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The Complete and utter failure of our Golden Fleet

Author
Lucas Raholan
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
#1 - 2012-07-24 21:45:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Raholan
Having recently payed attention to FW statistics and roamed through the contested region between the Amarr and Minmater I have been appalled at the Amarrain nations inability to hold onto anything let alone take anything.

Almost as soon as I leave amarian high sec into low I appear in Minmater controlled space, local completely empty bar the odd pirate and no sign of our militia, the Tribal's in their rust buckets openly discuss our shambles of a militia.

This has called myself to question our ability to fight, upon last checking we controlled a meager 4 systems in the contested territory with Minmater forces encroaching from all sides. Have we just given up or is this a new strategy among my Amarr cousins, to simply let people beneath us if not in culture then in technology walk all over us, how much further are we going to let the Minmater shame us in defeat after defeat.
Without a proper defense they will soon have their fleets above our throne worlds once more taken those who have worked so hard towards their enlightenment, where they will finally become one with our faith and walk among us.

Jamyl can only save us once, we still don't fully understand how she destroyed the elder fleet the first time, rumors range from the might of God himself to Jovian technology.

And reports are even coming through regarding the mere mortal ground troops, those without the immortal powers of the capsuleers are abandoning the fight, not those expected to be low on morale but those with high morale, those with a pure talent simply going MIA. Clearly once they see us immortals retreating in either fear or lack of morale they understandably view it as the end and leave before their mortal lives are cut short by the rampaging Minmater. Further information on this can be found in the following article made available through Scope news and exceedingly more worrying is that it appears to effect all factions MIA Troops

Amarr get together, get organised and fight back

Lucas Raholan

Shitposts so bad CONCORD gave me a 50 billion ISK bounty

Rall Mekin
End-of-Line
#2 - 2012-07-24 22:25:56 UTC
Not surprising, considering Amarr has been in decline for quite some time.
Henry Kaine
Royal Amarr Institute
#3 - 2012-07-24 22:59:17 UTC
Wars fought with words and egotism seldom last long. With the barbarians at the gates, the rulling class simply does nothing but pontificate on and on about the power of their god.

Prayers don't kill, well positioned munitions do. Violence is an easier religion to follow.
Azdan Amith
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-07-25 00:19:16 UTC
Henry Kaine wrote:
Wars fought with words and egotism seldom last long. With the barbarians at the gates, the rulling class simply does nothing but pontificate on and on about the power of their god.

Prayers don't kill, well positioned munitions do. Violence is an easier religion to follow.


Easier is not always right, Mister Kaine. The Empire is not filled with idle chatter about the power of God and the negligence of the threat at our door. The Empire is facing a period of tribulation at present, with trials ahead but we are not laying down our arms and we are not defeated.

~Archon Azdan Amith,  Order of Light's Retribution

Henry Kaine
Royal Amarr Institute
#5 - 2012-07-25 01:19:40 UTC
Azdan Amith wrote:
Henry Kaine wrote:
Wars fought with words and egotism seldom last long. With the barbarians at the gates, the rulling class simply does nothing but pontificate on and on about the power of their god.

Prayers don't kill, well positioned munitions do. Violence is an easier religion to follow.


Easier is not always right, Mister Kaine. The Empire is not filled with idle chatter about the power of God and the negligence of the threat at our door. The Empire is facing a period of tribulation at present, with trials ahead but we are not laying down our arms and we are not defeated.


Could've fooled me.
Azdan Amith
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-07-25 01:32:08 UTC
Henry Kaine wrote:
Could've fooled me.


I suspect that's a short trip.

~Archon Azdan Amith,  Order of Light's Retribution

Henry Kaine
Royal Amarr Institute
#7 - 2012-07-25 01:38:02 UTC
Azdan Amith wrote:
Henry Kaine wrote:
Could've fooled me.


I suspect that's a short trip.


Don't you have a sky god to go pray to? Or is it now that you've sacrificed your spine to organized religion, your flopping about is making it hard to do things?
Azdan Amith
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-07-25 02:35:30 UTC
I should warn you so you don't waste any more of your time, you can't anger me with idle words and instigation. I pray to God frequently and fervently yet still find time to accomplish things, as you eloquently put it.

~Archon Azdan Amith,  Order of Light's Retribution

Tarunik Raqalth'Qui
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-07-25 02:57:15 UTC
Speaking of the viewpoint of an outsider with sources, the Amarr Militia itself has been suffering from multiple social-organizational problems that combine to seriously damage its effectiveness as a fighting force in addition to driving many capable capsuleers out due to the inhospitable behavior of fellow Crusaders, or so I have heard at least. Furthermore, the TLF was able to organize and take advantage of some of these issues, having been able to sustain a high level of operational readiness for an extended period of time and then leverage that to not only take large amounts of territory from the Amarr, but hold a resilient battle line as well. Furthermore, CONCORD's recent changes to the directives governing the militia wars unintentionally further tipped the situation in the favor of the Minmatar Militia.

