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Remove local
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Squat King
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-06-29 13:42:27 UTC
its 2012 and we still have local? wtf is wrong with you!! just remove it.
Tchulen
Trumpets and Bookmarks
#2 - 2012-06-29 14:14:23 UTC
As has been stated in many threads already, there are reasons why they would need to have better methods of intel gathering than they do now to successfully remove local without pissing lots of people off.

You've seen the threads where people complain about cloakies in their system (most inaccurately complain about AFK cloakies but what they're really complaining about is that there is a cloakie in system so they can't do things).

So if they remove local but don't add another method of intel gathering that is effectively the same or similar all nullsec bears will whine, not to mention others.

If you want local removed, how about coming up with an alternative intel system rather than just ranting about removing local?
Squat King
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-06-29 16:37:30 UTC
"So if they remove local but don't add another method of intel gathering that is effectively the same or similar all nullsec bears will whine, not to mention others."


you already have methods of Intel, you have cov-ops with probes, and the directional scanner, this alone should be good enough to gathering intel about hostile ships.
you all-so have several good tracking fetures in map as well as locator agents.

instead of having a passive feature like local that does all the job for you,

so in a sense local ruins all the active aspects on methods of Intel gathering,

thats why it just need to be removed.
theres nothing to add.

I do believe CCP has stated that they want a more active game, and those removing local is logical.
Temmu Guerra
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2012-06-29 20:16:00 UTC
You saying dscan is useful oh how that makes me chuckle.

Dscan does not make it so you can replace local. Also do you expect a person to be on the gate 24/7 to know if you have reds in system? What happens if a cloak ship warps in on a mining fleet and cyno's in a bunch of ships. Dscan and probes aint gonna help you with that.

If you have a more valid idea I am all ears but until then gtfo...
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#5 - 2012-06-29 20:31:40 UTC
I threw an idea out to offer a solution to replace local intel.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=112964&find=unread

This involves realistic effort from players to get intel, not the intel welfare system we now have spoon-feeding us half useless garbage.

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Barbara Nichole
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2012-06-29 21:55:47 UTC
Squat King wrote:
its 2012 and we still have local? wtf is wrong with you!! just remove it.


I believe it does have a place in high sec.. but I agree with it's removal in null sec.. and partal removal from low sec.

  - remove the cloaked from local; free intel is the real problem, not  "afk" cloaking -

[IMG]http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a208/DawnFrostbringer/consultsig.jpg[/IMG]
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#7 - 2012-06-29 22:04:43 UTC
Barbara Nichole wrote:
Squat King wrote:
its 2012 and we still have local? wtf is wrong with you!! just remove it.


I believe it does have a place in high sec.. but I agree with it's removal in null sec.. and partal removal from low sec.

Maybe it does fit the high sec model, I can give you that aspect has logic.

But in low and null sec? Players are supposed to make more effort in these areas, not trust blindly in something meant to act as a social guide for who is available to chatter with in your system.

And then cry about how they don't say anything, and must be AFK. If you can't find em, then they are cloaking too!
The logic is so twisted behind this reasoning...

Upgrading Local to Eliminate All AFK Influence What if Local Chat changed, Hunting the Cloaked...
Squat King
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-07-01 14:35:02 UTC
You know you're right, it does make sense having local in high sec due to the concord scanning all pilots in the different systems,

but where the Empires have no control, 0.3 and lower it don't make sense, they should at-lest make all locals in 0.3 systems and bellow like the wormhole locals,


The sooner its removed the better
Temai
The Scope
#9 - 2012-07-01 15:15:04 UTC
my thoughtts are local should work as is in 1.0 down to 0.5 then in 0.5 - 0.3 it should have a much longer delay (like 5 -10 mins till it shows up) then in 0.3 to 0.1 add more to it makeing it take much longer so and then in 0.0 local should work like WH's unless you talk you dont show up

but thats my thought on it
  • Lost in Space looking for a Home dreaming of building outpost's acrross EVE -
Aoyagi Haineko
Genuinely Exquisite Entities Society
#10 - 2012-07-01 15:58:26 UTC
Yes, that would make nullsec solo explorers' lives so easy, right? And short. Being on site shooting rats and pinning other sites is already pretty busy without needing to keep an eye on dscan (which doesn't really help that much) and/or having a set of combat/deep space probes out along with core probes. Or mission runners, oh how happy would they be...
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-07-01 16:08:55 UTC
Squat King wrote:
its 2012 and we still have local? wtf is wrong with you!! just remove it.

Maybe CCP don't think it should be removed? :iiam:

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#12 - 2012-07-01 18:00:31 UTC
Aoyagi Haineko wrote:
Yes, that would make nullsec solo explorers' lives so easy, right? And short. Being on site shooting rats and pinning other sites is already pretty busy without needing to keep an eye on dscan (which doesn't really help that much) and/or having a set of combat/deep space probes out along with core probes. Or mission runners, oh how happy would they be...

Sorry but, what? I do exploration in low sec, in some of the busiest areas of the game, and can quite happily run and finish sites with 30+ other people in local.

Use directional, drop it down to <1AU. If someone shows up, warp off. As for mission runners, combat probes?

Whilst I do agree the issue isn't as clear cut as "just remove local", it is more or less a non-issue for mission runners and explorers. The issues with just removing local would come in the form of hot drop mechanics, people running anomalies, gate camps etc.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Aoyagi Haineko
Genuinely Exquisite Entities Society
#13 - 2012-07-01 18:43:07 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:
Sorry but, what? I do exploration in low sec, in some of the busiest areas of the game, and can quite happily run and finish sites with 30+ other people in local.

Use directional, drop it down to <1AU. If someone shows up, warp off. As for mission runners, combat probes?

