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Bible bashing

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Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#161 - 2012-07-17 20:18:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Ginseng Jita
Corina Jarr wrote:

Considering much of the US was formed by a religious group,...


That is what religious followers would have you believe. It isn't true in the least. The founding fathers of the US didn't want religion in any shape or form to be involved with the government - for fear that they would encounter the same issues England had with the Church of England, or the French had with the Pope in Rome, or any number of countries that allowed relgions to dictate laws. Sorry, the US was not founded on so called "Judeo" Christianity - at all.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#162 - 2012-07-17 20:19:55 UTC
A religious friend of mine suggested this video. May you all be enlightened.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#163 - 2012-07-17 20:20:39 UTC
Kievan Arakyd wrote:


Except that, all fo the founding fathers of the US wanted to keep religion and government separate. Just more parroting what you hear in church.

Yes they did. And it is very impressive that it didn't collapse into a religious state yet, given how infectious folks think religion is.
Wilfuc Fatburdz
The Capitals' Club
#164 - 2012-07-17 20:21:29 UTC
Ila Dace wrote:
The problem with atheists is that they don't have no songs.


I give this post a Toon Boobage score of:

7.5/10
Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#165 - 2012-07-17 20:21:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Ginseng Jita
Corina Jarr wrote:
Ginseng Jita wrote:

Sorry to generalize, but when it comes to religion, I have no room to discriminate.

I see. I guess all blacks are gang members with poor speech. And all Hispanics are trying to steal jobs in the US. And all Native Americans run casinos...


I said religion, did I mention any other group, race, or anything other than religion. Learn to read.
Celeste Lovette
#166 - 2012-07-17 20:22:29 UTC
"The fact that a believer is happier than a skeptic is no more to the point than the fact that a drunken man is happier than a sober one."

GBS

"Life isn't about finding yourself. Life is about creating yourself."
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#167 - 2012-07-17 20:22:57 UTC
Ginseng Jita wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:

Considering much of the US was formed by a religious group,...


That is what religious followers would have you believe. It isn't true in the least. The founding fathers of the US didn't want religion in any shape or form to be involved with the government - for fear that they would encounter the same issues England had with the Church of England, or the French had with the Pope in Rome, or any number of countries that allowed relgions to dictate laws. Sorry, the US was not founded on so called "Judeo" Christianity - at all.

Being formed by a religious group, and allowing that religion to dictate the running of a country are two different things.

The US was founded by those who were very religious. They chose to keep religion out of the government (as much as was possible) to avoid the issues of their parent countries.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#168 - 2012-07-17 20:24:05 UTC
Ginseng Jita wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:
Ginseng Jita wrote:

Sorry to generalize, but when it comes to religion, I have no room to discriminate.

I see. I guess all blacks are gang members with poor speech. And all Hispanics are trying to steal jobs in the US. And all Native Americans run casinos...


I said religion, did I mention any other group, race, or anything other than religion. Learn to read.

If your going to stereotypical (and incorrectly) one group, you might as well do them all.
Kievan Arakyd
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#169 - 2012-07-17 20:24:05 UTC
Fiona Tsero wrote:
I didn't want to get involved in this nonsensical debate, but now I don't really have a choice.

Ginseng Jita wrote:
(1)Religious people love nothing more than to meddle in other peoples lives. (2)They want to control womens wombs, (3)they want to make women wear specific clothing, (4)they want to tell you who you can and cannot marry, (5)they want to tell you that science is a false, (6)they wish to instill fear into people by making them think they are going to go to some make believe place filled with fire and brimstone if they do not worship the supreme invisible man in the sky, they are all (7)about controlling people...and having power over the masses.

There are many terms in the world of psychiatry that fit people who share the mental illness known as religion.


1 - True religion is nothing more than the search for the Infinite Truth. If someone is trying to instruct you, they want to help you reach this Truth. If someone does do it in order to meddle, then they aren't following a true religion, but are merely using it as an excuse to meddle. These people would meddle whether they were the Pope or the leader of the Atheist group down the street.

2 - The issue is about life and death, if someone says abortion/contraception is wrong, then they're concerned about the life of a child. The choice is having intercourse or not.

3 - This is a blanket statement that does not apply to all. Some do or would force women to wear certain types of clothing (Islam, more fundamental Christian groups), while others suggest what would be good, and others don't care.