If the original poster wishes to contact me via a private channel to discuss the "shop" matters related to technological evolution within the cluster that have impacted the effectiveness of Amarrian vessels, he is free to do so.
Lyskal Oskold
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-07-25 03:33:19 UTC
The Imperial Crusaders I encounter usually flee and attempt to return in a fleet composed of larger, more technologically advanced vessels to assure an easy victory, which leads to the Minmatar avoiding them so as to avoid pointless losses.
At least that happens when you can actually find them. At the moment we're attempting to lure the 24th into pushing their lines forward so we actually have substantial targets. Difficult to dance with someone if they refuse to get on the stage.

I've heard one of large groups from lawless space is going to attempt to join the 24th Imperial Crusade in an effort to take advantage of their reward scheme. Let's hope their behavior won't lead to another stain on the 24th's honor like the failure of the mass produced Thrasher infusion another group tried...
Crusaders are wonderful opponents, they're just rare. The more common war profiteers tend to bring the chances of any possible conversation or fair engagement down though.

The Amarr need more man power and to lose the common thought process that you need battleships and battlecruisers to engage some frigates and a destroyer or two.

"Love is just a chemical, no matter the origin. We give it meaning by choice." - Eleanor Lamb

Azdan Amith
Doomheim
#11 - 2012-07-25 03:38:42 UTC
Lyskal Oskold wrote:

Crusaders are wonderful opponents, they're just rare. The more common war profiteers tend to bring the chances of any possible conversation or fair engagement down though.

The Amarr need more man power and to lose the common thought process that you need battleships and battlecruisers to engage some frigates and a destroyer or two.


This is an interesting viewpoint. While I may not condone combat for combat's sake or sport, I respect and admire those seeking an honorable engagement. Perhaps we will meet on the field of battle one day.

~Archon Azdan Amith,  Order of Light's Retribution

Istvaan Shogaatsu
Guiding Hand Social Club
#12 - 2012-07-25 03:48:36 UTC
It's simple. The Amarr are a wise people. They've seen the absolute pointlessness of this... circus-war.

Why fight a war with no objectives, no victories, no consequences and no end? The star systems in question have changed hands a dozen times before. Holding them doesn't give the Minmatar any sort of advantage. They won't dare step outside the CONCORD-sanctioned killing grounds, and if they try another invasion of the Throne worlds, I foresee it being about as successful as the last attempt.
Lyskal Oskold
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2012-07-25 04:01:42 UTC
Azdan Amith wrote:
Lyskal Oskold wrote:

Crusaders are wonderful opponents, they're just rare. The more common war profiteers tend to bring the chances of any possible conversation or fair engagement down though.

The Amarr need more man power and to lose the common thought process that you need battleships and battlecruisers to engage some frigates and a destroyer or two.


This is an interesting viewpoint. While I may not condone combat for combat's sake or sport, I respect and admire those seeking an honorable engagement. Perhaps we will meet on the field of battle one day.


Hopefully. It's a war that has to be waged, from either side. To abandon honor is to become a monster.
It's a shame so many profiteers have entered the conflict either side. I know the common capsuleer only cares about ISK, but it still aggravates me seeing them seep into Empire matters.
Hopefully they'll return into the lawless abyss and continue their horrendous crimes out there until a time when the 4 Empires can expand outwards. That could be an interesting turn of events... But I understand all 4 Empires are preoccupied with other matters.

The Amarr vs Minmatar conflict is a battle to the very foundations of what either stands for. The Minmatar must ride their hatred and thirst for vengeance until we're completely free, or we'll collapse into despair. The Amarr must push back and attempt to purify us and bring us back into the fold lest their entire faith and communal soul fails, they can't possibly fall.

Despite the immense emotion and the common view that slavery is flat out evil this conflict is far from black and white. Amarr should rally behind that fact. If the Amarr Empire truly is the only hope to save Humanity, their resolve must be absolute and their drive unstoppable. For all we know if the Amarr fail countless souls will never reach Heaven. It saddens me that Amarr seems to have the least amount of loyalists among capsuleers. The Empire should consider uplifting Amarr who actually behave like Amarr.

"Love is just a chemical, no matter the origin. We give it meaning by choice." - Eleanor Lamb

Amaki Mai
Doomheim
#14 - 2012-07-25 05:22:48 UTC
I wish there was a charismatic leader and an inspirational organisation to rally behind.
Mekhana
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2012-07-25 05:24:42 UTC
Henry Kaine wrote:
Wars fought with words and egotism seldom last long. With the barbarians at the gates, the rulling class simply does nothing but pontificate on and on about the power of their god.

Prayers don't kill, well positioned munitions do. Violence is an easier religion to follow.


An Amarr with common sense. Look at that.

Vide longe er eros di Luminaire VII, uni canse pra krage e determiniex! Sange por Sange! Descanse bravex eros, mie freires. Mortir por vostre Liberete, farmilie, ide e amis. lons Proviste sen mort! Luminaire liber mas! 

Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#16 - 2012-07-25 07:05:18 UTC
Perhaps if Mr Raholan feels that strongly he should leave the Imperial Academy and sign up with the militia.

