EVE General Discussion

And it is that attitude that I described in my earlier post. It is not sustainable, and not productive in the long term, as we are starting to see now. The idea here is to put aside the self entitled "I pay so I'm right" attitude and start to work together for the betterment of all, not to throw faecal matter at people, chest beat and declare ourselves superior.

Nobody here on a war path? Wrong, there are indeed players on a war path here and if needed, I can look through 'Eve Search' and link their names and statements showing them calling for blood.

Trying to get this matter fixed to everyone's liking? Sorry but that's not what Moderation is all about. There is no way it's going to be set up to please everybody and if it is, then it isn't moderation anymore.

Better communication and death to one-liners? The offending posted reply was lucky to get a one-liner explanation. Moderators do not have to nor are they expected to write anything, especially not a big ole statement or apology explaining their actions.

The best way to look at it is like this. Moderators are the school teachers, the forums are the classrooms and we are the students. For too long the teachers have been out of the classrooms allowing us students to run a muck in the classrooms.


Wrong, I understand the English language perfectly since it's my only language. As I said before, that 'gotta go pee' one-liner statement definitely looks off-topic, like a fail attempt to derail the thread with some twisted form of humor, especially if a moderator is quickly trying to clean up the thread. I would have just removed it altogether and not even bothered with an explanation, at least the moderator took the time to post a reason.

Seems you're intentionally posting statements here in an attempt to gain sympathy and justify players being able to post whatever, whenever, wherever.


You know, I can also state that I'm a moderator in another forum or say I have a job with customer service and bla bla bla, etc. Doesn't make one iota of difference. It's a statement that can not be proved or disproved and as such, becomes irrelevant to the conversation.

As for CCP reinforcing the idea that it's fine and justified to incite rage and encourage players to quit, sorry but that is false. CCP has not done that, certain specific players have propagated that mentality over the past couple of years. They constantly instigate and incite others to follow them by feeding upon rage. I can easily link their names and statements if needed. I think the problem was CCP allowing them to do it in the first place. Now it's become common practice which any vocal group will use to force a change for their benefit, basically holding everyone hostage in the process.


People keep forgetting the bottom line :

We pay a subscription to play the game, that's it. Posting in the forums is not a requirement to play this game. Nowhere does it say in the subscription terms that players are entitled to post in the forums. Being allowed to post in these forums is a privilege that is extended by the company for us players to use, provided we follow some simple clearly defined rules.

Nowhere does it say in the forum rules that we have to be all 'cuddly-wuddly' like some players are trying to imply. However, it does state that players are expected to post with respect and be courteous when disagreeing with others. It is possible to disagree without being insulting.

Players who keep saying that this game is evil, harsh and cruel (one side of the coin) and that the forums should reflect that are basically looking to use that as an excuse to verbally assault other players, plain and simple..

Won't bother arguing with most of your post, difference of opinions and all that. Just one thing...

The problem with this is that those "teachers" are still just students. They are no different than the student who gets to help the teacher hand out classwork. In the end those students have no real power (and if anything happened related to their helping, the teacher would be the one in trouble, not the students).

This is the problem, having people who are at the same level, but at the same time treating them as if they are not.

This is the problem with the volunteer program that so many have.

Well they were talking about the forums, not the players of the game that happen to make up the silent majority.

DMC, I haven't attacked anyone. My post is not condescending and I make no apologies for what I wrote. (I thought I was polite.) Cutter uses the words "incorrect" and "wrong" all the time. I've been laughing about it for over a week. So I must unfortunately reject your accusations and as I do not write about things I know nothing about, I stand behind my words.

You may think I should post with an older character, a different character or maybe even while wearing a mohawk. I couldn't care less. That's your problem. I'm sure you'll probably think that statement was also condescending and vicious. It's still your problem either way.

As I have pointedly stated on many occasions, the value of an opinion is in the opinion - not the person writing it.

YK

OK, you want to get technical, fine. The CCL are actually Substitute Teachers standing in for the actual Teachers who can't be in the Classroom for whatever reason. Doesn't matter anyway since they are still in fact a Teacher. Since you want to nit pic my analogy, let's expand on it.

The Forum Rules define conduct in School.
These Forums are the School.
Each sub-forum is a separate Classroom.
Regular forum posters are the Students.
CCL are the Teachers.
CCP is the Principle.
Internal Affairs is the School Board.

Students who disrupt the Classroom and do not abide by the Rules of Conduct for the School are reprimanded by the Teacher. If those Students continue, they are sent to the Principle, usually resulting in being expelled from the Classroom for a short time. If those Students are again sent to the Principle, a longer expulsion is applied and if continued, eventually end up being kicked out of the School. Students can appeal that action with a review conducted by the School Board, plain and simple.

The problem is that players have been allowed to abuse and blatantly disregard the Forum Rules for way too long. Now that those Rules are being enforced, they feel they are entitled to dictate how those Rules should be interpreted and demand that moderation be subject to their review, hopefully allowing them to continue posting like they have in the past.






Nope, only when it's evident. The remarks I was referring to are :

I don't remember students volunteering and becoming Teachers in school. Maybe I went to a weird school, but I seem to remember that the volunteer positions available were something like Hall Monitor. And I have a distinct impression of the type of kids who signed up for that.

Stop trying to twist my statement around in an attempt to discredit it. I said 'Borderline'.

My actual statement :
If you need specifics, the first part of his statement is sarcastic which is personally directed towards Cutter. The first and second part is condescending..much like his replies directed towards me.

sarcastic
Adjective:
1 - Marked by or given to using irony in order to mock or convey contempt.

irony
Noun:
1 - The use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning.

condescending
Adjective:
1 - Acting in a way that betrays a feeling of patronizing superiority.
2 - (of an action) Demonstrating such an attitude.

patronizing
Verb:
1 - Treat with an apparent kindness that betrays a feeling of superiority.



You know what, it's an analogy but now that you bring it up, those students helping the Teachers in class or being 'Hall Monitors' can be compared to us regular forum posters who use the 'Report' option.

Hall monitors are students who volunteer, get training, and wear a uniform and get certain powers over their fellow students.

That sounds a lot like the ISD. They're volunteers.

Teachers tend to get much more intensive training, have larger responsibilities and get paid.

Forums software making your post very difficult to respond to. Grrr. May have to resort to breaking my response up.



You seriously think I have blood-lust in my eyes? You should reread my posts my friend.

Its true that I am getting frustrated that there has been no substantive talk of change in this thread, that perhaps I misunderstood, but thought it was opened to do just that.



Actually I phrased that very carefully to avoid calling for a scape goat. Reread it.

You seem to be proposing a workplace where no one can ever get fired, we all know that would not create a successful company. I am detecting tribalism, us vs them, in the CCL. I think that's a problem. Am I calling for someone to get "fired" from their volunteer job right now? No. Just put it out there that it is possible. And its up to CCL to decide when someone is not a good fit. (While taking community responses into account of course.)