4 - Religious groups believe that marriage is a covenant between two people before God. Therefore, of course they would have a say in who people can marry. Civil marriage is another matter.

5 - True religions believe that Reason and Religion are infinitely compatible, since both stem from the same source. If a religious group tells you the principles of science are evil, then you should definitely run away from that group.

6 - Some, maybe, but once again, be wary of blanket statements.

7 - Religious groups aren't the only ones that seek power. If a self-proclaimed religious group does seek power, then it is no religious group at all, and is a cult instead.


1. the only worthy human endeavor is science. it is the only thing that will save this terrible species.
2. Except that, it doesnt seek to just do that for its adherents, but for everyone else too.
3. I agree with this.
4. Marriage is a legal contract. You should be allowed to marry whoever you want, even multiple people, without persecution.
5. The majority of religious groups do just that today, state that science is all wrong. see, climate change deniers, antievolutionists. We should throw these people into a volcano, because gravity and plate tectonics are just theories right?
6. Not just some, but most.
7. All associations of people seek power, not limited to religions.

Got my Dust514 key...
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
#170 - 2012-07-17 20:25:05 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
Cede Forster wrote:
now the curious part would be how people who believe in such things happen to end up in EVE and on top of that in amarr space.

that would not be exactly the place i'd expect them to hang out.

but then again, its religion, it ought to be a bit illogical



We're not Amish here Lol. I know it sounds crazy to believe but many church goers go to the same functions as you including bars, sports, movies, or concerts. They may be sitting next to you on the train or in the workplace. They may be your neighbor. Being in a religion does not mean a life in the 17th century Big smile. You are not required to give anything up and in fact you simply gain more. Bless you for that laugh.

p.s. Its funny but a bad google search can take you from religion to this game.

I'm not sure I'd argue it gives you "more", I mean more of what exactly? It's just a difference of opinion based on the interpretation (or ignorance) of the facts known by an individual.

It would be interesting to see if there's any correlation between perceived quality of life and religiosity though. But IIRC there is in most countries a negative correlation between religiosity, personal income and level of education. There is also, at least in America, a higher chance of an individual in prison being religious than one who is not in prison.

Whilst it is an interesting thought, none of the statistics I've seen link religion to a higher degree of satisfaction with ones life. Seeing religiosty plotted against suicide rates would be pretty fascinating in this regard.

Also, why is this thread not locked yet?



You are looking for something tangible or material. You will not find it. It is about strength from within and the belief that anything is possible. If you would like an excellent example MSN had a video the other day where a elderly woman found the strength to not only face her sons killer, but she forgave him and in fact those 2 live together now. Between his time reflecting and her guidance now he can see that path once more. In essence her strength is giving him strength. There are many prime examples such as that and I hope that you see more within time. Every good act makes us better as a whole.

Out of Pod is getting In the Pod - Join in game channel **IG OOPE **
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#171 - 2012-07-17 20:26:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Simi Kusoni
Fiona Tsero wrote:
I didn't want to get involved in this nonsensical debate, but now I don't really have a choice.

Ginseng Jita wrote:
(1)Religious people love nothing more than to meddle in other peoples lives. (2)They want to control womens wombs, (3)they want to make women wear specific clothing, (4)they want to tell you who you can and cannot marry, (5)they want to tell you that science is a false, (6)they wish to instill fear into people by making them think they are going to go to some make believe place filled with fire and brimstone if they do not worship the supreme invisible man in the sky, they are all (7)about controlling people...and having power over the masses.

There are many terms in the world of psychiatry that fit people who share the mental illness known as religion.


1 - True religion is nothing more than the search for the Infinite Truth. If someone is trying to instruct you, they want to help you reach this Truth. If someone does do it in order to meddle, then they aren't following a true religion, but are merely using it as an excuse to meddle. These people would meddle whether they were the Pope or the leader of the Atheist group down the street.

2 - The issue is about life and death, if someone says abortion/contraception is wrong, then they're concerned about the life of a child. The choice is having intercourse or not.

3 - This is a blanket statement that does not apply to all. Some do or would force women to wear certain types of clothing (Islam, more fundamental Christian groups), while others suggest what would be good, and others don't care.

4 - Religious groups believe that marriage is a covenant between two people before God. Therefore, of course they would have a say in who people can marry. Civil marriage is another matter.

