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Goons 4x4ing through the Sandbox - Market Manipulation on a Grand Scale

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Nobani
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#2241 - 2012-06-23 07:31:31 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:


how did I make them look weak?



You, personally, no ideea. Goonswarm in general: exploiting the crap out of a mechanic that would have allowed them to produce near infinite isk, effectively breaking the market (and, in principal, EvE)? Oh yeah, that made them look bad.


Well, ideally CCP would set up some queries to be run every downtime to check for abnormally high (or low) sales volumes of any items, large numbers of ship kills/losses by the same group of pilots, abnormal sudden increases in ISK, LP, items, and the like, which would be connected to a buzzer and giant red flashing light at CCP headquarters. They could then investigate and shut it down before things got out of control.

E.g.: High volumes of Guidance Systems, Pax Amarria, Faction Warfare LP, etc.
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#2242 - 2012-06-23 07:33:40 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
It did according to the first several pages of this thread.


I get it you want to cherry-pick everything that benefits your argument but the fact is that they didn't distribute ISK to anybody because, well, it's their ISK.



Sorry, when someone sits around and brags until suddenly there's consequences, and then all say 'well, that never happened, we have no idea where all this isk came from' reminds me of an old story about some armed robbers who had the money all laid out on the table and were counting it when the cops busted in.

"What money, officers?'
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2243 - 2012-06-23 07:34:35 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Sorry, when someone sits around and brags until suddenly there's consequences, and then all say 'well, that never happened, we have no idea where all this isk came from' reminds me of an old story about some armed robbers who had the money all laid out on the table and were counting it when the cops busted in.

"What money, officers?'


I'm not faced with any consequences, no matter how much you insist on it, because I wasn't involved in this scheme myself in any way. Are you beginning to understand?

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#2244 - 2012-06-23 07:35:22 UTC
Nobani wrote:

Well, ideally CCP would set up some queries to be run every downtime to check for abnormally high (or low) sales volumes of any items, large numbers of ship kills/losses by the same group of pilots, abnormal sudden increases in ISK, LP, items, and the like, which would be connected to a buzzer and giant red flashing light at CCP headquarters. They could then investigate and shut it down before things got out of control.

E.g.: High volumes of Guidance Systems, Pax Amarria, Faction Warfare LP, etc.



Agreed, but that would mean programmers might get taken away from FiS and we all know what a shitstorm that causes.
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
#2245 - 2012-06-23 07:36:44 UTC  |  Edited by: corestwo
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I might point out that this never happened

It did according to the first several pages of this thread, back when dozens of goonswarm members were bragging about it?


It's almost as though goons reflexively troll and make **** up. If you want to take a few otherwise unsubstantiated posts as proof that something happened, though, be my guest.

This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

fofofo
15th Century Portrait
Doomheim
#2246 - 2012-06-23 07:38:25 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
It did according to the first several pages of this thread.


I get it you want to cherry-pick everything that benefits your argument but the fact is that they didn't distribute ISK to anybody because, well, it's their ISK.

cherry pick is a favorite word of yours. variety is the spice of life.

its also a magazine
15th Century Portrait
Doomheim
#2247 - 2012-06-23 07:39:08 UTC
corestwo wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I might point out that this never happened

It did according to the first several pages of this thread, back when dozens of goonswarm members were bragging about it?


It's almost as though goons reflexively troll and make **** up. If you want to take a few otherwise unsubstantiated posts as proof that something happened, though, be my guest.

thats terrible
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
#2248 - 2012-06-23 07:41:06 UTC
15th Century Portrait wrote:
corestwo wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I might point out that this never happened

It did according to the first several pages of this thread, back when dozens of goonswarm members were bragging about it?


It's almost as though goons reflexively troll and make **** up. If you want to take a few otherwise unsubstantiated posts as proof that something happened, though, be my guest.

thats terrible


Didn't you say you were going to bed three or four pages ago?

This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

fofofo
Cygnet Lythanea
World Welfare Works Association
#2249 - 2012-06-23 07:42:06 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:

I'm not faced with any consequences, no matter how much you insist on it, because I wasn't involved in this scheme myself in any way. Are you beginning to understand?


Guilt by association. One goon can make all of you look bad. It's that simple. That guy standing up with his goonswarm tag on proclaiming how he made a much more powerful entity then goons look bad? That makes all of you look bad.

If it was limited to the game, I wouldn't give a ****. But you are also making all the other players look bad as well. Do you know how much **** eve players take in other forums just because of that **** Mittens pulled at fan fest, followed by his ranting bullshit speeches?
15th Century Portrait
Doomheim
#2250 - 2012-06-23 07:42:44 UTC
corestwo wrote:
15th Century Portrait wrote:
corestwo wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I might point out that this never happened

It did according to the first several pages of this thread, back when dozens of goonswarm members were bragging about it?


