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Defected Amarrian moves to Pator

Author
Amaki Mai
Doomheim
#61 - 2012-07-13 03:52:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Amaki Mai
Lyskal Oskold wrote:
I'm so horrible. I mean look at all the cultures I've tried to destroy and the disgusting slave breeding compounds I control. Oh wait, that's not me.

Why are you all even talking here, don't you have siblings to kill to increase your social standings? Aww, you herded us up and treated us like property, I'm just doing the same to the permanently brainwashed weapons you call soldiers I manage to capture. You don't treat them like people, yet I should? Religious hypocrisy, wow, that's rare.


Firstly, if you do Evil in a Good cause it does not become Good by some strange process of ethical alchemy. It remains evil and no matter what sort of spirituality you hold to be true, it stands to your account come the final reckoning.

Secondly, secular hypocrisy smells no better than religious hypocrisy. Your argument that you have been done ill actually becomes weaker with every atrocity that you commit, as well as weakening whatever moral high ground that you think you occupy, you also serve to deepen the rift between the two sides and work counter to any kind of lasting settlement.

Boo-hoo-hoo, so the ancestors of some of the Amarr gathered up some of the ancestors of your people and treated them as less-than-human? I fail to see how you are winning any kind of argument by gaining or maintaining your self-determination and using that freedom to VOLUNTARILY act less-than-human.
William Nimitz
Doomheim
#62 - 2012-07-13 03:54:49 UTC
Amaki Mai wrote:
William Nimitz wrote:
Yet the Amarr seldom do this, instead choosing to subdue their slaves via chemical addiction and allow them to spiritually progress within the service of their master.


Good grief! Vitoc is the exception and not the rule and it is a rather lazy exception to boot!
When a holder is obliged to entrust a slave with certain responsibilities, I still contend that a mere Vitoc addiction is probably more humane than a neat little scar behind the ear caused by the surgical removal of a person's sense of self and free will. Granted I'm sure the Amarr have more evasive tools at their disposal, but I believe my initial point was that the matari should be grateful when those are not used.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Amaki Mai
Doomheim
#63 - 2012-07-13 04:14:04 UTC
Granted that my only experience with Slave Holding and Management has been with the crews aboard my ships and also granted that I found the results of slavery to be less than salutory, I have to say that if you want your Slaves to do anything like a half-decent job you have to leave them with the capacity for free-will, initiative and creativity.

I'll also say that any job that doesn't require those three things is best done by a machine.
Oserik Illard
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#64 - 2012-07-13 04:16:20 UTC
George Whitebread wrote:
I don't believe in people being born into a certain role, and that one can't forge one's own future


Ironically, you'll encounter a similar sort of thinking in Matari society. We're nowhere near as stratified or rigid as the Empire, but we aren't as fluid as the Federation either.

Clans and sub-clans often work in similar professions. My clan has an inordinate number of bankers and financial types. Others are soldiers or scientists. I've even heard of a sub-clan where everyone is a stone-mason, and another that's composed entirely of surgeons.

The right Voluval can open doors; make people respect or fear you. The wrong one will earn you a glossectomy, or a one-way ticket to Vo'shun. Being born into a certain family won't doom you to a life of manual labor, or confer immutable privileges, but it does impact one's lot in life. Tradition and family are important. A Minmatar born into a family of soldiers is likely to follow in the footsteps of his predecessors. You will certainly find Brutor engineers and travelling Sebiestor mystics, but they are the exception, rather than the rule.

From a business perspective, the tribal nature of our society makes it very difficult for foreign baseliners to rise to great heights without some kind of sponsorship or other link (e.g., marriage). As a capsuleer you'll be able to build a command center and a few factories wherever you go, but give up any dreams of acquiring a controlling stake a in Republic corporation, running for office, or climbing to a position of power within the non-militia military hierarchy. If you're looking for social acceptance, well, you're never going to be "one of us." This has already been discussed by some previous posters, so I'm not going to elaborate further.

The easiest thing for you to do would be to stay station-side, in the hermetically sealed capsuleer sections. However, based on your post, it looks like you want to know about living planet-side. I'd strongly advise against this, even if you weren't Amarr, but I'm feeling chatty so I'll humor you.

As a capsuleer you'll have an easier time than some planet-bound defector or emigrant. You won't need to worry about holding down a job, or being able to afford the exorbitant prices you're likely to be charged for accommodations and other essentials.