5 - True religions believe that Reason and Religion are infinitely compatible, since both stem from the same source. If a religious group tells you the principles of science are evil, then you should definitely run away from that group.

6 - Some, maybe, but once again, be wary of blanket statements.

7 - Religious groups aren't the only ones that seek power. If a self-proclaimed religious group does seek power, then it is no religious group at all, and is a cult instead.

I'd just like to point out that the behaviour alluded to in point 7 is perfectly capable of arising without a governing consciousness, or any behind the scenes power seeking.

Memetics allows for the fact that any idea exhibiting what you may view as "power hungry" or "cult-like" behaviour will inevitably be able to propagate more effectively because of it. This means inevitably any sufficiently advanced belief system will evolve to exhibit those traits over time.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#172 - 2012-07-17 20:26:52 UTC  |  Edited by: FloppieTheBanjoClown
Ginseng Jita wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:

Considering much of the US was formed by a religious group,...


That is what religious followers would have you believe. It isn't true in the least. The founding fathers of the US didn't want religion in any shape or form to be involved with the government - for fear that they would encounter the same issues England had with the Church of England, or the French had with the Pope in Rome, or any number of countries that allowed relgions to dictate laws. Sorry, the US was not founded on so called "Judeo" Christianity - at all.


Whether the U.S. was founded by Christians, or upon Christian ideals, or the constitution written from divine inspiration (I've actually heard this claimed), it doesn't matter. One of the basic tenets of the nation is that the government does not impose religious practice upon its people.

I just ask people to look at it this way: if it weren't YOUR religion, would you still be okay with it? Want prayer in school? Do you still want it when it looks like this? You want creationism taught in schools? Let's tell them about how a water beetle drew the ground up out of the sea and a buzzard's drooping wings carved out the mountains and valleys while the mud was still soft. After all, it's just another theory!

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#173 - 2012-07-17 20:29:37 UTC
Kievan Arakyd wrote:

1. the only worthy human endeavor is science. it is the only thing that will save this terrible species.
2. Except that, it doesnt seek to just do that for its adherents, but for everyone else too.
3. I agree with this.
4. Marriage is a legal contract. You should be allowed to marry whoever you want, even multiple people, without persecution.
5. The majority of religious groups do just that today, state that science is all wrong. see, climate change deniers, antievolutionists. We should throw these people into a volcano, because gravity and plate tectonics are just theories right?
6. Not just some, but most.
7. All associations of people seek power, not limited to religions.

1) or kill us allLol
2) thats fair, though does not apply to all religions.
4) fully agree, and some religions follow that (a legal marriage being separate from the religious one).
5) some do not have a problem with all science, just the theories (and they are just theories) that conflict with their beliefs. Whats wrong with not believing a theory that you have an alternate explanation for?
6) personally think its about even
7) absolutely.
Lord Ryan
True Xero
#174 - 2012-07-17 20:30:23 UTC
Just so I understand shirts and other eve related things are off topic for the general discussion forum, and bannable offenses. But religion and world history are not? Seems I fail at spacebook.

Do not assume anything above this line was typed by me. Nerf the Truth, it's inconvenient.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#175 - 2012-07-17 20:31:06 UTC
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

I'm not sure I'd argue it gives you "more", I mean more of what exactly? It's just a difference of opinion based on the interpretation (or ignorance) of the facts known by an individual.

It would be interesting to see if there's any correlation between perceived quality of life and religiosity though. But IIRC there is in most countries a negative correlation between religiosity, personal income and level of education. There is also, at least in America, a higher chance of an individual in prison being religious than one who is not in prison.

Whilst it is an interesting thought, none of the statistics I've seen link religion to a higher degree of satisfaction with ones life. Seeing religiosty plotted against suicide rates would be pretty fascinating in this regard.

Also, why is this thread not locked yet?



You are looking for something tangible or material. You will not find it. It is about strength from within and the belief that anything is possible. If you would like an excellent example MSN had a video the other day where a elderly woman found the strength to not only face her sons killer, but she forgave him and in fact those 2 live together now. Between his time reflecting and her guidance now he can see that path once more. In essence her strength is giving him strength. There are many prime examples such as that and I hope that you see more within time. Every good act makes us better as a whole.

