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Rookie Frigate Changes

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CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2012-07-23 19:07:01 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Ytterbium
Hello everyone! To go alongside our revamped new player experience for Inferno 1.2 we will also be refreshing the rookie frigates.
The plan is for these frigates to give new players a better indication of what their racial combat philosophy is all about, so we are giving them a whole bunch of role bonuses that include a good cross section of common bonuses that they can expect from each race. To ensure that the rookie frigs don't end up eclipsing any other t1 frigates for older players, the bonuses are all role bonuses not adjusted by skill levels.

We want these frigates to be versatile and fun for new players while ensuring that once the player gets their skills up past level 2 or 3 another frigate will almost always be the rational choice.

Let us know what you think.


Exact changes below:
(Edited with latest tweaks as seen here and here)

IMPAIROR:

Role bonuses:
20% bonus to Small Energy Turret capacitor use
10% bonus to Small Energy Turret damage
10% bonus to Tracking Disruptor effectiveness
10% bonus to armor resistances
Slot layout: 2 H, 2 M (+1), 2 L (+1), 2 turrets, 1 launchers (+1)
Fittings: 24 PWG (+13), 95 CPU (+15)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 125 (+46)/ 200 (+12)/ 200 (+44)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 140 (+15)/ 70s (-23.75s)/ 2 (+0.67)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass): 300 (+4) / 3.24 (-0.8) / 1090000
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 25.5km (+5.5) / 485 (+10) / 3 (+1)
Sensor strength: 6 Radar (+2)
Signature radius: 50 (+5)
Cargo capacity: 115 (-5)


IBIS:

Role bonuses:
20% bonus to Small Hybrid Turret optimal range
10% bonus to missile kinetic damage
30% bonus to ECM Target Jammer strength
10% bonus to shield resistances
Slot layout: 2 H, 2 M (+1), 2 L (+1), 2 turrets, 2 launchers (+2)
Fittings: 22 PWG (+11), 110 CPU (+30)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 200 (+82)/ 125 (-24)/ 175 (+57)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 130 (+5)/ 65s (-28.75s)/ 2 (+0.67)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass): 295 (-1) / 3.12 (-0.65) / 1163000
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 27km (-3km) / 475 / 3 (+1)
Sensor strength: 6 Gravimetric (+2)
Signature radius: 52 (+7)
Cargo capacity: 125 (+5)


VELATOR:

Role bonuses:
10% bonus to hybrid turret damage
20% bonus to drone hitpoints, damage and mining yield
10% bonus to Remote Sensor Dampener effectiveness
15% bonus to Armor Repairer effectiveness
Slot layout: 2 H, 2 M (+1), 2 L (+1), 2 turrets, 1 launchers (+1)
Fittings: 23 PWG (+12), 100 CPU (+20)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 150 (+71)/ 175 (-13)/ 225 (+76)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 135 (+10)/ 67.5s (-25.25s)/ 2 (+0.67)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass): 305 (+9) / 2.91 (-1.13) / 1148000
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 10 / 10
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 23.5km (-1.5) / 480 (+5) / 3 (+1)
Sensor strength: 6 Magnetometric (+2)
Signature radius: 54 (+9)
Cargo capacity: 135 (+15)


REAPER:

Role bonuses:
10% bonus to velocity
10% bonus to Small Projectile Turret damage
10% bonus to Target Painter effectiveness
15% bonus to Shield Boost Amount
Slot layout: 2 H, 2 M (+1), 2 L (+1), 2 turrets, 2 launchers (+2)
Fittings: 21 PWG (+9), 105 CPU (+25)
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 175 (+96)/ 150 (-23)/ 150 (+17)
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap per second): 125 / 62.5s (-31.25s)/ 2 (+0.67)
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass): 310 / 3.03 (-0.8)/ 1157000
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 5 / 5
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 22km (+7)/ 490 (+15) / 3 (+1)
Sensor strength: 6 Ladar (+2)
Signature radius: 48 (+3)
Cargo capacity: 120

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#2 - 2012-07-23 19:08:27 UTC
Haven't looked beyond the Amarr one, but OMG these will be so much fun to play with and see what the best I can do is.


