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Goons 4x4ing through the Sandbox - Market Manipulation on a Grand Scale

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InternetSpaceship
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1841 - 2012-06-23 00:01:25 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Kinis Deren wrote:
I wonder why CCP aren't heralding yet another "awesome player driven event by Goonswarm!" this time? Will heads roll at CCP over this? That would be a sad turn of events, IMHO.

Did Mittens and co just throw CCP "under the bus" for a bit of post Fanfest/CSM election fiasco payback or is this a deflection strategy over the Inferno 1.1 war dec change drama. /me adjusts tinfoil hat P

How many alts could you create with the profit to influence the outcome of, say, CSM8? Twisted


This was not done by "Goonswarm." This was done by a cabal of extremely rich and extremely knowledgeable Goonswarm members using their own capital. There is a huge distinction here.



Thats funny the 1st 4 pages of this thread was a circle jerk of Goon members congratulating each other on how Goons have done it again,

Now the **** has hit the fan its, "oh nothing to do with the general Goon membership"

When did the huge distinction appear ?

Poor attempt at spin, no use trying to shut the stable door after the horse has bolted.


Goons to CCP "we aren't trying to ruin the game just your game" Lol

Tal




Alright, fine, ban all goons, then.

Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.

If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.  If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you.
InternetSpaceship
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1842 - 2012-06-23 00:04:34 UTC
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Richard Desturned wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
When did the huge distinction appear ?


At the very beginning. Unless everyone else who slow-clapped in this thread is also involved.

Also the **** didn't "hit the fan" when the NPC alts started wagging their fingers at the "general membership."




Nope I saw 4 or 5 pages of Goons jerking off over this, not allot of NPC alts till CCP came in to comment .

Tal




And that makes them complicit? I had nothing to do with this. Mind you, had I known about it, I absolutely would have done it, and if another opportunity like this one pops up and I'm aware of it in enough time to prepare, I'll probably get involved in that too.

Yes, I think this was awesome, and I support the people who did it. Explain why that means every goon in the game should be banned for what this small number of goons did.

Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.

If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.  If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you.
Angelina The Red
Br0therh00d of 0utc4sts
#1843 - 2012-06-23 00:05:57 UTC
Well this was an exploit, but anyone could have seen it coming. If I was CCP, I wouldn't ban anyone, just take most of the ISK (90%) and fix the broken mechanics. Leave them some money, because after all they did do all the work, it just shouldn't have netted them so much ISK. Besides people are going to keep doing this, just in different forms.

Anyways, gratz for being pro at EVE. Any chance that you could use some of that intellectual capital and work ethic to make the real world a better place instead of wrecking a virtual one? Just a thought.
Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
True Reign
#1844 - 2012-06-23 00:06:33 UTC
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1845 - 2012-06-23 00:07:14 UTC
InternetSpaceship wrote:
Yes, I think this was awesome, and I support the people who did it. Explain why that means every goon in the game should be banned for what this small number of goons did.

Because ban all goons.

What, are you some kind of goon alt?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1846 - 2012-06-23 00:09:13 UTC
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


The intention was never to embarrass them. It was content. I don't know why so many are spinning it that way. Burn Jita was content and we inflicted mass suffering upon the market and others. This was much the same, except directly on the markets.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
15th Century Portrait
Doomheim
#1847 - 2012-06-23 00:10:14 UTC
ITT: Goons pick up cash spitting out of a broken ATM while filling the Complaint Box with complaints about ATMs spitting out cash. Goons have their assets seized when bank discovers the error. Goons then complain about the unheeded complaints in the complaint box.

Complaint about the Complaint Box? Delicious.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1848 - 2012-06-23 00:10:28 UTC
Aryth wrote:
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


The intention was never to embarrass them. It was content. I don't know why so many are spinning it that way. Burn Jita was content and we inflicted mass suffering upon the market and others. This was much the same, except directly on the markets.

They want to make it "CCP vs goons" so that CCP can win eve for them. Not like the GD whiners can beat us up otherwise.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
DiscomBoBulate
ONTAP
Goonswarm Federation
#1849 - 2012-06-23 00:12:11 UTC
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


CCP developers make fools of themselves. Then they make bigger fools of themselves by letting their ego's direct their actions. How's the saying go? You can't cure stupid?
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#1850 - 2012-06-23 00:13:38 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Better Than You wrote:
By goons mentality, we all should be dropping to our knees and thanking Osama Bin Laden for tighter security at the airports.


No one from Goldman Sachs went to prison.


Because well dressed thieves run banks. Bad dressed thieves and terrorists run in prison.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
InternetSpaceship
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1851 - 2012-06-23 00:14:08 UTC
Skippermonkey wrote:

We'd be much more convinced of your 'best intentions' if they figoured out the exploit and immediately informed CCP.


They did. This has been mentioned quite a few times, but it doesn't fit the narrative of "Goons want to destroy Eve", so people like you just gloss over it and pretend it doesn't exist. I think you honestly believe if you don't believe it, it ceases to be true.

CCP was warned, quite some time ago, and didn't care. They didn't perceive it to be a problem, and made that quite clear. Their response now is just one borne of embarrassment. They were called out on bad design, ignored it, and got burned on it. If they thought this was such a huge issue, they should have fixed it, or at least not dismissed it as not being a problem. Punishing anyone for using it is massive bullshit, because it was brought to their attention, and they gave no indication that it was unintended at all.

