These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123Next page
 

Why is the EVE-map so relatively flat?

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Ivan Rochenkov
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-07-13 17:03:08 UTC
Tippia wrote:
…also, what we play in isn't even a galaxy — it's a star cluster, possibly at the outer end of some spiral arm, so it could simply be very thin at that point.

You could also go with the thoroughly unexciting explanation that It's “flat” because those who built the star gates preferred not to go that far outside of the ecliptic planes of the systems they were in, so “in-plane” systems were favoured over ones that would have generated a larger vertical spread. Bunch of lazy unimaginative bums. P



That is actually a great explanation. I never thought of the stars that exist but are not accessible by gate.
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69
Crouching Woman Hidden Cucumber
#22 - 2012-07-13 17:25:58 UTC
Ivan Rochenkov wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…also, what we play in isn't even a galaxy — it's a star cluster, possibly at the outer end of some spiral arm, so it could simply be very thin at that point.

You could also go with the thoroughly unexciting explanation that It's “flat” because those who built the star gates preferred not to go that far outside of the ecliptic planes of the systems they were in, so “in-plane” systems were favoured over ones that would have generated a larger vertical spread. Bunch of lazy unimaginative bums. P



That is actually a great explanation. I never thought of the stars that exist but are not accessible by gate.


Even within the bounds of our map there are stars not accessible by gate, like wormhole systems, these actually occupy the same space but for various reasons were never bridged to. We could occupy a relatively dense cluster but for whatever reasons only bridged to certain stars in that area,
Rain King
Playing Alone Sucks
#23 - 2012-07-13 17:31:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain King
Kyle Ward wrote:
Because galaxies are generally flat.


That. I don't believe the star cluster theory because a galaxy has billions of stars. Out of those billions of stars, millions have planetary systems. Out of those millions of planetary systems, only thousands are going to be inhabitable. Now, I would think that only systems that were inhabitable would have any type of gate, as there would be no real plausible reason to build gates to systems with no discernable use whatsoever. Thus, New Eden.
Rain King
Playing Alone Sucks
#24 - 2012-07-13 17:36:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Rain King
So, um...yeah.
Bronya Boga
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#25 - 2012-07-13 17:37:48 UTC
CCP FoxFour wrote:
Keep in mind also that New Eden is just a cluster of stars in a galaxy. I believe New Eden is 106 light years long, 90 light years wide, and 25 light years thick. Compare that to the 100,000 light years the Milky Way is estimated to be across.


basically there is some room for expansion :D
Kinis Deren
Mosquito Squadron
D0GS OF WAR
#26 - 2012-07-13 17:45:46 UTC
My own musing on the topic suggects that New Eden is part of an irregular galaxy. Since ellipticals are generally dust free and 'Grand Design' spirals will show a generalized concentration of stars in a band for any internal observer, then by the process of elimination, we are left with the hypothesis that New Eden is part of an irregular galaxy (maybe even an isolated dwarf irregular).
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#27 - 2012-07-13 18:04:05 UTC
Rain King wrote:
That. I don't believe the star cluster theory because a galaxy has billions of stars.
It's not really a theory — it's prime lore. The systems we visit are part of a dense star cluster.

That doesn't mean there aren't other systems in between them, but those are unreachable because they are unsuitable for star gate building — you need a binary system to make those work. So the cluster as a whole is a lot denser than the star map suggests and contains more than just the systems (such as the many nebulae you can travel to and beyond).
Adam Junior
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2012-07-13 18:08:05 UTC
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:
Ivan Rochenkov wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…also, what we play in isn't even a galaxy — it's a star cluster, possibly at the outer end of some spiral arm, so it could simply be very thin at that point.

You could also go with the thoroughly unexciting explanation that It's “flat” because those who built the star gates preferred not to go that far outside of the ecliptic planes of the systems they were in, so “in-plane” systems were favoured over ones that would have generated a larger vertical spread. Bunch of lazy unimaginative bums. P



That is actually a great explanation. I never thought of the stars that exist but are not accessible by gate.


