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My Jaguar fit - will it work?
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Ben Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-06-20 03:38:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Ben Johnson
Hello, first I'd like to state that I am quite a newb when it comes to PvP fits. Now that that's out of the way... I have this solo pirate Jaguar fit of mine that I've been wanting to try out, but I'm a little hesitant on spending the money for it. Before I do so, I'd like you guys' thoughts on it. It's meant for close range combat and scaring the crap out of n00bs in low-sec so that they'll pay me ransoms. Here it is:

Ship: Jaguar (Duh)

Lows:
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Mids:
Gistii C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Stasis Webifier II
Warp Scrambler II
Micro Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 50

Highs:
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Rigs:
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I

I would like to know if it's able to survive in combat relatively well (as in, I won't be insta-popped and am able to flee if things go south) as well as deal decent amounts of damage. I know that EFT stats don't mean much in practice, but I'll go ahead and show some now (with all skills Level V):

DPS: 205
Volley Damage: 424
Top Speed with AB: 1177 m/s
Capacitor: -8, +8.4, Cap Stable at 45%
EHP: 5,722
Shield Resists: EM 78.1%, Thermal 65%, Kinetic 47.5%, Explosive 56.3%
Armor Resists: EM 91.5%, Thermal 72.4%, Kinetic 36.3%, Explosive 46.4%

So... thoughts?

EDIT: Go to post #9 for revised fit
Orlacc
#2 - 2012-06-20 04:26:16 UTC
If you are new to PvP and on a budget, use a T1 version, the Rifter. It will give you a good idea how to fly.

"Measure Twice, Cut Once."
Ben Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-06-20 04:28:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Ben Johnson
I'm a little new, but not restricted by a low budget. In other words - I assure you I can afford this! Smile I've flown a few RIfters before, but they weren't fit very well.
Karak Bol
Low-Sec Survival Ltd.
#4 - 2012-06-20 06:31:20 UTC
Ben Johnson wrote:
Hello, first I'd like to state that I am quite a newb when it comes to PvP fits. Now that that's out of the way... I have this solo pirate Jaguar fit of mine that I've been wanting to try out, but I'm a little hesitant on spending the money for it. Before I do so, I'd like you guys' thoughts on it. It's meant for close range combat and scaring the crap out of n00bs in low-sec so that they'll pay me ransoms. Here it is:

Ship: Jaguar (Duh)

Lows:
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Mids:
Gistii C-Type 1MN Afterburner
Stasis Webifier II
Warp Scrambler II
Micro Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 50

Highs:
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Rigs:
Small Anti-Explosive Pump I
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I

I would like to know if it's able to survive in combat relatively well (as in, I won't be insta-popped and am able to flee if things go south) as well as deal decent amounts of damage. I know that EFT stats don't mean much in practice, but I'll go ahead and show some now (with all skills Level V):

DPS: 205
Volley Damage: 424
Top Speed with AB: 1177 m/s
Capacitor: -8, +8.4, Cap Stable at 45%
EHP: 5,722
Shield Resists: EM 78.1%, Thermal 65%, Kinetic 47.5%, Explosive 56.3%
Armor Resists: EM 91.5%, Thermal 72.4%, Kinetic 36.3%, Explosive 46.4%

So... thoughts?


So,lets see.. The lows are allright. Speed, DCU and damage mods. The highs ACs and a Neut, ok. But the mediums... If I remember right, these micro boosters are expensive as hell. Put in a shield extender, preferably a medium one in there. And then the rigs. Why an armor pump? You are not tanking your ship, but use and armor pump, lowering your speed and therefore the only defense you have. Btw. Why the Cap Booster anyway? You should be able to fly everything except the Neut without problems.

Therefore:
1. get rid of the Booster
2. Fit a Shield extender
3. Get rid of the pump
4. fit something else
5. Learn to fit a rifter properly before using AFs
Ben Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-06-20 17:14:55 UTC
Karak Bol wrote:
If I remember right, these micro boosters are expensive as hell.

Well, over here in Sinq Laison the Micro Booster I runs for about 2.5 million isk. Yes that's very expensive when compared to other boosters, but as a module it's not really that expensive. I wanted to have it so that I could keep my Neut on without it sucking my cap dry in a single minute. My idea was was that I would have it available in case I'm under attack against multiple ships and I want to suck all of them dry, not just one. It would leave me in a better position to either continue fighting or flee if needed. Also, there isn't enough CPU available to fit a shield extender if I wanted to leave everything else in.

Karak Bol wrote:
Why an armor pump? You are not tanking your ship, but use and armor pump, lowering your speed and therefore the only defense you have.

