EVE General Discussion

The question remains, what would you think is a fair risk/reward ratio for highsec specifically. Especially in comparison to the other sec areas?

Do you find highsec rewards balanced enough and if so, why? And if they are all balanced, why do you think people still remain in highsec? Are the risks too high or the rewards too low (same thing really)?

I'm mostly interested in discussing why one may believe highsec needs a nerf/buff/remain the same. Since the population is clearly skewed to highsec, can this skew remain while at the same time having "too much" rewards outside of highsec?

8 or so years ago eve was considered a mining simulator with a side element of pvp..

pvp'ers cried on the forums left and right, us miners and indies let it pass..

what you have now is the result..

you cant do the math on why or how much, when the people who are considered carebears are the ones complaining about mechanics of a game instead of enjoying it

i was there, like alot of mining pilots are here right now.. when the most fun you could find from this game was reading these forums, back before the asshats invaded

I'd have to make a guess - a person PVEing Highsec should only have a need to fund subcapital ships, so I'd factor in the cost of a reasonably fitted Battleship over a reasonable time, say a week of 9 hours. Adding to that a constant supply of skillbooks.

But I need to tackle the nucleus of your question from another point of view: I'm not convinced that the risk/reward-ratio alone controls how many people are dwelling in or outside Highsec. I think you need to factor in at least two large groups: a. Those who want to play the game by themselves without having to rely on others (basically single player Elite-style). The only place you can reasonably do that is Highsec. You could say these players aren't emerging themselves into the prime selling point of EVE, but they are there nonetheless. b. Those (alts) who are just using Highsec as a base for trade, research and production (anyone who ever tried to get a free research slot in Highsec will know the population density of that crowd).

Whatever happens to the ISK/hour-ratio of Highsec, these groups will largely remain there.

Save yourselt the time and just biomass all alts and cancle your account.

the player driven market in this game is unique in that virtualy nothing goes obsolete, its always usefull to create (Either through production or LP farming or exploration or even rat drops) everything this side of the newbi frigate.

thats because EVERYTHING OF "REAL" VALUE IS DESTROYABLE.

Most other games, everything of "value" is basicaly immortal. just for one example,l the bigest joke of Starwars the old republic is that ship combat you cant lose your ship ever no how often you get blown up. Seriously you can ram your ship into other ships causeing a masive fireball and a few seconds later your in a new shiny ship riding the same bloody rollercoaster seeing what else you can ram into.

In thoes economys they constantly have to shove out new more powerfull items every few months just to keep the "Crafteing" people interested in the game. and when they dont do so fast enough people get bored, they have what they have for months if not years on end, and In fact some of thoes games have started making more and more "junk consumables" "toys" and "pets" just to deal with that very issue (WoW for just one example is bragging about how its next expansion you will have to grind through endgame cooking repetedly,(something like 5 additional times) for a stat boost so trivial that some endgame raiders dont even bother with it or potions(the "other" consumable)

and because everything can and will sooner or later explode then that player driven market is driven by players blowing ships up or being blown the ship up. Otherwise most of the mineral demand would quickly revert to supplying missles and ammo, and most actual shiping needs would be covered by teir 1 industrials and cargo riged Frigates.

Last statistics check. It was like what, less than 15% in null, and another ~15% spread between low and w-space. I was surprised by those stats too, perhaps 70% would be more accurate.

I don't think you understand what a sandbox is.

Any investment in time or assets can be at risk. Ships are a classic example of an invested asset.



But then you have the 400 mil T2-fitted battleship level 4 runner and the 35 bil officer-fit level 4 runner. Both gain isk at relatively similar speed, the officer fit maybe making 25 more mil per hour? Do you balance income according do the standard T2 fit or the faction/officer fit?
Same thing when playing smart versus taking unnecessary risks. Should the game balance towards those who are able to minimize their risk by using the tools available or towards those who can't be bothered to use them.



The discussion got much better afterwards but to answer what I think a nullsec resident would say:

1. Same as my answer for highsec. However, no actual amount of isk investment can make me "less at risk" outside of highsec if I play dumb.

2. Profit should be proportional to the amount of risk, which can usually be calculated with my net profit.
Example: let's assume I make 1 bil in one month but I lost 400 mil in PVE/PVP. My net profit is 600 mil. Now I move to another region of EVE and make 800 mil in a month but only lose 20 mil. My net profit is 720 mil. Given these numbers and assuming the general playtime/playstyle is the same, the second region clearly has a better risk/reward ratio even though the first region has a greater potential
This is why the argument "there is too much risk outside of highsec" can't be coupled with "highsec income is balanced with respect to the other areas" as they are fundamentally paradoxal.

You got the numbers wrong, but more importantly, you got the analysis wrong. That was a server snapshot of Active Characters and where they were at that moment.

I live in Null, but I have more Characters in HS LS than I have in Null, because Cynos, Freighters, etc are useful. That survey counted me as 2 Null, 2 LS, and 5 HS.

Sounds more like all you did was mine & paid no attention to what anyone else was doing. I haven't found a single credible source that says EVE was a mining simulator at any point.