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Making nullsec vibrant again

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March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#741 - 2012-06-21 09:19:53 UTC  |  Edited by: March rabbit
Mara Rinn wrote:
Xorv wrote:
Why would you want to quote something born of ignorance. It reeks of someone who's mind is stuck in themepark MMOs that have separate zones of gameplay that don't really impact one another. EVE is a Sandbox and everything is connected.


That some people in nullsec feel that nullsec is stagnating is a problem born of the people in nullsec. That has no connection whatsoever to hisec. When your alliance tells you, "stay in these systems or we shoot you ourselves" you know there is something wrong with that community.

when policeman says you: "you can drive your car on this side of the road and can't use another side" there is something wrong in this .....
when instruction for the microwave oven says: "you can't dry your cat inside" there is something wrong in this ....

ohwait Shocked

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#742 - 2012-06-21 09:23:45 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Lady Katherine Devonshire wrote:
Now factor in that the Universal Law of every null-sec alliance is "Not us? KOS"

There's a reason for that. If you don't know why, have a chat with CVA and the providence inhabitants about how much work it is to maintain a NRDS list instead.

If only they could set their default settings to be red color and -10 isntead of grey and 0.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Lady Katherine Devonshire
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#743 - 2012-06-21 09:25:20 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Picture this: Someone hotdropping the miners as part of economic warfare. Using supercaps to flip the station and make money off the firesales.


I agree that stuff like that is not only possible but also likely. But again, who is to blame for it?

If trust is the most valuable commodity in the game, then "not being an a-hole" would be a close second. Sadly, there is only one Cribba.

The sound of the Amarrian heart
Degren
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#744 - 2012-06-21 09:26:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Degren
Lady Katherine Devonshire wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Picture this: Someone hotdropping the miners as part of economic warfare. Using supercaps to flip the station and make money off the firesales.


I agree that stuff like that is not only possible but also likely. But again, who is to blame for it?

If trust is the most valuable commodity in the game, then "not being an a-hole" would be a close second. Sadly, there is only one Cribba.


Brb, making alt named Cribba

Edit: UNAVAILABLE

Hello, hello again.
White Tree
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#745 - 2012-06-21 09:32:57 UTC
Make nullsec more about owning constellations than regions, increase profitability for boots-on-ground members.

(I have no suggestions as to how to achieve this.)

Former member of CSM6.
Irya Boone
The Scope
#746 - 2012-06-21 09:33:34 UTC
Reduce The numbers of Null sec systems.
Increase seriously the ressources in Planetary.
Reduce the Bubble In null sec ( please) or remove them.

Incursions Only in null sec and make it worth it like in the old days .
Increase The bountys on the rats in the belts.

And All The ccp events , in null sec like ccp fleet invasion in null sec only.

And more than that Make the universe Live like In RL why No sun Collapse in EvE ? Why there is no Comet strikes a planet and forces the owner to move to find a new safe place to conquier ??

My 2 isks

CCP it's time to remove Off Grid Boost and Put Them on Killmail too, add Logi on killmails .... Open that damn door !!

you shall all bow and pray BoB
Yolanta Geezenstack
GWA Corp
#747 - 2012-06-21 10:11:14 UTC
Whow, that was an interesting read - had no idea about what 0.0 industry was alike, I naturally assumed that 0.0 ist self-sustained and that the excess that is build there with all the high-end minerals and stuff is shipped to highsec.

Weaselior wrote:
0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire need peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.


I agree with that. But there should be a way to allow for "guerilla tactic kind of warfare", when your smaller empire gets beaten by a bigger empire. And one that does hurt (though obviously won't overcome the winning Empire, for that you will need more then just guerilla strikes). Judging from the posts this possibility isn't there right now.

I like the medieval "field and farms" analogy - afaik warfare in medieval times was mostly directed against the opponents peasants, so protecting them was important.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#748 - 2012-06-21 10:13:31 UTC
Irya Boone wrote:
Reduce The numbers of Null sec systems.

Ain't gonna happen.

Irya Boone wrote:
Increase seriously the ressources in Planetary.

Won't help any to make people actually earn more money, since the only thing that'll happen is that more people'll extract and sell more units, forcing down the price to a new equilibrium which'll basically end up giving roughly the same monthly income.

Irya Boone wrote:
Reduce the Bubble In null sec ( please) or remove them.

Why? They're valid tactical elements which are used extensively.

Irya Boone wrote:
Increase The bountys on the rats in the belts.

I think CCP have an economist who'd prefer to not jump out the window over the inflation rate.

