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scan strength for scanning unprobable ships.
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Sjugar
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-07-01 12:07:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Sjugar
I understand that with max skills and low-grade virtue implants you can scan down previously-unprobable ships. But what is the threshold? What scan strength do you need at minumum?
Fronkfurter McSheebleton
Horse Feathers
CAStabouts
#2 - 2012-07-01 12:47:10 UTC
Depends on how the ship you're scanning is fit, really.

thhief ghabmoef
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-07-01 13:50:43 UTC
You also need covert ops frigate with gravity rigs and Sisters combat probes. So yeah, scan strenght you need is quite high.
Sjugar
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-07-01 16:18:23 UTC
Jorma Morkkis wrote:
You also need covert ops frigate with gravity rigs and Sisters combat probes. So yeah, scan strenght you need is quite high.
I understand.
There's several things making your scan strength higher.
Your ship, your skill, if your using sister probes/sister probe launcher and using virtue implants.

How much of all of that do you need? What is the exact scan strength you need?
chris elliot
Treasury Department
Plug N Play
#5 - 2012-07-01 16:45:25 UTC
CCP has removed the ability to be unprobable. Thus, all ships can be scanned.

Cov-ops frig, Sisters launcher and probes and some decent skills will get it done now.

Now, as for how fast you want to do it. That's up to how much you want to spend.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#6 - 2012-07-01 16:48:41 UTC
Like Fronkfurter already told, it depends on the fit of the ship you try to scan out.

I'd aim for 80+ probe strenght, 62.9 certainly was not enough in my tests.



.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#7 - 2012-07-01 16:49:47 UTC
chris elliot wrote:
CCP has removed the ability to be unprobable. Thus, all ships can be scanned.

Cov-ops frig, Sisters launcher and probes and some decent skills will get it done now.

Now, as for how fast you want to do it. That's up to how much you want to spend.


Nope, it won't get it done. You need the implants on top of max skills.

.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-07-01 21:14:27 UTC
chris elliot wrote:
CCP has removed the ability to be unprobable. Thus, all ships can be scanned.
Cov-ops frig, Sisters launcher and probes and some decent skills will get it done now.
Now, as for how fast you want to do it. That's up to how much you want to spend.


^this is not true, go try it.


Quote:
Depends on how the ship you're scanning is fit, really.


^also not true, once a ship hits the previous 'unprobable' threshold the sig/sensor ratio gets capped and it makes no difference.


You can definitely do it with a full virtue set and you definitely can't do it without a virtue set, even with maxed skills. (ive tried both.)
Ive never tried with a partial set but I have heard from others that i reasonably trust the you can do it with the first 4 virtues and a 10% prospector implant.

There is no Bob.

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Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#9 - 2012-07-01 22:50:21 UTC
If you want to catch some alt booster T3 this deserves to put the same amount of effort (isk) to get it, but then there's D-scan and actually be aligned to celestial/station/POS/BM/gate etc.

Now this can be a problem for people with behaviour troubles that like everything "that way" (you know the guy pushing his car blip 3 or 4 times because he forgot he already closed the dam thing a few times already)
If you don't, who cares?-what's not on grid, easily/fast probable doesn't deserve attention and waste of time.
Change system and go pick fights somewhere else, kill another lazy farmer/tourist and don't think about it any more that one guy with something you couldn't get.

If it's your challenge then get all probing skills to 5, T2 rigs, Cov Ops 5, full Virtue set, named implant, Sisters Probes and Launcher. (I still think it's a waste of time)

brb
VanDam
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-07-02 13:21:43 UTC
I'd also be interested in an answer to the inverse senario if possible.

My booster Loki with T2 Skirmish links, Skirmish Mindlink and 3x ECCM gives me a ratio of 1.09.

I've heard the previous 'unprobable' magic number was 1.08 (initially I couldn't work out why I didn't have 1.08 before realising that I don't have Defensive Subsystem lvl 5, thought I did). Am I for all intents and purposes 'unprobable' for all but highly skilled Covops pilots, or is it still relatively easy to get a location until someone reaches the magic number?

Thanks.
Sjugar
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-07-02 19:52:56 UTC
VanDam wrote:
I'd also be interested in an answer to the inverse senario if possible.