Even within the bounds of our map there are stars not accessible by gate, like wormhole systems, these actually occupy the same space but for various reasons were never bridged to. We could occupy a relatively dense cluster but for whatever reasons only bridged to certain stars in that area,


This is not true: the sky in J-Space is entirely alien.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#29 - 2012-07-13 18:38:30 UTC
One oddity is the plane of the ecliptic is the same for every solar system, and lines up with the plane of the star cluster. In our solar system the plane of the ecliptic and that of the galaxy (as seen as the Milky Way) do not line up at all.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#30 - 2012-07-13 18:41:00 UTC
Tobias Sjodin wrote:
Interesting, I've always pictured space as this vast, endless thing which spans in all directions...

Hmm, after googling I realize that my grasp on space physics is severely lacking to understand the why, how and such.


Just wait til you get to the part about the cosmic web.

To be honest, it saddens me that there are adults out there who don't understand the basic structures of the cosmos.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
#31 - 2012-07-13 18:48:59 UTC
It is believed that elliptical or irregular galaxies can't bear life, as the orbits of the stars in them are disturbing the orbits of planets around said stars - so I'd rule this one out as a draft for New Eden.
Milkyway is a bar-spiral galaxy and as the sun (and it's planets) are out of harms way (no supernovae in the vicinity, etc..) it can bear life (undisturbed time-spans are important here, billions of years).

As for the New Eden Star Cluster.. unfortunately somebody chose a 'spiral like' appearance for the 'top-view' and also warped the 'disk' badly.. I think there was a blog how they did it somewhere (creating coordinates, etc..).
All in all not very realistic and the movement within this 'room' by the means of star gates definitely doesn't add to the atmosphere of being in a 3 dimensional 'space'.
Kievan Arakyd
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-07-13 18:52:30 UTC
Tres Farmer wrote:
It is believed that elliptical or irregular galaxies can't bear life, as the orbits of the stars in them are disturbing the orbits of planets around said stars - so I'd rule this one out as a draft for New Eden.
Milkyway is a bar-spiral galaxy and as the sun (and it's planets) are out of harms way (no supernovae in the vicinity, etc..) it can bear life (undisturbed time-spans are important here, billions of years).

As for the New Eden Star Cluster.. unfortunately somebody chose a 'spiral like' appearance for the 'top-view' and also warped the 'disk' badly.. I think there was a blog how they did it somewhere (creating coordinates, etc..).
All in all not very realistic and the movement within this 'room' by the means of star gates definitely doesn't add to the atmosphere of being in a 3 dimensional 'space'.


Without supernovae life wouldnt be possible at all......

Got my Dust514 key...
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#33 - 2012-07-13 18:53:14 UTC
Tres Farmer wrote:
It is believed that elliptical or irregular galaxies can't bear life, as the orbits of the stars in them are disturbing the orbits of planets around said stars - so I'd rule this one out as a draft for New Eden.
Milkyway is a bar-spiral galaxy and as the sun (and it's planets) are out of harms way (no supernovae in the vicinity, etc..) it can bear life (undisturbed time-spans are important here, billions of years).

As for the New Eden Star Cluster.. unfortunately somebody chose a 'spiral like' appearance for the 'top-view' and also warped the 'disk' badly.. I think there was a blog how they did it somewhere (creating coordinates, etc..).
All in all not very realistic and the movement within this 'room' by the means of star gates definitely doesn't add to the atmosphere of being in a 3 dimensional 'space'.


At least it got better when they made the gates actually point in the right direction :P

The Drake is a Lie
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
#34 - 2012-07-13 18:54:41 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
One oddity is the plane of the ecliptic is the same for every solar system, and lines up with the plane of the star cluster. In our solar system the plane of the ecliptic and that of the galaxy (as seen as the Milky Way) do not line up at all.

