07-27 06:01:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
Richard Desturned wrote:
the height of irony is when the risk-averse hisec miner complains about "nullbears" who face infinitely more risk than he does for the marginally higher reward

nobody said that a tanked hulk cannot be ganked, please don't put words in our mouths

we said that a tanked hulk would not be worth bothering with unless somebody was hell-bent on killing you anyway


Nullsec is safe space if you're in big alliance.

- You see red in local -> you warp all your PVE ships to POS and jump into PVP ship
- Hundreds of intel channels
- Triage carriers (if you need "healing")
And so on...

It's dangerous space only if you let it to be.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1032 - 2012-07-27 06:02:26 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
"Tanked Hulk can't be ganked" is what you nullbears keep saying.

No... it's not...


To be fair, a large number of your cronies, including Ruby and Richard have been beating this nugget of dead horse around for quite awhile. It's been proven incorrect on a number of occasions, but they still believe it.

lol cronies. I'm flattered you think I have that kind of standing.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Suqq Madiq
#1033 - 2012-07-27 06:02:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Suqq Madiq
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Suqq Madiq wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
This is a bad change and it stands on the objective fact that it essentially nerfs intelligent gameplay (read: tanking your miner) and rewards lazy, stupid gameplay (going AFK with a max-yield mining barge fitting absolutely no tank).


Except that this change in no way "nerfs intelligent gameplay". At the very worst this re-balance forces gankers to make a few more friends (crazy idea in an MMO, I know) and at best it diminishes the profitability of ganking. Miners are still going to be gankable in all but the most extreme circumstances that the chicken little crowd you're apart of seem to think will be the new norm.

It absolutely does, because there's no longer any incentive for miners to make intelligent choices about defending themselves.


You're reaching. Adding EHP does not make mining barges into ungankable fortresses. It makes them less profitable to gank. That's it.
Sabrina Solette
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1034 - 2012-07-27 06:02:42 UTC
Herr Wilkus wrote:
Defeated, the ganker slinks off in his pod, and the smart little Miner scoops the Talos wreckage and sells it for a tidy profit."






Although in my experience this won't happen. The Hulk moves to slowly, before the Hulk gets there he's warped in with a second account and picked up the wreakage.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1035 - 2012-07-27 06:04:12 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Nullsec is safe space if you're in big alliance.

- You see red in local -> you warp all your PVE ships to POS and jump into PVP ship
- Hundreds of intel channels
- Triage carriers (if you need "healing")
And so on...


since it's so safe why don't you pack up and move to 0.0?

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1036 - 2012-07-27 06:04:52 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
You're reaching. Adding EHP does not make mining barges into ungankable fortresses. It makes them less profitable to gank. That's it.


on that note, so does fitting a tank /right now/

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#1037 - 2012-07-27 06:04:56 UTC
Suqq Madiq wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Suqq Madiq wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
This is a bad change and it stands on the objective fact that it essentially nerfs intelligent gameplay (read: tanking your miner) and rewards lazy, stupid gameplay (going AFK with a max-yield mining barge fitting absolutely no tank).


Except that this change in no way "nerfs intelligent gameplay". At the very worst this re-balance forces gankers to make a few more friends (crazy idea in an MMO, I know) and at best it diminishes the profitability of ganking. Miners are still going to be gankable in all but the most extreme circumstances that the chicken little crowd you're apart of seem to think will be the new norm.

It absolutely does, because there's no longer any incentive for miners to make intelligent choices about defending themselves.


You're reaching. Adding EHP does not make mining barges into ungankable fortresses. It makes them less profitable to gank. That's it.

Why can't you add the EHP yourself? Why does CCP have to do it for you?

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1038 - 2012-07-27 06:05:46 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
since it's so safe why don't you pack up and move to 0.0?


Because I would be killed by Goons before I could get out of lowsec.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1039 - 2012-07-27 06:05:47 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Why can't you add the EHP yourself? Why does CCP have to do it for you?


miners are special snowflakes who should not be burdened with difficult decisions like "should I give up yield or drastically increase the ability of my ship to survive a gank?"

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#1040 - 2012-07-27 06:06:14 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Because I would be killed by Goons before I could get out of lowsec.


silly, you only need to join a corp, set your clone to one of their stations and self-destruct an empty pod

fly your ships out to lowsec drop-offs with alts, move them to your new home in a carrier

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration