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[IPO] FEARLESS. ATX FUND

Author
Xintri Ra'Virr
Yamaguchi-Gumi
#21 - 2012-07-10 07:50:05 UTC
If you can't afford it the Tournament isn't for you. Simple as that.
Go and be Fearless elseware, also we don't like beggars here ya know?
ry ry
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2012-07-10 08:26:45 UTC  |  Edited by: ry ry
Xintri Ra'Virr wrote:
If you can't afford it the Tournament isn't for you. Simple as that.
Go and be Fearless elseware, also we don't like beggars here ya know?

Apparently you have misunderstood, this is an IPO.

A risky investment granted, but the potential rewards are that much higher. You don't have to invest and we're not begging anybody to - we are simply offering people the opportunity to bet on us directly, whilst improving the odds of us winning in the process.

Not to mention if we do go out then your isk won't be filling the coffers of whoever took your bet it'll have been blown to smithereens in glorious space combat. We've even agreed to reimburse a proportional amount of isk from the IPO fund if we leave the competition before it's spent.

So no, it's not begging and you are a below par troll.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#23 - 2012-07-10 09:32:48 UTC
I mean you guys no ill will, but I think 5:1 odds is overstating your chances.

If that was the only problem then I'd probably consider investing in this, but in addition to the advertised return not matching the long odds we have the issue of lack of security.

We can fairly assume that you will not throw the final, if you get there, due to the massive rewards at stake. But we can make no such assumption about the earlier matches. Participating with unsecured borrowed funds just increases the incentive for you to throw a match in exchange for a bribe.

Should you win, we have no reason to believe you will honor your obligations.

If you want this to be a serious offering, rather than just a begging letter, then you need to rework it completely. You need to put up collateral with a third party to match the funds you borrow. This collateral should be liquidated should you be placed 1st or 2nd in the tournament but not honor your obligations. You should provide separate, sensible odds for 1st and 2nd place (5:1 2nd, 10:1 1st for example). While you may think the option to refund unspent isk on a loss is a good idea, it really isn't worth anything, so you should just drop it.

Essentially, I think you should offer this as a secured bet - not a begging letter and not an IPO.
ry ry
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2012-07-10 09:35:12 UTC
Cross-posted over from FHC. It's actually a response to somebody else but the sentiment is equally applicable.




We fully expected to be told we were cunts, or scammers, or beggers. It's just what people do in eve. This isn't a scam and will not become a scam.

Think of [this IPO] as betting on FEARLESS. directly rather than an regular IPO, and at least this way if you lose your isk won't be funding some other bastard's falcon alts. We've also go a reimbursement policy incase we go out without spending all the isk so we've done everything we can to minimalise the risk to our backers.

Contrary to popular belief, most of what Fearless get upto is for fun rather than some burning desire to post a lot of crap all the time. If this means the difference between fielding competitive, entertaining fleet comps that make the tournament more interesting - for us aswell as you guys! - rather than just going through the motions like half the teams rocking (and losing with) their sleipnir fleets will be, then we're all for it.

It remains to be seen how difficult our group is, but there are 3 guaranteed matches and we've scored points in our two previous matches rather then getting dunked, we can field virtually any fleet comp by merit of our high average SP and but for a silly mistake by one pilot who shall not be named, we'd have had a 100% record. Our chances of progressing are no worse than the majority of the otehr 32 teams through.

Not bad going for a self-confessed carebear alliance with less than 20 active members.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#25 - 2012-07-10 10:12:56 UTC
Unfortunately everything about this offering suggests incompetence.

You really should have got someone experienced in raising money to do this for you (like HYDRA did) rather than doing a botch job of it yourself.

If you had shown some wisdom or ability in this area, it might have gone some way to quell the fears that you are inept in other areas.
ry ry
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2012-07-10 10:14:26 UTC  |  Edited by: ry ry
Bad Bobby wrote:
Essentially, I think you should offer this as a secured bet - not a begging letter and not an IPO.

Pretty much, you'll have to excuse us abusing the jargon. We've deliberately kept all his as simple as possible for a number of reasons - we only thought of it yesterday, and we can fund the tournament without additional backing. The difference is ensuring we are as competitive as we can be.

That means we can spend more time practising rather than making isk, we can push the envelope with our fleet comps more, and we can stump up for sets of primo hardwirings for all pilots rather than just key ships etc.

As it stands it has already been moderately successful already with a handful of assorted friends and associates helping us out, they all accept the risks involved, only bet what they could afford to lose, and we're ballsdeep in testing at the moment preparing for the group stages.



edit:
Bad Bobby wrote:
Unfortunately everything about this offering suggests incompetence.