I think you can't say that.. what you currently see in the client is the 'frozen' state of the orbits of the planets and those happen to be in a horizontal plane that your ship also adjusts to all the time (how realistic :-))
If you'd check out solar maps and the orbits of the planets then you'd see that they aren't aligned with the 'plane of the star cluster'.. funny thing is, we don't even know how the plane of that warped-disk of a small amount of stars (New Eden) is orientated vs. the whole galaxies plane..
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
#35 - 2012-07-13 19:00:41 UTC
Kievan Arakyd wrote:
Tres Farmer wrote:
It is believed that elliptical or irregular galaxies can't bear life, as the orbits of the stars in them are disturbing the orbits of planets around said stars - so I'd rule this one out as a draft for New Eden.
Milkyway is a bar-spiral galaxy and as the sun (and it's planets) are out of harms way (no supernovae in the vicinity, etc..) it can bear life (undisturbed time-spans are important here, billions of years).
*snip*

Without supernovae life wouldnt be possible at all......

True.. I think they still have no real clue how it was possible for our star (and it's orbiting bodies) to end up with so much supernova-end-product (elements above iron) so far from the core of the galaxy in a stable orbit around the SMBH and in such a 'quiet' area of space (no supernovae within some LY and last billion years).
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2012-07-13 19:02:04 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
To be honest, it saddens me that there are adults out there who don't understand the basic structures of the cosmos.

Cosmos?? Dude there are adults out there that don't even understand basic stuff on this planet, much less the cosmos.
Lilliana Stelles
#37 - 2012-07-13 19:08:47 UTC
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:
Ivan Rochenkov wrote:
Tippia wrote:
…also, what we play in isn't even a galaxy — it's a star cluster, possibly at the outer end of some spiral arm, so it could simply be very thin at that point.

You could also go with the thoroughly unexciting explanation that It's “flat” because those who built the star gates preferred not to go that far outside of the ecliptic planes of the systems they were in, so “in-plane” systems were favoured over ones that would have generated a larger vertical spread. Bunch of lazy unimaginative bums. P



That is actually a great explanation. I never thought of the stars that exist but are not accessible by gate.


Even within the bounds of our map there are stars not accessible by gate, like wormhole systems, these actually occupy the same space but for various reasons were never bridged to. We could occupy a relatively dense cluster but for whatever reasons only bridged to certain stars in that area,

W-space is much more spread out than that. Black holes, quasars, all stuff tha would endanger the cluster if it were nearby. Not to mention, it's out of range of jump drives, so it's further than current jump technology would allow us to even build a stargate.

Not a forum alt. 
Valeo Galaem
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#38 - 2012-07-13 19:17:23 UTC
The old Universe Map used to show the planetary orbits of star systems if you zoomed in enough (there was no star system map then). It clearly showed that the ecliptic planes of each star system were not aligned with each other, with some heavily inclined.

With the new map, the 'camera' always aligns with the ecliptic plane when in the Star System Map or ship view, so we have no reference to the systems' orientations anymore.

Standalone Windows build of ccpgames/dae-to-red

https://github.com/Nu11u5/dae-to-red/releases
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
#39 - 2012-07-13 19:17:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Tres Farmer
Lilliana Stelles wrote:
IHaveCandyGetInTheVan69 wrote:
Ivan Rochenkov wrote:
*sinp*
That is actually a great explanation. I never thought of the stars that exist but are not accessible by gate.


Even within the bounds of our map there are stars not accessible by gate, like wormhole systems, these actually occupy the same space but for various reasons were never bridged to. We could occupy a relatively dense cluster but for whatever reasons only bridged to certain stars in that area,

W-space is much more spread out than that. Black holes, quasars, all stuff tha would endanger the cluster if it were nearby. Not to mention, it's out of range of jump drives, so it's further than current jump technology would allow us to even build a stargate.

Na.. I have no first hand info why, but the w-space cluster technically has the same foot-print as the new eden cluster (similar volume, you can see that when you use the database dump and render the positions of the stars) and CCP probably chose the huge offset (coordinates) to avoid any *possible* hiccups with their mechanic system in regards to travel (jumpdrives).
ctx2007
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2012-07-13 19:20:17 UTC
If you move away from the nebulas and look at space you will see a faint blue wavey line, actually quite thick i beleive this represents the milky way.

Ok fact time outside our flat disc of a galaxy there are clusters of stars defying the gravity of the spin.

You only realise you life has been a waste of time, when you wake up dead.
Previous page123Next page