My booster Loki with T2 Skirmish links, Skirmish Mindlink and 3x ECCM gives me a ratio of 1.09.

I've heard the previous 'unprobable' magic number was 1.08 (initially I couldn't work out why I didn't have 1.08 before realising that I don't have Defensive Subsystem lvl 5, thought I did). Am I for all intents and purposes 'unprobable' for all but highly skilled Covops pilots, or is it still relatively easy to get a location until someone reaches the magic number?

Thanks.

The way I understand is that it caps at 1.08, so a ship with 1.09 is just as hard to scan down as a ship with 1.5 both will effectively be 1.08.
VanDam
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-07-03 08:08:50 UTC
Sjugar wrote:
VanDam wrote:
I'd also be interested in an answer to the inverse senario if possible.

My booster Loki with T2 Skirmish links, Skirmish Mindlink and 3x ECCM gives me a ratio of 1.09.

I've heard the previous 'unprobable' magic number was 1.08 (initially I couldn't work out why I didn't have 1.08 before realising that I don't have Defensive Subsystem lvl 5, thought I did). Am I for all intents and purposes 'unprobable' for all but highly skilled Covops pilots, or is it still relatively easy to get a location until someone reaches the magic number?

Thanks.

The way I understand is that it caps at 1.08, so a ship with 1.09 is just as hard to scan down as a ship with 1.5 both will effectively be 1.08.


Given the label 'target size' and the way the ratio works I was under the impression that the smaller the number the better. Could be wrong though?
Vlodovich
Baba Yagas
The Initiative.
#13 - 2012-07-03 15:44:43 UTC
I think Ive maxed out my scan strength of my probes every way I can and doing a 'Show Info' on them just now shows strength of 198.4

Not sure what you would use that number to calculate but there it is lol
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#14 - 2012-07-03 16:48:45 UTC
Vlodovich wrote:
I think Ive maxed out my scan strength of my probes every way I can and doing a 'Show Info' on them just now shows strength of 198.4

Not sure what you would use that number to calculate but there it is lol


That's really cool dude lol

Scanning unprobable ships with that much strength must be a walk in the park!

Lol

.
Sjugar
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-07-03 16:56:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Sjugar
Vlodovich wrote:
I think Ive maxed out my scan strength of my probes every way I can and doing a 'Show Info' on them just now shows strength of 198.4

Not sure what you would use that number to calculate but there it is lol
Ofcourse with maxed strength you will succeed. I'm looking for the minimum strength needed.
VanDam wrote:
Given the label 'target size' and the way the ratio works I was under the impression that the smaller the number the better. Could be wrong though?
It's sensor strength/sig radius. So the higher your sensor strength compared to your sig radius the better. So a higher number would mean harder to scan down. (at least until you reach 1.08)
Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#16 - 2012-07-03 16:58:15 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:

You can definitely do it with a full virtue set and you definitely can't do it without a virtue set, even with maxed skills. (ive tried both.)
Ive never tried with a partial set but I have heard from others that i reasonably trust the you can do it with the first 4 virtues and a 10% prospector implant.


AFAIK tho I've not looked at it in awhile you can do it in a helios either without rigs and with a virtue set OR with rigs and no implants if all your other skills are maxed - you definitely need the implants for any ship that doesn't have the helio's bonuses tho.
Pink Marshmellow
Caucasian Culture Club
#17 - 2012-07-03 17:18:34 UTC
I've tested this out before with a 3x ECCM dissolution sequencer tengu with a >1.08 sensor str/sig radius.

A typical prober (level 4 scan related skills, sisters probe and launcher, dual gravity cap, cov ops) will only get a 42% lockdown on the tengu.

A max skilled prober(sisters probe and launcher, dual gravity cap, cov ops) with a 10% prospector implant will get a 70-80% lockdown on it.

In order to scan down the formerly "unprobable" setups it requires a low-grade virtue set which will cost you 1.5-2.1 billion. The number of virtue pilots are very rare.

Even with virtues it will still take a bit of a time to scan you down to a 100%, by that time if you are watching dscan, you'll notice them close to you and have time to warp away.

Your typical ganker will probably not have max scanning skills, let alone the low grade virtue sets.