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Barge Fairy Tale

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Sarcasim
HOW to PEG SAFETY
#461 - 2012-07-26 16:34:46 UTC
Would someone please call the WHAAAAMBULANCE...we seem to have alot of butthurt people in eve.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#462 - 2012-07-26 16:34:56 UTC
Ditra Vorthran wrote:
Unless you've been staring over my shoulder watching how/when/where I mine, you can't answer that question, so stop putting words in my mouth.

And no, no one has ever successfuly ganked me.


Great, and if you put effort towards not getting ganked, you benefited from doing so - you definitely had an advantage over the miners who refused to fit a tank, refused to not go AFK and kept losing Hulks considering that prices of low-ends are through the roof.

Now, you won't gain any advantage from not going AFK. Your ship is equally safe whether you are vigilant at your keyboard or doing your laundry and shoveling your driveway.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Dave stark
#463 - 2012-07-26 16:35:00 UTC
Pipa Porto wrote:
Dave stark wrote:
Dramaticus wrote:
I HAVE TO FIT SOMETHING OTHER THAN MINING LASER UPGRADES IF I WANT TO SURVIVE THIS IS AN OUTRAGE CCP AS A LOYAL CUSTOMER I DEMAND SATISFACTION THIS IS AGAINST MY CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS


it's more to do with the fact that the hulk can't fit a tank without fitting mods that's the issue. having to tank my hulk is fine; however the hulk doesn't have the fitting requirements to do so without fitting mods.

i've never had to use fitting mods to fit a combat ship, ever. combat ships have the power grid and cpu to fill all their mid and low slots without fitting mods, why should a hulk be forced to use fitting mods to fill all the slots on the ship?


The following combat ships require at least one fitting mod.
Arty Cane
Every Logistics ship Ever.
Hellcats (that T2 Elutrition rig? That's a fitting mod)
100mn Tengus (Officer Fitting mods, even).
Stealth Bombers
Fleet Dictors
AHACs (Zealots need their RCU)
Sniper HACs

You haven't flown many combat ships, have you?


none on that list, no.
pussnheels
Viziam
#464 - 2012-07-26 16:35:24 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
pussnheels wrote:


This is a factual post if you ignore the fact that all 3 exhumers could be tanked, the rise in ships was mostly down to massive inflation and minerals jumped due to drone alloy nerf. Or in other words, you just lied.


i didn't asked nor do i want the opinion of a goon or one of their puppies , it are the crybabies that make up most of your alliances that keeps EVE from evolving into a total game where there is a place for ALL sort of playstyles

sure you can tank any exhumer but that isn't the point
my point is that none of you pvp zealots can give a solid answer on why people should not be allowed to afk mine maybe earning 10 mil / hour at beqst all the while you nullseccers can afk your moon goo

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#465 - 2012-07-26 16:36:14 UTC
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8131/herrwhenidowilkuss.png

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#466 - 2012-07-26 16:37:08 UTC
Danny Diamonds wrote:
So you can't be bothered to bring more dps to the fight? I fail to see the issue.
Maybe if you tried reading.

It has nothing to do with DPS. It has to do with the lead game designer using a thoroughly and completely discredited balance concept that became obsolete somewhere in the early Triassic era — a view on balance that simply does not work, and which has been proven beyond any doubt not to work time and time again (and which is responsible for one of the most egregious imbalances this game has offered — one that they are struggling to correct to this day).
Danny Diamonds
Fabricated Reality
#467 - 2012-07-26 16:37:21 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
... Very good chance that some of them might shoot back.


I think this is the major issue for the gankers; they don't want a fair fight or even a target. They just want free loot, guaranteed to be worth more than their calculated loss.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#468 - 2012-07-26 16:37:35 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Not necessarily, but Soundwave saying "well you should lose more than the victim in hisec" along with what I've seen of their intentions with the insurance nerf, Crimewatch, this dumbing down of the game - yeah, welcome to a risk-free hisec.


