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Newbie looking for guidance!

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Big Oner
Doomheim
#1 - 2011-10-09 13:53:28 UTC
Hello!

Been playing EVE for 3 years and i have recently gotten interested in the economic side of EVE.
Atm i got my trading skills all training up to 4 but the knowledge i have of trading is minimal and would like someone to enlighten a poor newbie on the tools of the trade!
i have read all sorts of guides but i think it would be easier if someone could just tell me 1v1!
Big Oner
Doomheim
#2 - 2011-10-09 15:34:37 UTC
btw i am a alt... for my traders saftey :)
clamslayer
Doomheim
#3 - 2011-10-09 21:33:20 UTC  |  Edited by: clamslayer
you expect people to give away their secrets? all that will do is drive up competition.

it really boils down to this, figure out how to buy low, then sell higher
Serene Python
#4 - 2011-10-09 22:23:57 UTC
Quote:

i have read all sorts of guides but i think it would be easier if someone could just tell me 1v1!


Instead of asking peoples secrets how about you ask questions regarding parts of the guides you don't understand. Such as order range, duration, broker fees etc. etc.

Maybe if you listed these guides then someone could post a better guide if these really aren't that good for helping people learn.

Only thing you going to get directly in terms of "Do this and you'll profit" is buy low sell high and trolls.
xKillswitchx
The Oxford Investment Group
#5 - 2011-10-09 23:22:25 UTC
Like everyone else says, its all about buying low and selling high but its also about finding a hole in the market and filling that whole.

The real money or quick money to be made in market trading is in null sec and in particular, the frontline station systems of the fight. When a CTA is called and 40 or 50 ships get destroyed, they need to be replaced quickly so if you are one of the main providers of fleet fitted ships, you tend to make a killing.

I'm not saying you can't make isk selling items and ships in empire, but I've routinely made 4 to 5 Bil isk profit or more a month selling in null sec frontline areas. Its risky but the rewards are high.
Kandreath
De Re Metallica
#6 - 2011-10-10 11:25:54 UTC
I recently started a station trading alt. He's spent 2 weeks in Rens with a 10M starter gift from the main alt. Now total assets and wallet are approx 20M. - I Know, it's not spectacular but it's a start.

If I may offer some advice (from a 2 week station trader noob).

Figure out how much do you want to make to say "it's worth it?". Figure that out (daily, weekly...whatever). For me, 10M per week is a good mark for the time I can spend on it. (Obviously your not going to get there in 1 week so allow "lead time" to get there.

There are some guides out there that are talking about "spread" and "Volume". , I think these are the main things to keep in mind. The formulae is really up to you. Use your "goal" from above to tell you what profit and volumes you should be trading.

Figure out how much ISK your willing to bind up in buy orders. - For me it was the entire 10M (minus some about 1M safety net for order change costs). This will be the balancing act between profit/volume and operating capital.

A good trade tool is also important. It helps out heaps.

Keep your orders in "pole" position.

That's it
Jenn Makanen
Doomheim
#7 - 2011-10-10 12:05:10 UTC
Kandreath wrote:


Keep your orders in "pole" position.



Good advice. Though sometimes it's not worth adjusting your prices, if the daily volume is in the hundreds, and the person below you is selling 5. Big smile

I'd add that if you're not market hub trading, don't think you need to be the lowest price in the region. Being lowest in the station can be enough (as long as it's not a major difference). That's why you have a spread. Knowing what ships, modules and guns go together allows you to stock a station, so that people will pay you a premium, just so they don't need to go round five stations to save a million.
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#8 - 2011-10-10 12:28:25 UTC
Something needs to be fixed, as I have just wasted over 40 min writing, rewriting a short and easy guide that is now gone.

F this, if any one wants help just contact me in game with questions.
CCP Phantom
C C P
C C P Alliance
#9 - 2011-10-10 15:58:27 UTC
Hello Big Oner,

The advice you got here is already a good first step. The seemingly overly obvious advice "Buy low, sell high" can lead to some interesting consequences if thought through and is not that obvious then any more.

For example you can do the trade on the space scale, meaning that you buy items at some place for a low price, haul them to some other place and sell them for a higher price there. This could consume quite some time and could be a risk while hauling.

Or you can do the trade on the time scale, meaning that you buy items now at a low price,wait and sell them later then for a high price. This might be quite a risk if the price didn't end up where you wanted it to be.

In my active time i found it most interesting to anticipate price trends, profiting from that and even influencing those trends (on a very tiny scale) myself.

Just don't simply buy and sell things, but also think about why they are cheap or expensive and if that would change,why and when.

CCP Phantom - Senior Community Developer
Big Oner
Doomheim
#10 - 2011-10-10 19:53:00 UTC
tyvm for all the advice... but one thing that im not certain with station trading is is good to have a immense amount of order e.g 10+ XD?
or is it the more the merrier?
Sidunas
Mordor Industries
#11 - 2011-10-10 23:12:10 UTC
The more orders you have, the less 0.01 ISK wars will you have to fight, since a fraction of your orders will most likely be fulfilled. Normally, your profit will come from a few carefully selected items.
Besides from your profit margin, you might also want to take a look at the number of orders respectively the trading volume, since a rarely traded item is a waste of (precious) liquidity.
Barakach
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-10-11 00:07:23 UTC
@CCP Phantom


Nah, you just whip out SQL Management Studio, pass in some item numbers to an SP you made, and now oyu got a list of products with decent margins and volumes.. :P

Don't deny it :-)
Sashi Serakhoi
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2011-10-14 11:40:10 UTC
By searching for high volume low price sell orders on trade and industrial goods, and high volume high buy orders of the same goods, I have made ~10 million ISK in about 6 or 7 hours of inter-regional trading (~15 jump trips) of the most pedestrian commodities in which I doubt pirates or gankers would take even the least interest. I've only been playing the game for about a month, and my character is primarily trained as a miner, i.e., minimal trade skills.

That tells me: if you really focus, make use of all the resources out there, 100 million a week just from inter-regional station trading in high sec should be possible.
flakeys
Doomheim
#14 - 2011-10-14 12:35:24 UTC
Damn that Kara is HOT Shocked ... I'm playing this game far too long.



On the topic , no lessons like loosing lessons just as it is in pvp.Look at how items fluctuate , look what items do good profit wise in other regions , how much of those units are sold daily , how much competition is on that item etc etc.As my main man NIKE once said : ' Just do it'.At first it'll be a waterfall landing on your head but after a while it's a nice calm river flowing just the way you assumed it would.

Only thing i can say wich makes trade a WHOLE lot easier though is having 2 accounts , all the rest is depending on what type of trade you do , the time you can spend , the amount of isk you can put in to it etc etc.When i started i was happy to make 100 mille a week , now when i log in and don't find i earned a new plex that day i am sad sad panda.

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
Jenn Makanen
Doomheim
#15 - 2011-10-14 13:39:07 UTC
Reinvest. Keep reinvesting. You won't make much on 100 million, if you keep removing the profits.