Of course, we could fix that by upping the tax rate in hisec, I suppose.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Arcticblue2
Nordic Freelancers inc
#749 - 2012-06-21 11:12:27 UTC
Some said in this thread 0.0 is about empirebuilding ... then great, build a empire and run it like a empire, do you let people (friendly industrial type) into it ? or you shoot at anything not blue ?
Unless you want to build a empire there then don't expect people to move out there... I'm a industrialist and I move where the people are so if people left high-sec I would have to leave too or I would not have anyone to sell to right ?

I don't expect Concord in 0.0 but if a Alliance did build a empire and let people come there I would like them to be a sort of "police" for the empire too.
Arcticblue2
Nordic Freelancers inc
#750 - 2012-06-21 11:13:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Arcticblue2
Lord Zim wrote:

Of course, we could fix that by upping the tax rate in hisec, I suppose.


Or move the economist down to first floor

EDIT: why continue to tax high-sec more ? why not tax 0.0 alliances more they obvious do have ALOT more isk since for example some alliances can afford to pay peoplet o suicide gank hulks and make a event of it.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#751 - 2012-06-21 11:14:34 UTC
Arcticblue2 wrote:
Some said in this thread 0.0 is about empirebuilding ... then great, build a empire and run it like a empire, do you let people (friendly industrial type) into it ? or you shoot at anything not blue ?

We apparently have 20000 characters set blue, what more do you want?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Arcticblue2
Nordic Freelancers inc
#752 - 2012-06-21 11:17:07 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
Arcticblue2 wrote:
Some said in this thread 0.0 is about empirebuilding ... then great, build a empire and run it like a empire, do you let people (friendly industrial type) into it ? or you shoot at anything not blue ?

We apparently have 20000 characters set blue, what more do you want?


Ofcourse you have, 15000 of them are propbably your alts (industrial and such)...
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#753 - 2012-06-21 11:20:18 UTC
And that's our empire. We've built it. We've got some "friendly industrial types" who insist on doing mining and such in our space, but not many because of the risk/reward system etc.

So, again, what more do you want? NRDS?

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#754 - 2012-06-21 11:21:03 UTC
Arcticblue2 wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Arcticblue2 wrote:
Some said in this thread 0.0 is about empirebuilding ... then great, build a empire and run it like a empire, do you let people (friendly industrial type) into it ? or you shoot at anything not blue ?

We apparently have 20000 characters set blue, what more do you want?


Ofcourse you have, 15000 of them are propbably your alts (industrial and such)...


What are you basing this on?

We need to examine the core of the issue. What we don't need is more baseless speculation, uninformed posts (unless it is in the vein of trying to discover the core of the issue), and whining from both sides not about why their environment sucks but why the people in the other environment suck.

This is NOT an us vs. them issue. Stop treating it as such.

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!
Sharise Dragonstar
Big Strong
Hisec Miners
#755 - 2012-06-21 11:22:05 UTC
What would get me into low or null sec as I have only been in null once and low sec twice (going into null then back from null)?

Better clone system. Having to wait a full 24 hours to jump back into my main clone is to long to wait. If it was a lot shorter wait like 3 hours I would be more willing to have a low sec base of operations I could clone jump to when I was willing. Also loosing training time due to pvp clone having no implants is a major put off. Make training times be calaculated by your primary clone.

Insurance should cover the full cost of your ship and have additional insurances for its fittings. Even if I insure my ship with the best insurance if it got popped I would still be losing too much ISK. Not willing to risk ISK and time to farm the ISK.

Bubbles...just remove them from the game.

Don't shoot me...it would help a lot :P

Make gate guns auto aggro with better dps than current ones on any ship that remains in a 250km radius for to long to prevent camping. This will enable players to gate in and have time to warp out to destination. If you want to kill me then work for the right not just insta pop me when I jump through, catch me when I am mining, plexing etc. Another alternative to the gate camp issue would be to implement a procedure where you could fire a probe through a jump gate that can scan for ships etc on the other side so you know if its safe to jump through.

I think if high sec was nerfed it would not increase low/null sec activity. Players will either quit or just run lvl3's.

I would like to go into low sec (not null to be honest) but the risks outweigh the rewards for me.
Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#756 - 2012-06-21 11:24:59 UTC
Adelphie wrote:
Lord Zim wrote:
Talon SilverHawk wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
[quote=Talon SilverHawk]Your ship carries limited ammo and has limited capacity, once deep in null if your not part of the local alliance or a pet, most players don't want to keep doing that trek into and out of 0.0 every night (or when ever you play). That's probably more of a bar than anything else.

fly amarr

presto problem solved


Good answer what about hold capacity though you don't want to gimp your ship with cargo extenders ?



