EVE General Discussion

Not only did he make a comparison to child abuse right after invoking the goons by name, he made a direct connection to goons by saying "if that child is a goon". So yeah, he directly compared CCP punishing goons for exploiting to child abuse. I concede that may not actually be a strawman, but it's certainly a false and misleading comparison.



Clearly.

I think he just meant Goons are innocent. I wouldn't say they are innocent as children, but they really didn't commited any crimes regarding EULA/TOS. Anyway, read my last post, it most probably isn't punishment hence none of this makes any sense.

You spell it like CCP having finally turned into a serious company is bad.

No, it's excellent news!

Now, if only they could also reverse PI and Pax amarria and POS dupe exploits, then it'd be golden, but I doubt they have backlogs dating so far back.

An exploit is not an illegal exploit untill it's discovered. Once CCP discovered a flaw in its mechanic. Then and only then can a statement be released on whether or not a said action; in this case a "exploit" is illegal. Remember. exploitation is inherit. Examples of this; scamming, diplomacy, espionage. Gaining whealth @ the expense of others. Which covers anything of value that's transfered from one entity to another (trading, barter or trade).

So, technically the Goons broke no rules. Mainly, because they weren't written. In the real world. Drugs like Ecstasy was legal for the longest time because it was new and not widely distributed. Few law makers had any idea of the drugs effects or side effects. Once they did. A move was made to make it illegal. There by "safe guarding the public good". Those who made money off Ecstasy before the laws where made. Were not arrested and there was no claw backs.

CCP shouldn't take away any funds made. They should return it all if they took any away and move on. Only players acting in the same fashion after the rules are made are subject to claw backs and punishments.

The profit they made was gamebreaking so I think CCP is right in removing the assets gained from the abuse. Now if they removed more than that I don't know but I wouldn't consider it a punishment due the situation. It's a lot of mess to fix so it's an understandable mistake.

EDIT: so many edits

I imagine that CCP has had its Member insulted one too many times. But instead of new rules, why not just follow up one of those emails about Member enlargement. The best way to not have your Member insulted is to have a significant one.

Just because CCP had not officially stated that the vulnerability was an exploit, it does not mean it wasn't an exploit.

If I discovered a new way to hack into your personal computer that nobody else knew about, therefore it was not documented, and I proceeded to hack into your computer using this vulnerability - would that be OK with you? Since nobody has said that i can't do it - your firewalls, security measures and operating system are working as intended. SO you should be fine with me poking my nose around in your PC? - no, it is exploiting a vulnerability to do something illegal, whether it is documented or not.

Your arguments hold no weight. It was abuse of a vulnerability in the game mechanics, which IS by definition called an exploit.
The OP of the 4x4 thread stated it was an exploit himself.
CCP's own rules state that anybody knowingly abusing an exploit can be punished.

So, previous exploits like the PI, PA, and Insurance payouts, and all these others you keep mentioning obviously were not punished hard enough, since people still think they can get away with abusing exploits - to the point where they gloat about it on the forums, rub the game designers face in it, and make a mockery of the game itself and those who play it.

Its time CCP HTFU and make an example of these arrogant cheaters with extreme punishment that clearly says - "if you break the rules, you gonna pay for it". This might actually deter future attacks on the game, instead of the lame slap on the wrist, oh you naughty pod pilot stuff we have seen in the past. The guys who did this are not idiots, they know what they did was wrong.

This will in no way "break the sandbox". Even the sandbox needs rules to maintain the integrity of sandbox style play.

Initially i was of the opinion that just taking the profits away would be enough of a punishment - i now believe bans are in order for those involved.

CCP - you need to send a clear message to overt future abuse of your product, otherwise people will continue to ruin your game.

Faction war was screwed over.
CCP also had to manually reset the price of certain items. Not broken?

OMG they are here.
Beware.
Next winter Batman is coming to EVE.
[/quote]

Winter is coming :)

a lot of senseless hatered in posts on the eve forums in general these days.