Do you have any evidence to support your hypothesis that atheists are incapable, or less likely to exhibit, this kind of behavior? Because without that, your story has little relevance to the original question I posed.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Ginger Barbarella
#176 - 2012-07-17 20:31:15 UTC
Dardoign wrote:
I'm not an atheist and will not be drawn into a theological argument.


Which explains why you posted a hate thread about just that. Love your neighbor, unless they're not a member of your organized religion.

"Blow it all on Quafe and strippers." --- Sorlac
Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#177 - 2012-07-17 20:31:43 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
Ginseng Jita wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:

Considering much of the US was formed by a religious group,...


That is what religious followers would have you believe. It isn't true in the least. The founding fathers of the US didn't want religion in any shape or form to be involved with the government - for fear that they would encounter the same issues England had with the Church of England, or the French had with the Pope in Rome, or any number of countries that allowed relgions to dictate laws. Sorry, the US was not founded on so called "Judeo" Christianity - at all.

Being formed by a religious group, and allowing that religion to dictate the running of a country are two different things.

The US was founded by those who were very religious. They chose to keep religion out of the government (as much as was possible) to avoid the issues of their parent countries.


Actually, many of the people that formed the US government were Atheist, Deist, or Freemasons...few were Christians. Go figure.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#178 - 2012-07-17 20:33:20 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
Kievan Arakyd wrote:

1. the only worthy human endeavor is science. it is the only thing that will save this terrible species.
2. Except that, it doesnt seek to just do that for its adherents, but for everyone else too.
3. I agree with this.
4. Marriage is a legal contract. You should be allowed to marry whoever you want, even multiple people, without persecution.
5. The majority of religious groups do just that today, state that science is all wrong. see, climate change deniers, antievolutionists. We should throw these people into a volcano, because gravity and plate tectonics are just theories right?
6. Not just some, but most.
7. All associations of people seek power, not limited to religions.

1) or kill us allLol
2) thats fair, though does not apply to all religions.
4) fully agree, and some religions follow that (a legal marriage being separate from the religious one).
5) some do not have a problem with all science, just the theories (and they are just theories) that conflict with their beliefs. Whats wrong with not believing a theory that you have an alternate explanation for?
6) personally think its about even
7) absolutely.

Please tell me you understand the meaning of the word "theory" in a scientific context? Because you have made it sound terribly like you do not.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Ginseng Jita
PAN-EVE TRADING COMPANY
#179 - 2012-07-17 20:34:11 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:
Ginseng Jita wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:
Ginseng Jita wrote:

Sorry to generalize, but when it comes to religion, I have no room to discriminate.

I see. I guess all blacks are gang members with poor speech. And all Hispanics are trying to steal jobs in the US. And all Native Americans run casinos...


I said religion, did I mention any other group, race, or anything other than religion. Learn to read.

If your going to stereotypical (and incorrectly) one group, you might as well do them all.


Why, because you say so?
Fiona Tsero
Doomheim
#180 - 2012-07-17 20:35:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Fiona Tsero
Kievan Arakyd wrote:
1. the only worthy human endeavor is science. it is the only thing that will save this terrible species.

Yup, WWI and WWII, along with the millions of deaths caused by both, took place in this age of science. Don't forget it was science that created the Atomic Bomb, and science alone will never be able to use its discoveries properly.

Kievan Arakyd wrote:
2. Except that, it doesnt seek to just do that for its adherents, but for everyone else too.

Of course, if you thought something was genocide, would you stand by and let it happen?

Kievan Arakyd wrote:
4. Marriage is a legal contract. You should be allowed to marry whoever you want, even multiple people, without persecution.

Marriage has been around before the establishment of government and laws. As such, it is more than a simple legal contract.

Kievan Arakyd wrote:
5. The majority of religious groups do just that today, state that science is all wrong. see, climate change deniers, antievolutionists. We should throw these people into a volcano, because gravity and plate tectonics are just theories right?

While some groups do hate science, it is possible that they hate it because what science preaches as true goes against what they teach. Instead of attacking science with reasonable arguments, they attack it with foolishness and fearmongering. These groups cannot stand the test of time. Once again: true religion and true reason will be infinitely compatible, since both stem from the same source.

As for 'antievolutionists', I suppose I would be one, but not because the Bible tells me so. I have yet to see enough evidence of trans-species evolution. There are too many unanswered questions with regards to this for me to agree with the idea.

EDIT: However, there is enough evidence to support the idea that change over time does happen within populations of single species.