Also good idea trying to show new guys the basic design of the racial ships.
Elise Randolph
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#3 - 2012-07-23 19:15:07 UTC
Neat

~
Two step
Aperture Harmonics
#4 - 2012-07-23 19:15:21 UTC
I like that they are all useful(ish) now, but I worry about the strange role bonus. New players might look at them and not realize their bonuses won't work the same as other ships do...

CSM 7 Secretary CSM 6 Alternate Delegate @two_step_eve on Twitter My Blog
Gilbaron
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-07-23 19:21:20 UTC
i wonder about the missing neut bonus on the amarr noobship
Greg Valanti
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-07-23 19:23:46 UTC
Obligatory ASB Reaper is OP
mkint
#7 - 2012-07-23 19:37:57 UTC
When you say "useful" and "versatile" and stuff, what exactly do you mean in this case? What performance should we expect out of the new noob ships? Tutorials only? lvl 1 missions? lvl 2's? PVP vs T1 frigs?

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#8 - 2012-07-23 19:41:00 UTC
mkint wrote:
When you say "useful" and "versatile" and stuff, what exactly do you mean in this case? What performance should we expect out of the new noob ships? Tutorials only? lvl 1 missions? lvl 2's? PVP vs T1 frigs?


These frigates should be capable of running level 1 missions and career agents, but we don't want them to be good enough that players keep using them as primary ships more than a few days into the game. Hence the role bonuses instead of per-level bonuses.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#9 - 2012-07-23 19:45:10 UTC
A lot of EVE is based on a concept that newer players and older players could conflict with each other, and the newer player might actually have a decent chance at winning.

The lack of scalability on the rookie ship... are there any plans to allow for experienced pilots to have realistic use of T1 frigates and this rookie ship, or are they all ultimately training wheels for faction or T2?

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
FireT
Venom Pointe Industries
#10 - 2012-07-23 19:46:57 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
mkint wrote:
When you say "useful" and "versatile" and stuff, what exactly do you mean in this case? What performance should we expect out of the new noob ships? Tutorials only? lvl 1 missions? lvl 2's? PVP vs T1 frigs?


These frigates should be capable of running level 1 missions and career agents, but we don't want them to be good enough that players keep using them as primary ships more than a few days into the game. Hence the role bonuses instead of per-level bonuses.


Ah, the bonuses are limited to the ship itself. I like the idea. It does seem to give the new player a general idea of what the faction specializes in. Furthermore it might further their goals along by giving them an idea for the direction they might wish to go.

Nicely done.
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#11 - 2012-07-23 19:51:08 UTC
Nikk Narrel wrote:
A lot of EVE is based on a concept that newer players and older players could conflict with each other, and the newer player might actually have a decent chance at winning.

The lack of scalability on the rookie ship... are there any plans to allow for experienced pilots to have realistic use of T1 frigates and this rookie ship, or are they all ultimately training wheels for faction or T2?


Giving newer pilots a great set of affordable tech one ships that can allow a more skilled newer player to beat older players has always been one of the ship design goals in eve. Rookie frigs are designed as intro ships rather than hardcore pvp ships, but we have a lot of improvements to tech one frigates coming up as part of our removal of ship tiers. CCP Ytterbium posted about some other tech one frigate changes arriving in Inferno 1.2 in this thread: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=122912&find=unread

There's going to be even more changes announced here in the coming months, keep an eye out in the features and ideas forum and on singularity.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Jarin Arenos
Card Shark Industries
#12 - 2012-07-23 19:52:55 UTC
I can't help but notice that the velator has a role bonus to drones... but the IMPARIOR is the only one with a drone bay. Typo or oversight?

But I'm not CCP Soundwave, so what do I know?
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#13 - 2012-07-23 19:58:22 UTC
Jarin Arenos wrote:
I can't help but notice that the velator has a role bonus to drones... but the IMPARIOR is the only one with a drone bay. Typo or oversight?


