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Goons 4x4ing through the Sandbox - Market Manipulation on a Grand Scale

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Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#3101 - 2012-06-24 13:26:03 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Andrea Roche wrote:

gush.
ok let me put it simple...
Every time you make a change to the system, you have to do some sort of desing. The design could be small or a broad design depending on the change required. Sometimes it required a complete new redesign of a system.
Would you agree that you cannot have good design and have bugs since the design has to be implemented every time you make a change to the code? If yes, then all of the above posted by you is incorrect.
If no then "you" obviously dont do design everytime you implemente code, so its viable to bugs/features/run time errors etc.
PS: by "you" i did not target you but this is a generalisation. Dont take it personal

Heh, nice try. Lord Tim is either trolling, or he doesn't have the capacity to understand the issue and what's happened. Basically, ignore him.

This sounds more like a "I can't counter the insurance fraud, PI and PA cases where game mechanics were used in exactly the same fashion, so I'm going to ignore those points until he give up. Failing that, I'm going to make an ad hominem attack and hope he gives up." post than a victory post, to me.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#3102 - 2012-06-24 13:27:03 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:

This sounds more like a "I can't counter the insurance fraud, PI and PA cases where game mechanics were used in exactly the same fashion, so I'm going to ignore those points until he give up. Failing that, I'm going to make an ad hominem attack and hope he gives up." post than a victory post, to me.

And FAIL!

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey
Enaris Kerle
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3103 - 2012-06-24 13:27:13 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:
The owners disagree. Theyre really all who matter

oh good, we're at the point where you are out of arguments, you could just have said so

Gallente born and raised, and tutored as a pleasure slave and courtesan to the exotic tastes of the Amarri court. Jade's career veered violently off course when a diplomatic envoy's transport was blown to pieces in mysterious circumstances and she was rescued from the escape pods by the enigmatic genetic mastermind Athule Snanm.
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#3104 - 2012-06-24 13:27:50 UTC
Darth Gustav wrote:


This was no exploit.


The owners disagree. Theyre really all who matter

Also; wheres the advertising showing this mechanic? Cause supposedly the Goons were extremely smart to have come up with this... If its advertised, then theyre not as creative as ppl think lol

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#3105 - 2012-06-24 13:27:52 UTC
Frying Doom wrote:
captain foivos wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:

So if that is the argument you wish to put forward please show me the Dev blog that states that you can shoot ships you have deliberately filled with goods that the valuer, prices higher than they are to get more LP than you should.


Since when was it a rule you can't blow any of your own things up? Especially for profit, I might add.

Is this where I point to Lord Zim's insurance fraud?

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
captain foivos
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3106 - 2012-06-24 13:28:32 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

This sounds more like a "I can't counter the insurance fraud, PI and PA cases where game mechanics were used in exactly the same fashion, so I'm going to ignore those points until he give up. Failing that, I'm going to make an ad hominem attack and hope he gives up." post than a victory post, to me.

And FAIL!


But on whose part? Not Zim's, that's for sure.
Antisocial Malkavian
Antisocial Malkavians
#3107 - 2012-06-24 13:29:18 UTC
corestwo wrote:


Sorry, I left out the part where the devs of LOTR Online who went "yep, our fault" let the players who discovered the legitimate but unintended interaction keep the money they made from it. Important distinction, really.


This is not LOTR and CCP is not that company. Important distinction, really

And, isn't sanity really just a one-trick pony anyway? I mean all you get is one trick, rational thinking, but when you're good and crazy, oooh, oooh, oooh, the sky is the limit.

Enaris Kerle
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3108 - 2012-06-24 13:29:35 UTC
Antisocial Malkavian wrote:

Also; wheres the advertising showing this mechanic?

here

Gallente born and raised, and tutored as a pleasure slave and courtesan to the exotic tastes of the Amarri court. Jade's career veered violently off course when a diplomatic envoy's transport was blown to pieces in mysterious circumstances and she was rescued from the escape pods by the enigmatic genetic mastermind Athule Snanm.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#3109 - 2012-06-24 13:30:35 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

This sounds more like a "I can't counter the insurance fraud, PI and PA cases where game mechanics were used in exactly the same fashion, so I'm going to ignore those points until he give up. Failing that, I'm going to make an ad hominem attack and hope he gives up." post than a victory post, to me.

And FAIL!


Does have a point. Its not like this is the first time something like this has happened.
Danfen Fenix
#3110 - 2012-06-24 13:31:05 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:

You mean the nothing which happened to any one specific person after insurance fraud, PI, PA and tracking titans were tweaked to try to avoid undesirable behavior?



Ok. So say someone gets away with murder. Could be they have a good laywer, there is little evidence, or it's simply the judges decision.