Whilst I do agree the issue isn't as clear cut as "just remove local", it is more or less a non-issue for mission runners and explorers. The issues with just removing local would come in the form of hot drop mechanics, people running anomalies, gate camps etc.

How exactly does d-scan help with the incoming ship is cloaked? And how does it help unless I spam the "scan" button nearly constantly?
For mission runners, expanded probe launcher is pretty CPU demanding.

And did you just compare lowsec to nullsec?
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#14 - 2012-07-01 18:52:10 UTC
Aoyagi Haineko wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:
Sorry but, what? I do exploration in low sec, in some of the busiest areas of the game, and can quite happily run and finish sites with 30+ other people in local.

Use directional, drop it down to <1AU. If someone shows up, warp off. As for mission runners, combat probes?

Whilst I do agree the issue isn't as clear cut as "just remove local", it is more or less a non-issue for mission runners and explorers. The issues with just removing local would come in the form of hot drop mechanics, people running anomalies, gate camps etc.

How exactly does d-scan help with the incoming ship is cloaked? And how does it help unless I spam the "scan" button nearly constantly?
For mission runners, expanded probe launcher is pretty CPU demanding.

And did you just compare lowsec to nullsec?

Low sec is pretty similar to null sec for exploration and mission running, the only difference being that you shouldn't warp straight to station if local spikes, just in case they sent a bubbler there. Plus unless you use a T3 for scanning you might occasionally lose a cov ops scout every now and then.

But anyway, why on Earth would you fit an expanded probe launcher on your missioning ship? You don't need to launch combat probes yourself, just watch out for someone else launching them.

And d-scan helps because if the ship is cloaked, who cares about it? When it de-cloaks, you have a little over 6 seconds to warp off, or if it's a bomber you can just pop it. And that's assuming you didn't see it with the scout you should have had on the site entrance, or picked it up on directional when it de-cloaked to warp through the gates behind you.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Aoyagi Haineko
Genuinely Exquisite Entities Society
#15 - 2012-07-01 19:28:52 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:

Low sec is pretty similar to null sec for exploration and mission running, the only difference being that you shouldn't warp straight to station if local spikes, just in case they sent a bubbler there. Plus unless you use a T3 for scanning you might occasionally lose a cov ops scout every now and then.

But anyway, why on Earth would you fit an expanded probe launcher on your missioning ship? You don't need to launch combat probes yourself, just watch out for someone else launching them.

And d-scan helps because if the ship is cloaked, who cares about it? When it de-cloaks, you have a little over 6 seconds to warp off, or if it's a bomber you can just pop it. And that's assuming you didn't see it with the scout you should have had on the site entrance, or picked it up on directional when it de-cloaked to warp through the gates behind you.

The bubbles are not what I meant. What I meant is that people in nullsec favor the approach "This is hour space, we have sovereignty here, you are not blue, we hunt you down".

Why would I fit expanded probe launcher? It was you who suggested, or at least that's how that sounded. But yes, using directional scan to spot combat probes is possibly a valid tactic - for mission runners anyway. Although I did manage to pin a capsule with deep space probes, so guess it is not impossible to pin a battleship out of the dscan range. But that's just a speculation.

If the ship is cloaked, it can wait till I'm flying in the direction off to nowhere or when a rat scrambles me. Even if I did manage to instantly notice (between checking d-scan, probing, killing rats and trying to stay alive) an uncloaked ship and instantly started warping, which is extremely unlikely and possibly physically impossible, the cloaked ship (be it cov. ops, bomber or force recon) would have more than enough time to target me and wait for its buddies to arrive.
Site entrance is at the same time all of the site (that applies to those I do). And again - solo. Additionally, it is possible to use acceleration gates without being decloaked.
Covert Kitty
SRS Industries
#16 - 2012-07-02 04:01:23 UTC
It doesn't really belong in HS either, wormholes, war, and entry systems all are affected by intel-wellfare as well
Nyx Vega
Lisim Alt Alt Corp
#17 - 2012-07-02 10:06:37 UTC
Squat King-its 2012 and we still have local? wtf is wrong with you!! just remove it.


ok..firstly....ur miners..if u have any..in ur corp/allience will hate u for it...secondly..if your such an awsome player...go to the local chat box..and close it....easy done , or just drag your chat box past the adge of your screen , but eventually you will use it , for looking to see who's in local and to open private chats..and when you do , you will know you were wrong!!..i agree that low/null sec should have a delayed time...as in 5 mins or so...just like wormholes..
Kadeyoo
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2012-07-02 10:33:41 UTC
It's 2012, and people still re-create topics that have been discussed so many times.

Deal with it.

If you don't like local, go into a wormhole. If that's too dangerous for you, stop being a hypocrite.
Squat King
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2012-07-02 14:38:30 UTC
The main issue is that Local makes the players using it passive.
they wont use the Active Tools in the game.
This makes the game into Easy mode, without pushing the space pilots to their potential, it makes space a safe haven, where you can just warp off and log off to be safe, its God mode, and it makes EvE allot more boring and dull than it has to be.
ninjaholic
Tactical Feed.
Pandemic Horde
#20 - 2012-07-02 17:32:07 UTC
Why not NOT remove local, and instead, remove idle players from local? The moment they move in space, they reappear in local. You simply won't know if you're flying in to a gate camp unless you're savvy. But they won't catch small ships anyway because of the gimped lock times. Unless you fly in to a tackler in which case you deserve it. AFK cloakers can still gather intel, since you won't know they're there for certain. It's true espionage. True stealth. If they move, miners see him appear in local and can prepare themselves, adding a sense of security, and lessening the fear of afk cloakers. And if they align and keep moving to prevent idle in local, you know they're doing it to disrupt the system. Whaddya think?

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