It's almost as though goons reflexively troll and make **** up. If you want to take a few otherwise unsubstantiated posts as proof that something happened, though, be my guest.

thats terrible


Didn't you say you were going to bed three or four pages ago?

dance puppet dance!
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#2251 - 2012-06-23 07:48:16 UTC
Morning, man this thread is just gonna keep on rollin ......

How many pages you think ?



Tal

Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2252 - 2012-06-23 07:50:11 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Morning, man this thread is just gonna keep on rollin ......

How many pages you think ?



Tal


Morning Tal. No clue, m running out of popcorn.

Sugar Von MurdererTits : Jake Warbird gets my vote for most intriguing and attractive male character in Eve.
Richard Desturned
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2253 - 2012-06-23 07:53:57 UTC
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I'm not faced with any consequences, no matter how much you insist on it, because I wasn't involved in this scheme myself in any way. Are you beginning to understand?


Guilt by association. One goon can make all of you look bad. It's that simple. That guy standing up with his goonswarm tag on proclaiming how he made a much more powerful entity then goons look bad? That makes all of you look bad.

If it was limited to the game, I wouldn't give a ****. But you are also making all the other players look bad as well. Do you know how much **** eve players take in other forums just because of that **** Mittens pulled at fan fest, followed by his ranting bullshit speeches?


Heh cool CCP should follow a "guilt by association" policy, that'll end well for them, punitive actions against entire alliances for the actions of a few members

npc alts have no opinions worth consideration
Xython
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2254 - 2012-06-23 08:12:16 UTC
Richard Desturned wrote:
Cygnet Lythanea wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:

I'm not faced with any consequences, no matter how much you insist on it, because I wasn't involved in this scheme myself in any way. Are you beginning to understand?


Guilt by association. One goon can make all of you look bad. It's that simple. That guy standing up with his goonswarm tag on proclaiming how he made a much more powerful entity then goons look bad? That makes all of you look bad.

If it was limited to the game, I wouldn't give a ****. But you are also making all the other players look bad as well. Do you know how much **** eve players take in other forums just because of that **** Mittens pulled at fan fest, followed by his ranting bullshit speeches?


Heh cool CCP should follow a "guilt by association" policy, that'll end well for them, punitive actions against entire alliances for the actions of a few members


Ooh, I like this idea, I'll get an alt into World Welfare Works Association real quick and get the entire alliance banned for I dunno, posting rumors or something.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2255 - 2012-06-23 08:15:08 UTC
Xython wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Heh cool CCP should follow a "guilt by association" policy, that'll end well for them, punitive actions against entire alliances for the actions of a few members

Ooh, I like this idea, I'll get an alt into World Welfare Works Association real quick and get the entire alliance banned for I dunno, posting rumors or something.

Such a great opportunity to awox on a META scale !

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Leon Lichtenstein
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2256 - 2012-06-23 08:34:37 UTC
It feels not right.
Most people are hard working for their ISK and some of them cant get enough to buy PLESK for the next Month. We have now a small group of people that can play EVE for free, like forever. LP Store was fail by design but using this as perpetuum mobiles to generate items - in a massiv amount - was a deliberate use of a BUG
Maybe you will say its not a bug, but only a bug need a hotfix.
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2257 - 2012-06-23 08:35:58 UTC
Has anyone actually had their mind changed on their opinion about this? I mean from the 113 pages of debating back and forth. Or has everyone just entrenched in even further than they were before?
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#2258 - 2012-06-23 08:43:51 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Ituhata Saken wrote:
Dearest Market-Interested Space Tycoons,


At downtime today we made an adjustment to the average price of some items in order to curb a situation whereby the average price of an item could be manipulated in order to create a disparity between the value of an item in Isk and its value in Loyalty Point payouts. There will be additional changes in how this system works in the future. We will be monitoring for attempted manipulation of the LP market and will reverse any proceeds deemed to have been obtained through manipulative means. We are watching you. Don’t be That Guy.



By way of explanation we addressed the manipulation issue but haven't yet completed the investigation into the scope of the abuse. Once that happens I'm pretty sure some people are going to be a bit less smug about the money they made that one time when there was a bank error in their favor and then lost again when the bank fixed the glitch.



Serious question Sreegs, is this kind of thing actually cheating ? (ie against the rules) I read their document a couple of nights ago and though sure it really did blow massive holes through the eve game mechanics in order to make a giant profit - was it actually illegal ?




yes. exploit is exploit. ISK may not have been created from thin air, but LP was.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Xython
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2259 - 2012-06-23 08:47:00 UTC
Mars Theran wrote:
yes. exploit is exploit. ISK may not have been created from thin air, but LP was.


No it wasn't. It was created using the Faction Warfare system.
Rakshasa Taisab
Sane Industries Inc.
#2260 - 2012-06-23 08:48:49 UTC
Only thing that would make this more epic is if they get banned for using macros to do all that LP item shopping.

Nyan