Hmm... yes, that's a problem. Alright, I'll remove the pump and replace it with... er.... something. How does a shield rig sound? Or maybe Auxiliary Thrusters for more speed? Another projectile rig might work.
Wuxi Wuxilla
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-06-20 17:38:48 UTC
Ben Johnson wrote:
Karak Bol wrote:
If I remember right, these micro boosters are expensive as hell.

Well, over here in Sinq Laison the Micro Booster I runs for about 2.5 million isk. Yes that's very expensive when compared to other boosters, but as a module it's not really that expensive. I wanted to have it so that I could keep my Neut on without it sucking my cap dry in a single minute. My idea was was that I would have it available in case I'm under attack against multiple ships and I want to suck all of them dry, not just one. It would leave me in a better position to either continue fighting or flee if needed. Also, there isn't enough CPU available to fit a shield extender if I wanted to leave everything else in.

Karak Bol wrote:
Why an armor pump? You are not tanking your ship, but use and armor pump, lowering your speed and therefore the only defense you have.

Hmm... yes, that's a problem. Alright, I'll remove the pump and replace it with... er.... something. How does a shield rig sound? Or maybe Auxiliary Thrusters for more speed? Another projectile rig might work.


Then use meta4 web/scram, that should give you enough CPU. If not, downgrade weapons... But you don't want to fly a Jag without Shield tank (besides those Dual Web or TD abominations you definitely don't want to start to pvp in).
You can either put in 2 Shield rigs or a t2 Dmg rig + Shield rig, depends on personal preferance, fit both and see what you like more.

Also good luck trying to get a Gistii C-Type. Buy a B-Type, as they're cheap, C-Types are either bloody rare (due to 1/10 Angel not dropping DED loot) or not even seeded - Not so sure on this one.
Plaxonia
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-06-20 18:08:52 UTC
The Jag's strength is its speed and agility. Exploit that. If you want to buffer and brawl go with a Wolf.

Lows:
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II
Overdrive Injector II

Mids:
Gistii B-Type 1MN Afterburner
Tracking Disrupter II (Tracking Speed Script)
Warp Scrambler II
Stasis Webifier II

Highs:
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Rigs:
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing
Bill Serkoff2
Tachyon Technology
#8 - 2012-06-20 18:13:08 UTC
I'd go with a MSE if I were you. The extra buffer goes nicely with the ridicu-resists on the Jag.

"The Cyclone and the Drake are two ships which will basically never be good for shield tanking, primarily because they have almost no lowslots in addition to shield tanking bonuses. " -Iam Widdershins
Ben Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-06-20 18:49:06 UTC
OK, so I've done some editing to the fit. Unfortunately, there is no way possible for me to fit a MSE. However, I was easily able to squeeze in a small one, the T2 one. To do so I've downgraded both the scrambler and webifier to Meta 4. The Gistii C-Type is now a Gistii B-Type. I've removed the armor pump as well and replaced it with a Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I. Here's my revised fit:

Lows:
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Mids:
Gistii B-Type 1MN Afterburner
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I
Faint Epsilon Warp Scrambler I
Small Shield Extender II

Highs:
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
200mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP S
Small Energy Neutralizer II

Rigs:
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I
Small Projectile Burst Aerator I

Unimportant EFT Stats With All Skills Level V:
DPS: 205
Volley Damage: 424
Top Speed with AB: 1313 m/s
Capacitor: -7.5, +5.6, Lasts 1m 38s
EHP: 6,322
Shield Resists: EM 78.1%, Thermal 65%, Kinetic 47.5%, Explosive 56.3%
Armor Resists: EM 91.5%, Thermal 72.4%, Kinetic 36.3%, Explosive 23.5%

I found that the projectile rig's T2 version wasn't really that expensive (at least when compared to other T2 rigs), so I may or may not replace this one with that one eventually. Oh, and I'll also update the original post.
Bill Serkoff2
Tachyon Technology
#10 - 2012-06-20 19:06:23 UTC
It's easy to fit a MSE, just use a MAPC.

"The Cyclone and the Drake are two ships which will basically never be good for shield tanking, primarily because they have almost no lowslots in addition to shield tanking bonuses. " -Iam Widdershins
Ben Johnson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2012-06-20 19:10:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Ben Johnson
Then I'd have to sacrifice extra resistances or extra damage. I don't think that those are very good options.
EDIT: OK, maybe I could do away with the DCU. Maybe.
Bill Serkoff2
Tachyon Technology
#12 - 2012-06-20 19:12:51 UTC
Nope; if you'd like to, you could also free up PG by reducing your guns' caliber. Either way, you should definitely sacrifice DPS for almost twice the EHP.

"The Cyclone and the Drake are two ships which will basically never be good for shield tanking, primarily because they have almost no lowslots in addition to shield tanking bonuses. " -Iam Widdershins
Aliaksandre
Screaming Hayabusa
#13 - 2012-06-20 19:53:59 UTC
Under no circumstances should you fit a small shield extender to a combat frigate, especially an AF.