If this is the playstyle you are after then npc null lets you dock and even has a market. Venal is particularly fun.


But its only one area, traveled up north the other week to some Russian owned 0.0 (well it was then) as I still have some stuff up there from my days in Celest, nasty Russians wouldn't let me in Cry. But basically lots of sov owned empty systems going to waste ( as in empty).

Tal


Talon SilverHawk
Patria o Muerte
#757 - 2012-06-21 11:26:06 UTC
Lord Zim wrote:
And that's our empire. We've built it. We've got some "friendly industrial types" who insist on doing mining and such in our space, but not many because of the risk/reward system etc.

So, again, what more do you want? NRDS?


Yes please Lol

Tal


Imryn Xaran
Coherent Light Enterprises
#758 - 2012-06-21 11:26:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Imryn Xaran
Weaselior wrote:
0.0 is about empire building. That's why there's sov, that's why there's alliances, that's why you get your name on the map. Scrublord 'guudfitz' lowsec roamers, friendless highsec nobodies, and anyone who bleats about "blobbing" lacks any understanding of null. Null is about building empires, massive wars, and the like. A good null design includes a place for you - as serfs - because people with the will to power to create a nullsec empire need peasant villages to raze and plunder. But with your narrow-minded concerns over scraping isk from rocks, you lack the vision to have any meaningful input on the design of null, aside from suggesting what sort of salt lick would attract you.


Spoken like a good little Visigoth. You use phrases like “empire building” and “building empires” without giving any thought to what you are actually saying. You aren’t interested in building anything really – all you are interested in is “empire destroying”. The only aspect of the game that you want to engage in is the bit where you blow up something that someone else has built.

Nobody who actually wants to build anything has any incentive to move to null while the game is dominated by people with your attitude, and nothing can or will change until CCP recognise this.

As far as what changes to null are needed

1. I think eliminating jump bridges would be a great place to start. When one alliance is able to project power across the whole map then the map is too small. Eliminate JB networks and you restrict the reach (and therefore influence) of any particular alliance and open up huge tracts of Null that are currently vacant for use. The second affect that eliminating JB’s would have is that it would make logistics much harder with the consequence that it would become preferable to establish industry in null and not just buy in Jita and haul out. This would have to be accompanied by other changes to make null sec industry more viable.

2. Eliminate “sovereignty by destruction”. Implement a new system of sovereignty whereby it changes hands at gun point, but the mechanic to retain it is based on activity in the system and some sort of “gross system product” metric

I think this would make null sec a far more interesting place for a much wider range of players and encourage a wider range of play styles not just the current visigoths.

Let’s put the “building” back in to “empire building” and make sov more than just a colour change on a map.
Lord Zim
Gallente Federation
#759 - 2012-06-21 11:27:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Lord Zim
Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
Better clone system. Having to wait a full 24 hours to jump back into my main clone is to long to wait. If it was a lot shorter wait like 3 hours I would be more willing to have a low sec base of operations I could clone jump to when I was willing. Also loosing training time due to pvp clone having no implants is a major put off. Make training times be calaculated by your primary clone.

"Primary clone"? What?

Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
Insurance should cover the full cost of your ship and have additional insurances for its fittings. Even if I insure my ship with the best insurance if it got popped I would still be losing too much ISK. Not willing to risk ISK and time to farm the ISK.

So what you want is more expensive ships and an additional increase in the ISK already in the game, then.

Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
Bubbles...just remove them from the game.

Good luck with that one.

Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
Make gate guns auto aggro with better dps than current ones on any ship that remains in a 250km radius for to long to prevent camping. This will enable players to gate in and have time to warp out to destination. If you want to kill me then work for the right not just insta pop me when I jump through, catch me when I am mining, plexing etc. Another alternative to the gate camp issue would be to implement a procedure where you could fire a probe through a jump gate that can scan for ships etc on the other side so you know if its safe to jump through.

This already exists, it's called having a scout.

Cyno's lit, bridge is up, but one pilot won't be jumping home.

RIP Vile Rat
Kimmi Chan
Tastes Like Purple
#760 - 2012-06-21 11:30:09 UTC
Sharise Dragonstar wrote:
Insurance should cover the full cost of your ship and have additional insurances for its fittings. Even if I insure my ship with the best insurance if it got popped I would still be losing too much ISK. Not willing to risk ISK and time to farm the ISK.


I can not get on board with this. If the loss of a ship means nothing what is it really worth then?

"Grr Kimmi  Nerf Chans!" ~Jenn aSide

www.eve-radio.com  Join Eve Radio channel in game!