Typo, good catch. It's fixed now.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#14 - 2012-07-23 20:03:12 UTC
the next alliance tournament will be won with rookie ships

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#15 - 2012-07-23 20:29:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
CCP Fozzie wrote:
Nikk Narrel wrote:
A lot of EVE is based on a concept that newer players and older players could conflict with each other, and the newer player might actually have a decent chance at winning.

The lack of scalability on the rookie ship... are there any plans to allow for experienced pilots to have realistic use of T1 frigates and this rookie ship, or are they all ultimately training wheels for faction or T2?


Giving newer pilots a great set of affordable tech one ships that can allow a more skilled newer player to beat older players has always been one of the ship design goals in eve. Rookie frigs are designed as intro ships rather than hardcore pvp ships, but we have a lot of improvements to tech one frigates coming up as part of our removal of ship tiers. CCP Ytterbium posted about some other tech one frigate changes arriving in Inferno 1.2 in this thread: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=122912&find=unread

There's going to be even more changes announced here in the coming months, keep an eye out in the features and ideas forum and on singularity.


Can I further interate on what nick said and ask if we would ever possibly see 'military' versions of these 'cvillian' ships that do scale with level? Something that isnt given away for free but has to be built like any other tech 1 frigate. Also default frigate armament and the lack of civillian class modules in the market place may make for exploring additional fits hard for beginners when on thier first day.

My next concern is the lack of any form of electronic warfare bonus on the amarrian one. You could increase natural cap or cap recharge by 10% and drop the cap use bonus in its place.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Harold Tuphlos
The Dark Space Initiative
Scary Wormhole People
#16 - 2012-07-23 20:32:57 UTC
The complete loss of standard bonuses makes me sad. I rather enjoyed the reaper being a faster ship than a rifter.
I think making one of the bonuses be a per level bonus ( at a reduced amount) would help newbies understand why you want to train frigate skills when flying t1 frigates.
Saul Elsyn
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-07-23 20:34:12 UTC
WOOT! Rookie ships that actually can function as viable (though laughable) ships!

I am a little concerned with the role bonuses as it may confuse new players when they switch from their intro ship to their first T1 frigates. I hope the new player experience is clear enough to explain that.

I can't wait to see what else to expect from the T1 ship revamp... More viable T1 frigates is always fun. As for experienced players not using T1 Frigates...

Faction Warfare is full of people flying T1 frigates. Same with RvB... with the OTEC situation as it is I don't see the price T2 ships dropping enough to really be viable to casual players... Especially those casual players in the PvP oriented environments where ship losses are a large deal. (I finance my own pvp with a hauler alt and am always a bit hesitant to spend the 10-20 million isk on a T2 frigate let alone flying larger HACs and so forth).

As a side note... Goonswarm's newest fleet doctrine! The n00b ship fleet!
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#18 - 2012-07-23 20:41:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
I will have to agree the bonus per level seems rather critical to convey the fact that pilots must train frigates in order to become stronger in thier ships. I recommend changing all or some the role bonuses to 2%-6% per level to get the same performance at lvl 5 as described in the blog. For example keep 2 bonuses as a 'role bonus' and the other two make it per level.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#19 - 2012-07-23 20:51:49 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
Can I further interate on what Nikk said and ask if we would ever possibly see 'military' versions of these 'cvillian' ships that do scale with level? Something that isnt given away for free but has to be built like any other tech 1 frigate.

There is a precedent for what you are describing in the game already.

Industrials deliberately duplicate each other's role and abilities in the T1 arena.
The Gallente in specific have a version of the Iteron for each individual skill level.

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#20 - 2012-07-23 20:55:08 UTC
Saul Elsyn wrote:
As a side note... Goonswarm's newest fleet doctrine! The n00b ship fleet!

What do you mean, 'newest'?

Anyway, this is going to be hilarious. But for the love of god get rid of the launcher hardpoints on the velator and impairor, giving amarr and gallente newbies launcher options is just going to confuse them into thinking they need to train missiles for their racial ships and you just end up with a lot of confused newbies wasting training time on missile skills. (For that matter the same can be said about the non-Caldari missile frigs, since 'damaging things with missiles' isn't a significantly different role to 'damaging things with guns' and it has the same side effect of encouraging poor training decisions amongst players who can't be expected to know any better.)

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
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