If you are "hunting noobs" you don't need all that speed. Jag is already faster than other AFs.

You can fit a medium extender, then 2 gyro 2 shield power relays in the low, this will give you a nice tank. Downgrade the guns to 150mm. Can also consider fitting a nos if you want to take on ships larger than yourself (so they don't neut you out).
Sofa Raddis
Gravity Waste Management
#14 - 2012-06-22 07:42:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Sofa Raddis
Newb here, curious about this as well, would this one do?

[Jaguar, PvP]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

1MN Afterburner II
Warp Scrambler II
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet
E5 Prototype Energy Vampire
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet

Small Projectile Burst Aerator I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I

In my mind a TE would increase the falloff to just below scram range, good thing no?

Still some cpu to play around with, but not much, T2 scram and web worth using over metas?
that beast
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2012-06-22 11:15:51 UTC
I usually fly wolves (because they're awesome), but what I would do with that fit is:

1) Remove a Gyro from the lows and fit a TE

2) Fit a long point (Personal preference I suppose but you should be able to get speed on most things)

3) MWD fit it. You get a bonus to that sig radius so use it.

4)MSEII is possible, get shield upgrades to 5.

5) Reduce guns to 150mm. Your dps is barely touched but with this and the TE AND your ship boosts (IIRC) you now won't have a problem hitting much. 200s track like...I don't know...something that tracks really badly.

6) Do you REALLY need the neut? If you're having trouble fitting the tank, a neut should be the first to go.
You gain 15 CPU from changing the gyro to a TE and you gain about 9 CPU from downsizing your guns. That should give you enough to fit an MSEII I should think.

Happy hunting!

TB
Hail Goddess
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2012-06-22 14:16:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Hail Goddess
try this:
150mm T2 x3 in high slot + small neut if all skills at 5 Smile
ab+scrambler+MSE+medium ancillary shield booster (50 cap boosters in) in med slot
DC+gyrox2+nanofiber in low slot
and projectile burst and PG rig...approx 6.700+ EHP and crazy boost every 3 seconds Big smile
this is much better than your fit :D enjoy
Aliaksandre
Screaming Hayabusa
#17 - 2012-06-22 15:14:02 UTC
Sofa Raddis wrote:
Newb here, curious about this as well, would this one do?

[Jaguar, PvP]
Gyrostabilizer II
Gyrostabilizer II
Tracking Enhancer II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

1MN Afterburner II
Warp Scrambler II
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
Fleeting Propulsion Inhibitor I

150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet
E5 Prototype Energy Vampire
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet
150mm Light AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet

Small Projectile Burst Aerator I
Small Polycarbon Engine Housing I

In my mind a TE would increase the falloff to just below scram range, good thing no?

Still some cpu to play around with, but not much, T2 scram and web worth using over metas?


Depends on how you plan on flying the jag. If you want to brawl you can lose to TE, maybe try and add a DCU + switch vampire for neut. Also, not really sure you need the prop mod in the low as well as the prop rig, as you are already faster than other AFs (this could be dependent on your skills though)

If you plan on kiting you'll need the TE + barrage or two TE to kite effectively.

With meta4 prices cheap you can go meta 4 on web and scram, get the same stats, and longer OH time.

Check the failheap challenge forum for good fits.
Mechael
Tribal Liberation Distribution and Retail
#18 - 2012-06-23 07:57:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Mechael
Make use of the range bonus and go with an artillery fit, trust me. If you want close range, fly a Wolf instead.

Best Jag fit is an interceptor's worst nightmare. 280mm artillery cannons with close range ammo, try to use keep at range against other frigates and orbit everything else. Stay just inside of warp disruptor range so that you can maintain the tackle (roughly 20km.)

This guarantees that you'll be able to out-damage any frigate that can hit you at that range and pop it before it can pop you, while the Jag is fast enough to keep any close-range brawlers at bay. Keep at range will make you able to hit other frigs (orbiting with your MWD on will make tracking other frigates an issue.) The only threat you'll get from other frigates are close range interceptors which very few people do for a myriad of reasons (they are out there, though, so watch yourself.)

If you're going after larger targets, you'll want to step down to the 250mm arties so that you can fit a somewhat better tank and a cap booster (so that you can keep the MWD and warp disruptor running.) Remember to orbit, not keep at range. The role of the Jag against these larger ships is more about maintaining the tackle, which means surviving as long as possible and keeping your cap running. You're not likely to break any larger ship's tanks by yourself (though it can happen from time to time.)

Edit: I should also mention that the arty Jag doesn't really start to shine until you've got some impressive skills (T2 arties, Assault Frig skill to at least 4, and excellent core fitting skills including Advanced Weapons Upgrades.)

Whether or not you win the game matters not.  It's if you bought it.