I look forward to hearing about his progress.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#17 - 2012-07-25 07:16:46 UTC
I liken the problem in Amarr to a lack of volunteers.

I was in Amarr some time ago and hit up an agent for a mission. They wanted me to prove my loyalty by taking a cargo of slaves.

Needless to say I didn't stay there for long.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Lucas Raholan
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
#18 - 2012-07-25 08:07:16 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Perhaps if Mr Raholan feels that strongly he should leave the Imperial Academy and sign up with the militia.

I look forward to hearing about his progress.


Given the Militias clear lack of direction and myself not being the one to bring it there would be no advantage in joining the militia at this point in time...a few dedicated pilots cannot resist a well organised and motivated enemy (as much as It pains to admit that).

Until such time when the Amarr finds itself a competent fighting force I will monitor the developments from the side.

Shitposts so bad CONCORD gave me a 50 billion ISK bounty

Markius TheShed
T.R.I.A.D
Ushra'Khan
#19 - 2012-07-25 08:27:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Markius TheShed
Lucas Raholan wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
Perhaps if Mr Raholan feels that strongly he should leave the Imperial Academy and sign up with the militia.

I look forward to hearing about his progress.



Until such time when the Amarr finds itself a competent fighting force I will monitor the developments from the side.



You will be able to keep Rodj company as he is monitoring the situation from providence.

**Murientor Tribe** a capsuleer organization composed of radical Minmatar. Since YC107

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#20 - 2012-07-25 11:05:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyn Farel
Lyskal Oskold wrote:
The Imperial Crusaders I encounter usually flee and attempt to return in a fleet composed of larger, more technologically advanced vessels to assure an easy victory, which leads to the Minmatar avoiding them so as to avoid pointless losses.
At least that happens when you can actually find them.


Yes, I heard that is what they say on the opposing team as well. It was already the case when I was enlisted and has never changed. Most of the militia is composed of juvenile hypocrites.

Lyskal Oskold wrote:
Azdan Amith wrote:
Lyskal Oskold wrote:

Crusaders are wonderful opponents, they're just rare. The more common war profiteers tend to bring the chances of any possible conversation or fair engagement down though.

The Amarr need more man power and to lose the common thought process that you need battleships and battlecruisers to engage some frigates and a destroyer or two.


This is an interesting viewpoint. While I may not condone combat for combat's sake or sport, I respect and admire those seeking an honorable engagement. Perhaps we will meet on the field of battle one day.


Hopefully. It's a war that has to be waged, from either side. To abandon honor is to become a monster.
It's a shame so many profiteers have entered the conflict either side. I know the common capsuleer only cares about ISK, but it still aggravates me seeing them seep into Empire matters.
Hopefully they'll return into the lawless abyss and continue their horrendous crimes out there until a time when the 4 Empires can expand outwards. That could be an interesting turn of events... But I understand all 4 Empires are preoccupied with other matters.

The Amarr vs Minmatar conflict is a battle to the very foundations of what either stands for. The Minmatar must ride their hatred and thirst for vengeance until we're completely free, or we'll collapse into despair. The Amarr must push back and attempt to purify us and bring us back into the fold lest their entire faith and communal soul fails, they can't possibly fall.

Despite the immense emotion and the common view that slavery is flat out evil this conflict is far from black and white. Amarr should rally behind that fact. If the Amarr Empire truly is the only hope to save Humanity, their resolve must be absolute and their drive unstoppable. For all we know if the Amarr fail countless souls will never reach Heaven. It saddens me that Amarr seems to have the least amount of loyalists among capsuleers. The Empire should consider uplifting Amarr who actually behave like Amarr.


Sorry, but I do believe that your idealism is highly misplaced. Shogaatsu's view on things sounds more reasonable to me. At least, that is the conclusion I have come to after 3 years of militia. I already knew it was pointless, but I had the hope to push for the statu quo. Now though, it sounds pointless considering the sheer stupidity of each side.

Lucas Raholan wrote:
.a few dedicated pilots cannot resist a well organised and motivated enemy (as much as It pains to admit that).


The TLF has never been organized, only motivated, but it may have changed by now. It has more or less been a bunch of ragtags unable to resist to the side that was actually organized and disciplined, as much as such a thing is possible in a militia. In three years of fighting, I have rarely been in a fleet that actually lost, even outnumbnered 2 to one. It is for a reason that the 24th IC was famous for its cohesion and organization.

Where the TLF has always compensated that fact was on skirmishes or especially in complexes.

Now though, since all the core corporations have left, it would seem that the Crudsade is only the shadow of its past. And even shadow is too nice to qualify what it has become now.

Of course, now, the new system proposed by CONCORD only made it worse as much as for the Amarr/Minmatar side than for the Caldari/Gallente side. It pushed the militias in a constructed mutual stalemate where their members do not even try anymore to capture vulnerable systems to keep up what they call "loyalty farming". It is an additional proof of how rotten the system is, and what kind of parasites really constitute the bulk of the militias manpower.
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