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Wormholes

 
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Self destructing and you.

First post
Author
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#101 - 2012-07-11 11:15:00 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Mr Bigwinky wrote:
I can't think of how to write this out any easier for you... erm.

Your ship blew up because I shot at it, a battle happened, you lost.
Regardless of what made your ship explode, it still exploded because I agressed it.

I am yet to hear a good reason there should be no record of this...

"You did not kill it" is not a good reason because it is wrong. I killed it, it is dead because of me, who cares if you got the final blow.
But you didn't kill it, and back to the causation argument, you argue that it exploded because you aggressed it. So what? lets just suggest you're not coming close to breaking the tank, did you REALLY kill it? REALLY? You argue that because you fired upon it, maybe only the once, you are entitled to be considered a contribuatory factor in killing it. Should the person I buy the ship from be considered culpable, remember, I wouldn't have SD the ship if I hadn't bought it would I? Should squad leader be culpable for warping squad?
Mr Bigwinky wrote:

Rather than justify why I should have a killmail, I think it'd be better to hear the reasons you should be able to deny someone one, or why you would want to?
Simply this: If you're not the immediate factor in a ships popping you didn't kill it.

Mr Bigwinky wrote:
I'm betting almost everyone who thinks they deserve to deny a killmail does so out of 1 of 2 reasons (neither are valid)

1: Spite - your spite is not a valid game mechanic, you are the type of person that turns off a multiplayer right before the results and act like noone won because you turned it off...

2: Killboard - you don't want the loss, and wish to pretend like it didn't happen (even though it did)

That about right?

3. You didn't apply enough damage to kill it.
4. You were not the immediate factor in it's destruction
5. The pilot had the option to deny the ship and equipment, you were unable to prevent him from doing what he wanted to do, therefore you failed at YOUR end.

Michael1995 wrote:
Killing (& baking stuff) is what this game is all about, self destruction is for cowards IMO, If they failed to protect their vessels they deserve to die.
Is cowardice in a game even possible? The repercussion are zero in any and all situations.


Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#102 - 2012-07-11 12:08:30 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#103 - 2012-07-11 12:14:48 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.


I MEANT YOU!

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Mr Bigwinky
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#104 - 2012-07-11 12:16:54 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.


I MEANT YOU!
Saw that coming!
Welcome to EVE online, here's your rubix cube, go F*** yourself ♥
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#105 - 2012-07-11 12:22:20 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.


I MEANT YOU!

I don't understand.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#106 - 2012-07-11 12:31:44 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:

Stop crying, my (big) belly hurts.

I don't think he can help it. If it works why bother fixing it? I don't know why people are so emotional about changing this.


I MEANT YOU!

I don't understand.

I'm sure.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Cryostassiss
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#107 - 2012-07-11 15:16:17 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:

I don't understand.



This explains everything.
Zyella Stormborn
Green Seekers
#108 - 2012-07-11 17:04:35 UTC
Elisa Fir wrote:
This game is not all about combat and the actions of a target are not all about the aggressor.

The common misconception is that the reason for the target to self-destruct is to deny the aggressor a killmail. However, when I self-destruct a Strategic Cruiser, I'm self-destructing to protect my skill points and not give away a perfectly repairable ship.
The aggressors and his precious killmail are irrelevant to me

IF someone does indeed self-destructing only to deny the aggressor a killmail, it is just another form of grieving. There are many forms of grieving in EVE, it is just that usually the aggressor is on the delivering, instead of on the receiving side.

So, the tears about not receiving a killmail are no different from the tears from suicide ganked miners. Not getting what you want, or losing what you have, is part of EVE. It is what sets this game apart from your average cuddly MMO.



Pirate

There is a special Hell for people like that, Right next to child molestors, and people that talk in the theater. ~Firefly

Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#109 - 2012-07-11 17:15:17 UTC
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
Elisa Fir wrote:
This game is not all about combat and the actions of a target are not all about the aggressor.

The common misconception is that the reason for the target to self-destruct is to deny the aggressor a killmail. However, when I self-destruct a Strategic Cruiser, I'm self-destructing to protect my skill points and not give away a perfectly repairable ship.
The aggressors and his precious killmail are irrelevant to me

IF someone does indeed self-destructing only to deny the aggressor a killmail, it is just another form of grieving. There are many forms of grieving in EVE, it is just that usually the aggressor is on the delivering, instead of on the receiving side.

So, the tears about not receiving a killmail are no different from the tears from suicide ganked miners. Not getting what you want, or losing what you have, is part of EVE. It is what sets this game apart from your average cuddly MMO.



Pirate


There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#110 - 2012-07-11 17:16:57 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:
Zyella Stormborn wrote:
Elisa Fir wrote:
This game is not all about combat and the actions of a target are not all about the aggressor.