Are you saying everyone should get away with murder, simply due to that case? People constantly complain that CCP does nothing. Well looky here...they've done something. HTFU.
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#3111 - 2012-06-24 13:31:15 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

An FAIL #2!

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#3112 - 2012-06-24 13:32:01 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

This sounds more like a "I can't counter the insurance fraud, PI and PA cases where game mechanics were used in exactly the same fashion, so I'm going to ignore those points until he give up. Failing that, I'm going to make an ad hominem attack and hope he gives up." post than a victory post, to me.

And FAIL!


Does have a point. Its not like this is the first time something like this has happened.

Past performance is not indicative of future returns?

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey
Mortimer Civeri
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3113 - 2012-06-24 13:32:08 UTC
CCP can't design a system that's robust against manipulation and so they get pissy at the people who manipulated their system. This isn't a case where there was a bug that was exploited; the system worked exactly as CCP intended.

Goons, once again, offer the most entertainment-by-reading of any video game, ever.

"I don't know which is worse, ...that everyone has his price, or that the price is always so low." Calvin
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#3114 - 2012-06-24 13:32:23 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

An FAIL #2!

You know someone's completely lost when they start to abuse the word "fail" in this manner.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#3115 - 2012-06-24 13:33:12 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

An FAIL #2!

You know someone's completely lost when they start to abuse the word "fail" in this manner.

And FAIL #3! It's a knockout folks!
Good day sir!

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey
Enaris Kerle
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#3116 - 2012-06-24 13:34:47 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

An FAIL #2!

You know someone's completely lost when they start to abuse the word "fail" in this manner.

And FAIL #3! It's a knockout folks!
Good day sir!

I don't think you understand how a discussion works.

Gallente born and raised, and tutored as a pleasure slave and courtesan to the exotic tastes of the Amarri court. Jade's career veered violently off course when a diplomatic envoy's transport was blown to pieces in mysterious circumstances and she was rescued from the escape pods by the enigmatic genetic mastermind Athule Snanm.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#3117 - 2012-06-24 13:36:00 UTC
Danfen Fenix wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

You mean the nothing which happened to any one specific person after insurance fraud, PI, PA and tracking titans were tweaked to try to avoid undesirable behavior?



Ok. So say someone gets away with murder. Could be they have a good laywer, there is little evidence, or it's simply the judges decision.

Are you saying everyone should get away with murder, simply due to that case? People constantly complain that CCP does nothing. Well looky here...they've done something. HTFU.

Real life != EVE Online.

And there should be absolutely no lack of "evidence" in these cases. The only difference between this case and insurance fraud, PI, PA and tracking titans have been the aftermath of CCP's butterfinger effect.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Frying Doom
#3118 - 2012-06-24 13:36:19 UTC
Enaris Kerle wrote:
Frying Doom wrote:
captain foivos wrote:
Since when was it a rule you can't blow any of your own things up? Especially for profit, I might add.

Is this where I point to Lord Zim's insurance fraud?

You mean the one where there wasn't a rule that you couldn't do it? The one where CCP just patched it out and didn't do anything further?

Oh do you mean to say that all of the alterations done to the game to prevent people from profiting from destroying there own stuff wasn't an indication that any sane person could follow?

Or that exploiting a bug like the POS exploit with CCP giving permanent bans and destroying POS's wasn't a big enough hint?

The basic fact is they did things that the PI, insurance and all the other alterations showed CCP considered bad, adding to this they exploited a bug like the POS bug to extremes.

So they pretty much went from bad to worse and now members of Goonswarm don't think they should get punishments like the POS fools. Well at-least the decision will answer the conspiracy nuts. There is a clear precedent for this kind of behavior and Lord Zim is showing the way well for how many warning signs these people went through to get to where we are now.

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Danfen Fenix
#3119 - 2012-06-24 13:36:27 UTC
Mortimer Civeri wrote:
CCP can't design a system that's robust against manipulation and so they get pissy at the people who manipulated their system. This isn't a case where there was a bug that was exploited; the system worked exactly as CCP intended.

Goons, once again, offer the most entertainment-by-reading of any video game, ever.


Obviously, judging by their response, this is not how CCP intended the system to work...
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#3120 - 2012-06-24 13:37:16 UTC
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Oisin Sandovar wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:

By all means, do. It seems everyone wants to ignore the fact that happened, along with PI, PA and tracking titans.

An FAIL #2!

You know someone's completely lost when they start to abuse the word "fail" in this manner.

And FAIL #3! It's a knockout folks!
Good day sir!

I, too, can win a discussion by doing nothing other than say "FAIL 1! FAIL 2! FAIL 3! I WIN!".

Pro poster right here, guys. Stellar job.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat