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NPC corps should not be safe havens for players

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James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#261 - 2012-06-21 07:48:15 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Asking to be able to wardec NPC corps is basically just asking for the ability to do exactly the same thing you can do now (ganking) without any of the consequences of doing so.

OP is simply risk averse and wants easy targets he can shoot indiscriminately.

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Crunchie Attuxors
Always Another Corporate Venture
#262 - 2012-06-21 08:26:57 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:

OP is simply risk averse and wants easy targets he can shoot indiscriminately.


Problem with this theory is than then people would be prepared to shoot back instead of AFK Freighters with 50 million less stuff than what would make a gank worthwhile.

See?

Nah, the OP simply wants null everywhere. As I have said elsewhere, that means OP seriously misunderstands Null, or he likes being a feudal slave, or he is a feudal lord.

Nulls is not about shooting ships. Null is about sov. Hisec feeds null with isk so it can have stuff to defend sov with. Its a symbiosis.

NPC Corps are:

1) Isk sink because of taxes

2) Gankable therefore not safe.

So lets stop the pretend game and lets make clear all of these tweaks are about misguided attempts to turn EVE into Nullsec, not for PVP reasons, but for sov/egotrip reasons.
Eve forums official anthem: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pudOFG5X6uA Real men tank hull. Fake women shield-tank Gallente.
Lady Katherine Devonshire
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#263 - 2012-06-21 08:32:47 UTC
I don't normally troll, but...

OP Translation: "I'm tired of PvPing against people actually at or better than my own level. In the name of glorifying my killboard, CCP should allow me to hover my Machriel outside of newbie stations and all of the pop one-day old players as fast as they can undock all day long because that will help me feel more like a Real Man. Sure, the constant ass-raping of everyone with less than a billion SP under their belts will cause over half the playerbase to quit overnight and guarantee that EvE completely stops getting new subscribers, ultimately resulting in CCP going bankrupt and the game coming to an end, but that does not compare to the sheer importance of me being able to club seals for lulz."

The sound of the Amarrian heart
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#264 - 2012-06-21 08:35:33 UTC
Crunchie Attuxors wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:

OP is simply risk averse and wants easy targets he can shoot indiscriminately.


Problem with this theory is than then people would be prepared to shoot back instead of AFK Freighters with 50 million less stuff than what would make a gank worthwhile.

See?

Nah, the OP simply wants null everywhere. As I have said elsewhere, that means OP seriously misunderstands Null, or he likes being a feudal slave, or he is a feudal lord.

Nulls is not about shooting ships. Null is about sov. Hisec feeds null with isk so it can have stuff to defend sov with. Its a symbiosis.

NPC Corps are:

1) Isk sink because of taxes

2) Gankable therefore not safe.

So lets stop the pretend game and lets make clear all of these tweaks are about misguided attempts to turn EVE into Nullsec, not for PVP reasons, but for sov/egotrip reasons.

1) That isn't an ISK sink.

2) Suicide ganking is a stupid mechanic and only works on dumb hulk pilots and even dumber haulers*.

3) I'm just going to link to Nicolo's excellent post concerning your claims that Null is some kind of feudal system.

*As for your straw man argument concerning ganking empty freighters, you know that is not the issue. The issue is the ease with which we can move tech to market hubs, or low ends and ships out to staging systems. Not to mention the thousands of other points on the last few pages you've conveniently forgotten (again).

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#265 - 2012-06-21 08:36:40 UTC
Lady Katherine Devonshire wrote:
I don't normally troll, but...

OP Translation: "I'm tired of PvPing against people actually at or better than my own level. In the name of glorifying my killboard, CCP should allow me to hover my Machriel outside of newbie stations and all of the pop one-day old players as fast as they can undock all day long because that will help me feel more like a Real Man. Sure, the constant ass-raping of everyone with less than a billion SP under their belts will cause over half the playerbase to quit overnight and guarantee that EvE completely stops getting new subscribers, ultimately resulting in CCP going bankrupt and the game coming to an end, but that does not compare to the sheer importance of me being able to club seals for lulz."

Read the thread.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#266 - 2012-06-21 10:16:07 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:
[Anyway, I'm still of the opinion that characters over a certain age (6 months?) should be given a suspect flag if in an NPC corp. Obviously conditions would have to be put on it, perhaps a timer so that they would only receive a suspect flag if undocked for x amount of time, but it seems like a reasonable approach.

As it stands people in high sec just pick on newbies, purely because anyone with any experience can easily evade any kind of threat. IMHO this shouldn't be encouraged, it should be the newer players who are given extra protection, not the other way round.



I can understand what you're trying to accomplish here, it's all in those conditions, if that be contracting to only one corp or something else. I can live with that. 6 months is rather early if you ask me but depending on the conditions is could be, I'm just against the fact that a a number of casual players should be forced out side the logical safety of being part of an empire.

I still think it should be something with the Cargo instead of the pilot.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#267 - 2012-06-21 10:27:42 UTC
Mike Whiite wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:
[Anyway, I'm still of the opinion that characters over a certain age (6 months?) should be given a suspect flag if in an NPC corp. Obviously conditions would have to be put on it, perhaps a timer so that they would only receive a suspect flag if undocked for x amount of time, but it seems like a reasonable approach.

As it stands people in high sec just pick on newbies, purely because anyone with any experience can easily evade any kind of threat. IMHO this shouldn't be encouraged, it should be the newer players who are given extra protection, not the other way round.

I can understand what you're trying to accomplish here, it's all in those conditions, if that be contracting to only one corp or something else. I can live with that. 6 months is rather early if you ask me but depending on the conditions is could be, I'm just against the fact that a a number of casual players should be forced out side the logical safety of being part of an empire.

I still think it should be something with the Cargo instead of the pilot.

To be honest, how many real players do you know that haven't joined a player corp after six months? Lol

A good idea I saw for conditions in another thread was ship class. So if a pilot is >6 months flying a marauder he'd get flagged, similarly he'd be flagged for flying a JF or freighter, but could still fly a drake about or move a few things in a T1 hauler.

Since we now have cargo values that could also be limited to JF or Freighter with anything of value inside, but tbh that would probably just result in people trying to double wrap cargos/game the system. Or staying 0.01 ISK under limit.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Lady Katherine Devonshire
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#268 - 2012-06-21 11:00:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Lady Katherine Devonshire
Simi Kusoni wrote:
To be honest, how many real players do you know that haven't joined a player corp after six months?


My guess would be "Anyone named Drusila"

Are
they
all
related?

Who knows?

The sound of the Amarrian heart
Mike Whiite
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#269 - 2012-06-21 12:43:09 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:
[To be honest, how many real players do you know that haven't joined a player corp after six months? Lol




Heh Actualy I my self took a little longer than 6 months, I started playing just after my son was born, first to kill time when you where up long nights. No real time for commitment and not shure when I could play. Therefor not realy looking for a corp or an asset for one.
when things cooled down I got to manage play time a little better.

But I know still a couple of persons who play 1 hour here, there now and then.

Because they lack the time or don't want to commit themselfs to a corp. Because others abuse a system, it should not be removed to those that use it at it was intended.


That said, the conditions you suggest deserve to be looked at.
Lin-Young Borovskova
Doomheim
#270 - 2012-06-21 15:01:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Lin-Young Borovskova
Again, if those alliances/corporations have high sec alts in NPC Corps to haul stuff it's probably because industry/trading is easier and cheaper than in low/null sec.

There's no problem with actual NPC corporations and how many alts you can have there, Tech doesn't come from high sec, T3 components don't come from high sec, low end ores don't come from high sec neither, but every single alliance has their main production in high sec, so the question is why?

Answer this question and you'll find out NPC corp characters are not the problem.

brb
McOboe
Viscosity
#271 - 2012-06-21 15:13:48 UTC
Simi Kusoni wrote:


1) That isn't an ISK sink.



NPC taxes are definitely an ISK sink.
Cor'byn Black
Doomheim
#272 - 2012-06-21 15:29:42 UTC
I can only imagine someone declaring war on one of the Amarr or Caldari NPC corps then their alliance having to contend with the full might of the NPC Empires. Though a cool addition to this is a way to sign short term privateer agreements with the the decced Empire.

PC Corp: "We declare war on Khanid Works to dip into their ship manufacturing market."
Amarr Empire: *Offers letters of Marque for a price and bounties on enemy PC vessels.*
Hesidak Uroboroon
Doomheim
#273 - 2012-06-21 15:41:57 UTC
perhaps deccing an npc corp could severely lower you standing with the faction it's a member of, and that faction's militia could attack you freely along with the npc corp members. the corp's faction could also place bountys on your head (once the system is fixed) or it could lock your ability to run missions for the corp. although noob entry corps would not be able to be decced, and members of those corps would be moved to a normal npc corp once they reached a max sp count

The U.S. Navy has developed a railgun that can hit a target the size of a watermelon from about 200km away.  its probably around 8,000 years in the future, we can go faster then light, be immortal, teleport capital ships, communicate instantly, mine asteroids and make ships invisible,yet still our railguns can't even hit a massive spaceship over 100km....
Andrew Keiran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#274 - 2012-07-04 16:16:16 UTC
Donte wrote:
EVE is a harsh, cold, angry, bitter, mean, and many more malignant adjectives. None of which include "Safe".

So why is it that NPC corporations are immune to wardec's?



Because some players don't want their every ship destroyed by idiots who can't enjoy anything else than ruining the game for others.

Not everyone plays EVE for combat, deal with it. Game is for everyone.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#275 - 2012-07-04 16:19:36 UTC
Andrew Keiran wrote:
Donte wrote:
EVE is a harsh, cold, angry, bitter, mean, and many more malignant adjectives. None of which include "Safe".

So why is it that NPC corporations are immune to wardec's?



Because some players don't want their every ship destroyed by idiots who can't enjoy anything else than ruining the game for others.

Not everyone plays EVE for combat, deal with it. Game is for everyone.

ITT: Necro trolling.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]