You really should have got someone experienced in raising money to do this for you (like HYDRA did) rather than doing a botch job of it yourself.

If you had shown some wisdom or ability in this area, it might have gone some way to quell the fears that you are inept in other areas.

Lol - we already know we're **** at Market Discussions Forum mate, none of us have any particular interest in being spaceship hedgefund managers, ponzi scammers or internet investment bankers. This forum is your PvP, not ours. ;)
Private Pineapple
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2012-07-10 11:29:29 UTC
2b sent

.

Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#28 - 2012-07-10 11:31:24 UTC
ry ry wrote:
we only thought of it yesterday

ry ry wrote:
Lol - we already know we're **** at Market Discussions Forum mate

This is my point. You continue to project the impression that you naively blunder into areas of the game you do not understand, without preparation or forethought and foolishly expect it to end well. This behavior has bungled your MD offering and it's not unreasonable for people to expect the same in the tournament.
ry ry
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#29 - 2012-07-10 11:50:38 UTC
Yep. That is pretty much our modus operandi.

Snake O'Connor
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#30 - 2012-07-10 11:52:05 UTC
I don't think you *get* FEARLESS.
Larkonis Trassler
Doctrine.
FEARLESS.
#31 - 2012-07-10 11:56:33 UTC
Time Funnel wrote:
Larkonis Trassler wrote:
Time Funnel wrote:
No matter the result, you will not get ISK back. Save your money.


Why do you hate me so much bro?


I got involved in a no collateral transaction with you a while ago. You simply took the money.

I suppose you have changed?


Oh really? And when was this?
Snake O'Connor
The Legion of Spoon
Curatores Veritatis Alliance
#32 - 2012-07-10 12:27:02 UTC
Look at his alliance Lark and think about it.
dougfunnie
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#33 - 2012-07-10 12:52:08 UTC
ry ry wrote:
and but for a silly mistake by one pilot who shall not be named, we'd have had a 100% record.


damn, if it weren't for those pesky opponents
Stoffl
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2012-07-10 13:17:09 UTC
Bad Bobby wrote:
ry ry wrote:
we only thought of it yesterday

ry ry wrote:
Lol - we already know we're **** at Market Discussions Forum mate

This is my point. You continue to project the impression that you naively blunder into areas of the game you do not understand, without preparation or forethought and foolishly expect it to end well.


Except we fully expected to fail horribly but instead we made it into the group stages, even though we had Snake-ThermOdynamic-onnor in our team.
Apparently theres loads of Alliances out there who are even less competent at :Spaceships: than us, it's quite fascinating.
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#35 - 2012-07-10 13:49:29 UTC
Stoffl wrote:
Except we fully expected to fail horribly but instead we made it into the group stages, even though we had Snake-ThermOdynamic-onnor in our team.
Apparently theres loads of Alliances out there who are even less competent at :Spaceships: than us, it's quite fascinating.

It's a magical journey your going on, I'm sure. But while the fact that there are bads in the alliance tournament may have been news to you it wasn't news to me. There simply aren't enough skilled and interested PvP groups in EVE for the alliance tournament schedule to be fully populated with good teams.

You are absolutely correct that some terrible teams have reached the group stages and depending on the draw you could easily make further headway against them. I honestly wish you the best with that because with HYDRABREAK out of the running we desperately need the remaining teams to raise their game in order to avoid a weak tournament.

I would hope that this "IPO" is just an attempt to make yourselves look stupid in order to manage expectations, but Hanlon's razor and my own experience cautions against that kind of thinking.

Anyway, I sincerely wish you good fortune in your tournament endeavours.
ry ry
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#36 - 2012-07-10 15:55:44 UTC  |  Edited by: ry ry
Now you're thinking FEARLESS.ly

Thank you for your support, i wish you well in your posting endeavours.
Kyle Ward
Doomheim
#37 - 2012-07-10 16:15:02 UTC
If you win, I will biomass myself.

The Sandbox, you're playing it wrong!

kyrieee
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#38 - 2012-07-10 16:33:16 UTC
Strong words, for a post vs post alt
Mme Pinkerton
#39 - 2012-07-10 17:10:10 UTC
IIRC Hydra used their flagship fittings and some other setups as collateral for some deal in last year's AT.

If the main concern really is about Fearless throwing some match up to the finals but they could be expected to fight to the best of their ability in the finals this might be a model to emulate.
Teron Radec
Fairlight Corp
Rooks and Kings
#40 - 2012-07-11 00:37:31 UTC
Given you're currently in 21st place and your next match is against Goons, I think there's little chance of you seeing the finals I'm afraid. GL