I would stick to Pator, or similarly populated worlds in Heimatar and Metropolis. In the more cosmopolitan parts of the Republic you'll probably be fine. We Matari usually mind our own business, and you're not likely to receive trouble from neighbors, store clerks, and the like.

Avoid the local cops at all costs and stay out of the shadier parts of town. Otherwise, you're liable to be murdered or fall victim to some terrible "accident." There seems to be an inordinate number of people falling off of roofs and drowning in their own bathtubs these days.

If you move to Molden Heath, look for a place in Gelfiven or Teonusude. If you enjoy living dangerously, are very stupid, or simply must purchase that beachfront villa on Hrober V (or some other low-sec backwater), then I'd advise you to hire a lot of bodyguards. Not the beefy kind who push bottle rats out of your VIP booth, but trained killers. The kind of people who will open fire on an unarmed crowd of women and children if they swarm your armored PV. Make nice with the local powers that be (bribe them), mind your own business, and you should be fine.

Another thing, I would avoid contact with recently freed slaves and our "rediscovered" Nefantar and Starkmanir brethren. Folk are suspicious of the once-Ammatar. Some are desperate to join the struggle and prove their loyalty to the cause. Others simply don't like getting bricks thrown through their windows at night or getting spit on in the market. They might seek acceptance, or a temporary reprieve from abuse, at your expense. I shouldn't have to spell out why it's prudent to avoid freed slaves.


Best of luck. Feel free to contact me if you have questions.








Scherezad
Revenent Defence Corperation
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#65 - 2012-07-13 05:11:32 UTC
William Nimitz wrote:
Here is an example of State interrogation techniques that I readily found in the archives, though my previous statement concerning capsule trials on unwilling subjects was concerning another file who's name escapes me at the moment. If I recall the individual was a soldier within the Caldari Navy, and it was his CO that tricked him into participation unbeknownst to what awaited him ((if anyone remembers which chronicle this is please share)). This information, combined with my personal experiences growing up in SO121, seeing my peers who didn't make the cut taken away never to be seen again, lends me to the conclusion that this sense of ethics you and others ascribe to is hardly the norm in our society.


I'm familiar with the implant your report highlights - I think it's an Entorhinal/Frontal Bridge. I've actually got one, albeit not configured the same way. The device mediates memory recall, and is part of the TCMC Processing Cluster. They're amazing devices, and have been used to assist persons with Parkinson's and Alzheimer's disease. They are also used for the remediation of criminals, a fact which I am somewhat uncomfortable with. The case you point out in specific seems very heavy-handed for a thief. There's nothing there to indicate your claim that he was tricked into the crime, or that he was a soldier. I'll have to take the story at face-value until then.

Maintaining this premise, would the fact that some elements of the State do these horrible things mean that it is in line with basic Caldari ethics? No. I'm sure you could uncover equally horrible remediation techniques from all of the nations of New Eden. This doesn't make these the major ethos of those nations. They are the actions of the unscrupulous and powerful.

This said, I'm still listening. Do you know who was responsible for these awful procedures, or a little more about the victim?
William Nimitz
Doomheim
#66 - 2012-07-13 05:26:18 UTC  |  Edited by: William Nimitz
Scherezad wrote:
Do you know who was responsible for these awful procedures, or a little more about the victim?
Such things are not for me to know, and best not questioned. I'm not eager to wake up with a neat little incision behind the ear myself.

Scherezad wrote:
Maintaining this premise, would the fact that some elements of the State do these horrible things mean that it is in line with basic Caldari ethics?
I'm not sure what you mean by "basic Caldari ethics". Unless you're referring to unquestioning loyalty to the State and one's corporation, you seem to be under the presumption that certain ethical hindrances shared by State liberals and various patriotic groups are in fact universal, especially among the practical elite.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#67 - 2012-07-13 06:14:41 UTC
This is a whole lot of words to come to the conclusion that William is a psychopath and leave it at that.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#68 - 2012-07-13 06:27:30 UTC
Halete wrote:
This is a whole lot of words to come to the conclusion that William is a psychopath and leave it at that.
Be that as it may I found this in the archives as well. Seems your so called "people" are not above some rather crude and expectedly primitive interrogation techniques of their own, except I don't think I've ever heard of a State official hearing talking lizards or seeing ghosts. Roll

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2012-07-13 06:44:56 UTC

Fascinating, I don't remember giving a ****.

People torture people. Welcome to life, kid.