Soundwave didn't say that.

If you find a shuttle full of PLEXes or freighter full of officer mods go ahead and do whatever you want. If they're stupid enough to haul those they really deserve to lose it. How much is salvage worth? Not much. Most of your profit comes from items dropped from cargohold.

Ganking a Hulk and getting 25M worth of salvage from wreck is different story.

Or just go shoot people in lowsec/nullsec/wormhole. Very good chance that some of them might shoot back.


You haven't heard of Crimewatch, have you?

And quit saying "well if u wan2 pvp go to lo/nul/wh cuz thts whar evry1 pvps" - I haven't suicide ganked anything in hisec since our ice interdiction, but I don't believe that hisec should be a safe, fun, happy carebear land.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Danny Diamonds
Fabricated Reality
#469 - 2012-07-26 16:39:21 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Danny Diamonds wrote:
So you can't be bothered to bring more dps to the fight? I fail to see the issue.
Maybe if you tried reading.

It has nothing to do with DPS. It has to do with the lead game designer using a thoroughly and completely discredited balance concept that became obsolete somewhere in the early Triassic era — a view on balance that simply does not work, and which has been proven beyond any doubt not to work time and time again (and which is responsible for one of the most egregious imbalances this game has offered — one that they are struggling to correct to this day).



I don't think his comments were off mark in any way *IF* we consider context. If it is a blanket statement, then I might be more curious/concerned. But I am not.
dexington
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#470 - 2012-07-26 16:40:09 UTC  |  Edited by: dexington
Richard Desturned wrote:
dexington wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
... this dumbing down of the game - yeah, welcome to a risk-free hisec.


How can it be dumping down the game, when they make it harder for the gankers?


oh right, I forgot that gankers are actually the only players in the equation here

hint: they made it easier for the miners


hint: primarily in hi-sec, where it should be hard to gank miners... somehow it makes sense.

if anything the game was dumped down so the self proclaimed hardcore pvp'ers could gank miners in hi-sec, now that it's going to take just a little skills/brains to find someone to gank, the same people are crying "the end of eve"...

I'm a relatively respectable citizen. Multiple felon perhaps, but certainly not dangerous.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#471 - 2012-07-26 16:43:47 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:


yes, it is, if the guy in the 300m ship did nothing to repel that gank

CCP is literally throwing ship balance out the window.



A) Can you provide ANY other case where a destroyer can suicide gank a ship of similar value besides a hulk? The "gank balance" on the current hulk is horribly out of wack, even when using 3 destroyers to kill a tanked hulk. Look at the values of some other common ganked ships. Pimped marauders, pimped faction BSes, freighters, orcas, industrials. Compared to the hull price these ship types require quite a bit of damage from several ships to be taken down with the exception of the indies which in most cases have a hull value less than a single destroyer.

By this logic it should only take maybe 6-8 destroyers at most to kill an orca but even an untanked orca should be able to shrug that off.

B) Ship balance is a concept and not a physical object, it cannot be thrown anywhere.

The Drake is a Lie
Pipa Porto
#472 - 2012-07-26 16:45:07 UTC
dexington wrote:
hint: primarily in hi-sec, where it should be hard to gank miners... somehow it makes sense.

if anything the game was dumped down so the self proclaimed hardcore pvp'ers could gank miners in hi-sec, now that it's going to take just a little skills/brains to find someone to gank, the same people are crying "the end of eve"...



It is exactly as hard to gank miners in HS as they make it.

If you fit a moderately tanked Hulk and mine in a highish sec band, you can't be profitably ganked.
If you mine aligned, you can't be ganked at all.
If you fit a brick tank you your Hulk, you can mine wherever you want in HS, and you can't be profitably ganked.
If you bring RR, ECM (including drones), or a blap Nado friend, your moderately tanked Hulk won't be able to be profitably ganked anywhere either (even including the GSF bounties).