The common misconception is that the reason for the target to self-destruct is to deny the aggressor a killmail. However, when I self-destruct a Strategic Cruiser, I'm self-destructing to protect my skill points and not give away a perfectly repairable ship.
The aggressors and his precious killmail are irrelevant to me

IF someone does indeed self-destructing only to deny the aggressor a killmail, it is just another form of grieving. There are many forms of grieving in EVE, it is just that usually the aggressor is on the delivering, instead of on the receiving side.

So, the tears about not receiving a killmail are no different from the tears from suicide ganked miners. Not getting what you want, or losing what you have, is part of EVE. It is what sets this game apart from your average cuddly MMO.



Pirate


There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.
I certainly wouldn't agree it's better, you leave a perfectly serviceable ship behind.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Cryostassiss
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#111 - 2012-07-11 17:30:04 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:


There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.


You're right, I don't understand the quote above. lrn2 english.

Also, since when can you self destruct POS's and POS mods? (Spoiler: You can't)
Kalel Nimrott
Caldari Provisions
#112 - 2012-07-11 18:01:30 UTC
Cryostassiss wrote:
Kalel Nimrott wrote:


There were two points that were made during the course of this thread.

1-. The SD that matter were of capital and pos mods/poses.
2-. Also as important as above was the fact that a more advanced tool than the kill mail was requiered to better undestand how a battle develops, other than fraps.

That being said I do not understand the quote above except for tve tengu thing that is pretty obvious. But i tell you this. Eject worksfaster and better than SD.


You're right, I don't understand the quote above. lrn2 english.

Also, since when can you self destruct POS's and POS mods? (Spoiler: You can't)


I meant the ships inside, I messed up. Can't work and try to answer a post at the same time.

PS: engrish second languagege, my mess some up thing s in times from times

Bob Artis, you will be missed.

O7

Cryostassiss
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#113 - 2012-07-12 14:07:48 UTC
Kalel Nimrott wrote:


I meant the ships inside, I messed up. Can't work and try to answer a post at the same time.

PS: engrish second languagege, my mess some up thing s in times from times


Rodger, sense it makes.

Be back, work the calls.
Myz Toyou
Nekkid Inc.
#114 - 2012-07-14 02:25:04 UTC
Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#115 - 2012-07-14 04:21:13 UTC
Myz Toyou wrote:
Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#116 - 2012-07-14 13:01:17 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
Myz Toyou wrote:
Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it

Well god didn't make women to work hard did he?

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.

Messoroz
AQUILA INC
Verge of Collapse
#117 - 2012-07-14 21:12:03 UTC
Apolyon I wrote:
Myz Toyou wrote:
Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it


The SD mails are bugs, they happened a few months back as well randomly until CCP fixed it again. You can tell its a bug because the mails are malformed.
Myz Toyou
Nekkid Inc.
#118 - 2012-07-14 21:44:56 UTC
Messoroz wrote:
Apolyon I wrote:
Myz Toyou wrote:
Seems CCP woke up and released KM for SDing, atleast that what people claim since today on 2 Supers that SDed and issued a KM anyway.

If so, huge thanks to CCP

words spreading out, just need more confirmation.

anyway OP can suck it


The SD mails are bugs, they happened a few months back as well randomly until CCP fixed it again. You can tell its a bug because the mails are malformed.



We thought already so as we got yesterday 3 Cha Ching PLC Dreads SDing on us and no KM was issued Sad
Xen Solarus
Furious Destruction and Salvage
#119 - 2012-07-14 22:37:46 UTC
Obviously you'd need WAAAAAY more firepower. Then your issue wouldn't apply.

Holding down a solo capital is way to easy. If your not bringing enough guns to kill it fast, then its well within the capital ship pilots right to self-destruct. He's still losing a massive wad of isk, just with the added satisfaction of denying you of you precious killmail. Should have brought more guns!

This is assuming they haven't changed it. Sure seems like a easy way to get the killmail if they have, assuming you can afford to self-destruct one just for that. Roll

Post with your main, like a BOSS!

And no, i don't live in highsec.  As if that would make your opinion any less wrong.  

Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#120 - 2012-07-14 23:27:42 UTC
Xen Solarus wrote:

Holding down a solo capital is way to easy. If your not bringing enough guns to kill it fast, then its well within the capital ship pilots right to self-destruct. He's still losing a massive wad of isk, just with the added satisfaction of denying you of you precious killmail. Should have brought more guns!


Then when you bring 40 T3s or 3 dreads people complain about blobbing... besides I've been in a couple of fights with a sizeable enough fleet and the carrier's SD timer has run out while hes still half way through structure.