I fail to see how this diffuses the fact that you're a psychopath, or relates to it in any way, in-fact.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#70 - 2012-07-13 06:57:19 UTC
Halete wrote:
I fail to see how this diffuses the fact that you're a psychopath, or relates to it in any way, in-fact.
And I fail to see what exactly brought you to the conclusion that I am a "psychopath" as you put it, when I've never heard so much as a talking newt. Also sorry I didn't ask sooner but, who are you and why should I care? Actually don't bother answering that, being yet another foul mouthed matari heathen among so many others, I doubt theirs a legitimate reason.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2012-07-13 07:02:35 UTC
William Nimitz wrote:
Halete wrote:
I fail to see how this diffuses the fact that you're a psychopath, or relates to it in any way, in-fact.
And I fail to see what exactly brought you to the conclusion that I am a "psychopath" as you put it, when I've never heard so much as a talking newt. Also sorry I didn't ask sooner but, who are you and why should I care? Actually don't bother answering that, being yet another foul mouthed matari heathen among so many others, I doubt theirs a legitimate reason.


William,

From a brief check I see that you've just received your piloting license so I'm not very surprised that you haven't heard of me. Honestly, many don't anyway and I'm not particularly worried nor do I care about that.

What am is a good judge of character. "You're a psychopath." "But you see, some Matari use violent interrogation methods!" isn't a valid rebuttal.

Neither is backpedaling and saying "Well you're a dirty generalization, I don't even know you so why should I care?"

Disappointing.

Let's do lunch some time.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#72 - 2012-07-13 07:05:54 UTC  |  Edited by: William Nimitz
Halete wrote:
William Nimitz wrote:
Halete wrote:
I fail to see how this diffuses the fact that you're a psychopath, or relates to it in any way, in-fact.
And I fail to see what exactly brought you to the conclusion that I am a "psychopath" as you put it, when I've never heard so much as a talking newt. Also sorry I didn't ask sooner but, who are you and why should I care? Actually don't bother answering that, being yet another foul mouthed matari heathen among so many others, I doubt theirs a legitimate reason.


William,

From a brief check I see that you've just received your piloting license so I'm not very surprised that you haven't heard of me. Honestly, many don't anyway and I'm not particularly worried nor do I care about that.

What am is a good judge of character. "You're a psychopath." "But you see, some Matari use violent interrogation methods!" isn't a valid rebuttal.

Neither is backpedaling and saying "Well you're a dirty generalization, I don't even know you so why should I care?"

Disappointing.

Let's do lunch some time.

Thanks, but if I wanted to eat with an animal I would purchase a slaver hound.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2012-07-13 07:10:37 UTC
William Nimitz wrote:

Thanks, but if I wanted to eat with an animal I would purchase a slaver hound.


As evasive as ever, I see.

And a slaver hound, really? One of those runt little puppies? What are you, Gallente?


"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#74 - 2012-07-13 07:17:05 UTC
Halete wrote:
"But you see, some Matari use violent interrogation methods!"
Well if the information presented in the archives is to be taken at face value it would seem that minmatar interrogation techniques are not only the most barbaric of the four empires, but some of their interrogators are certifiable schizophrenics to boot. With that in mind I find it amusing that you think I'm the psychotic one.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2012-07-13 07:28:22 UTC
What other people may or may not be does dilute your own responsibility.

Focus, William.

I realize that it's distracting for you to be faced with a strong Matari woman who communicates beyond snarls and barks, but please try to pull yourself together.

Really, let's do lunch. It'll help you relax.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#76 - 2012-07-13 07:33:33 UTC
Halete wrote:
I realize that it's distracting for you to be faced with a strong Matari woman who communicates beyond snarls and barks...
I wouldn't know, I'll let you know when I find one.

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#77 - 2012-07-13 07:35:37 UTC
By the way, I noticed you have something on your cheek there, perhaps something left over from your last customer?

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2012-07-13 07:57:41 UTC
Teasing a Minmatar about their marks. ((1)) This is new and interesting.

Perhaps you're not a psychopath. Perhaps you're just frightfully dull.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21

William Nimitz
Doomheim
#79 - 2012-07-13 08:03:04 UTC
I'm sorry, I didn't realize that you were a survivor of domestic violence. I'll refrain from further antagonizing. ((I like the little rifter in the corner))

It is a symptom of madness that thoughts become uncontrollably disjointed. This can be encouraged.

Halete
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2012-07-13 08:07:25 UTC
Only a victim of violence at the hand of your beloved Holder over-lords, dear.

"To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin" - The Scriptures, Book of Missions 13:21