It's only easy to gank miners in HS because the miners don't do anything at all to protect themselves.

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#473 - 2012-07-26 16:45:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
dexington wrote:
hint: primarily in hi-sec, where it should be hard to gank miners
Why?

Or, more precisely: why does it need to be harder than it is, seeing as how the miners already have to actively choose to make it worth-while?

Danny Diamonds wrote:
I don't think his comments were off mark in any way *IF* we consider context.
The context doesn't matter. He's either using it as a blanket statement, or he's using it about a specific group, meaning that for some reason, they should abide by different rules than the rest of the game. Either way, it's the same deeply flawed balancing concept that has only ever managed to make things unbalanced.

I hereby demand that it should take at least 10bn worth of ships to kill my Nomad.
pussnheels
Viziam
#474 - 2012-07-26 16:45:52 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
[quote=Richard Desturned]
Or just go shoot people in lowsec/nullsec/wormhole. Very good chance that some of them might shoot back.


You haven't heard of Crimewatch, have you?

And quit saying "well if u wan2 pvp go to lo/nul/wh cuz thts whar evry1 pvps" - I haven't suicide ganked anything in hisec since our ice interdiction, but I don't believe that hisec should be a safe, fun, happy carebear land.


and you are right about high sec shouldn't; any other way and it will kill the whole game and i be"lieve it will never be

i only believe that people should play how they want to play yhe game and not being forced to do things they donj't like
and if they refuse to mine smart they will fall victim sooner or later even with these new barges/exhumers

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#475 - 2012-07-26 16:47:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Jorma Morkkis
Richard Desturned wrote:
You haven't heard of Crimewatch, have you?

And quit saying "well if u wan2 pvp go to lo/nul/wh cuz thts whar evry1 pvps" - I haven't suicide ganked anything in hisec since our ice interdiction, but I don't believe that hisec should be a safe, fun, happy carebear land.


It's "safe, happy carebear land" if you let it to be.

1) Get GCC'd
2) I'll show you how safe it really is
3) ???
4) Profit
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#476 - 2012-07-26 16:47:24 UTC
Skippermonkey wrote:
http://img338.imageshack.us/img338/8131/herrwhenidowilkuss.png


lol.

I try.....at least until the ISD gets a hold of them.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#477 - 2012-07-26 16:47:41 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
A) Can you provide ANY other case where a destroyer can suicide gank a ship of similar value besides a hulk? The "gank balance" on the current hulk is horribly out of wack, even when using 3 destroyers to kill a tanked hulk. Look at the values of some other common ganked ships. Pimped marauders, pimped faction BSes, freighters, orcas, industrials. Compared to the hull price these ship types require quite a bit of damage from several ships to be taken down with the exception of the indies which in most cases have a hull value less than a single destroyer.

By this logic it should only take maybe 6-8 destroyers at most to kill an orca but even an untanked orca should be able to shrug that off.

B) Ship balance is a concept and not a physical object, it cannot be thrown anywhere.


So because a Hulk costs 300 million ISK, I should be able to outmine it in a faction battleship, simply because it costs more.

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Pipa Porto
#478 - 2012-07-26 16:47:53 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
A) Can you provide ANY other case where a destroyer can suicide gank a ship of similar value besides a hulk?


Fit the same way as most of the Hulks on the GSF KB, yes. Every AHAC. Every Recon.

Fit a Tank on your Hulk, and you tank as well as most AHACs (quite a bit better than the Vaga or Deimos, in fact).

EvE: Everyone vs Everyone

-RubyPorto
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#479 - 2012-07-26 16:48:52 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
A) Can you provide ANY other case where a destroyer can suicide gank a ship of similar value besides a hulk?
pretty much any untanked T2 cruiser

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#480 - 2012-07-26 16:50:35 UTC
ITT, failed pvp'ers crying about not being able to kill miners