Official Recruiter for GoonSwarm Corporation.

If you paid isk to get into GoonSwarm, you were probably scammed.  If you had the foresight to save the name of your scammer, let me know and I'll do what I can to help you.
Graic Gabtar
The Lemon Party
#1852 - 2012-06-23 00:16:19 UTC
Aryth wrote:
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


The intention was never to embarrass them. It was content. I don't know why so many are spinning it that way. Burn Jita was content and we inflicted mass suffering upon the market and others. This was much the same, except directly on the markets.
So what have CCP done to you so far?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#1853 - 2012-06-23 00:18:08 UTC
InternetSpaceship wrote:
Skippermonkey wrote:

We'd be much more convinced of your 'best intentions' if they figoured out the exploit and immediately informed CCP.


They did. This has been mentioned quite a few times, but it doesn't fit the narrative of "Goons want to destroy Eve", so people like you just gloss over it and pretend it doesn't exist. I think you honestly believe if you don't believe it, it ceases to be true.

CCP was warned, quite some time ago, and didn't care. They didn't perceive it to be a problem, and made that quite clear. Their response now is just one borne of embarrassment. They were called out on bad design, ignored it, and got burned on it. If they thought this was such a huge issue, they should have fixed it, or at least not dismissed it as not being a problem. Punishing anyone for using it is massive bullshit, because it was brought to their attention, and they gave no indication that it was unintended at all.

It was working as intended until ... well, we can see what happened. Then it became unintended.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Lord Ryan
True Xero
#1854 - 2012-06-23 00:18:30 UTC
Geertruida Zelle wrote:
ok, some enterprising Goons did some homework and found a loophole and made some isk.- they didn't break the "law", they found a "legal loophole" and used it to their advantage.

Now its fine that CCP fix the loophole, but random seizure of assets is a step too far.

Shame on you CCP, you have done another poop in your own Sandpit.


^this

Do not assume anything above this line was typed by me. Nerf the Truth, it's inconvenient.
Aryth
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#1855 - 2012-06-23 00:19:17 UTC
Graic Gabtar wrote:
Aryth wrote:
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


The intention was never to embarrass them. It was content. I don't know why so many are spinning it that way. Burn Jita was content and we inflicted mass suffering upon the market and others. This was much the same, except directly on the markets.
So what have CCP done to you so far?


Seized anything remotely LP store relayed. Zeroed out LP stores. Even though some of the assets we had were of the same type. So they seized items not even related to the FW issue. To go further, they didn't even do it in a consistent manner, making it even wierder. I am not sure what the trigger was besides wealth confiscation.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.
Tomytronic
Perkone
Caldari State
#1856 - 2012-06-23 00:19:50 UTC
i feel bad for ccp. it must be terribly hard having goons come up with the interesting content and press for them all the time; no wonder they wanted to restrict it. goons attract more new players to eve and get more column inches than ccp would ever do on its own. goons actively affect the game in ways no other group possibly could and generate more outside interest than any model update or additional module would.

goons are actively more important for the game than ccp and i imagine it must be quite sad to know this if you work for them.
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#1857 - 2012-06-23 00:22:44 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:

They want to make it "CCP vs goons" so that CCP can win eve for them. Not like the GD whiners can beat us up otherwise.

Yes, yes that's it. Roll

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey
Zilero
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1858 - 2012-06-23 00:23:04 UTC
Aryth wrote:
CCP has now gone and nuked a ton of assets on our accounts. Meaning, we are losing wealth we had previous to this. Wow. But the message is clear. If you want to abuse something, you do not report it. As someone who tried to work with CCP, my advice to anyone in the future is. Don't.


Well, you had to be REALLY smug about it all didn't you? Nothing good ever came from being smug, it always has consequences. These are yours.


None ofthe Above
#1859 - 2012-06-23 00:24:19 UTC  |  Edited by: None ofthe Above
Aryth wrote:
Ban Bindy wrote:
When the sandbox collides with making a fool of the developer, guess which side of that will win? Most people don't thank you when you embarrass them publicly. So you reap your just reward. Too bad.


The intention was never to embarrass them. It was content. I don't know why so many are spinning it that way. Burn Jita was content and we inflicted mass suffering upon the market and others. This was much the same, except directly on the markets.


Alavaria Fera wrote:

They want to make it "CCP vs goons" so that CCP can win eve for them. Not like the GD whiners can beat us up otherwise.


You guys take a deep breath, try to step outside yourself. Forget you who you are for a moment and reread the OP and the start of the thread. Then ask yourself who made it CCP vs Goons (or perhaps Goons vs CCP).

“/10000 will not save them” CCP this, CCP that. This wasn't an op against miners or roleplaying pubbies. You were playing against the hosts of the game.

This wasn't burn Jita, this was burn CCP. You poked them in the eye and dared them to poke back.

Well guess what?

Again impressive work, but you raised your spear against the gods in a storm and got hit by lightning. Karma is a biatch.

The only end-game content in EVE Online is the crap that makes you rage quit.
Oisin Sandovar
Don't Die Interstellar Enterprises
#1860 - 2012-06-23 00:24:26 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:

It was working as intended until ... well, we can see what happened. Then it became unintended.

That happens when you play with fire.

"And the only people I fear are those who never have doubts", Billy Joel, Shades of Grey