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Why aren't gallente boats more popular for PvP?
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Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#41 - 2012-06-20 08:44:25 UTC
Dethis wrote:
So (I just re subbed after 3 years) essentially I should start retraining minmitar for PvP? I am fully invested in blasters and drones from back then. 18m SP with 4m in drones 5m in SC and 4.5 in gunnery all towards gallente stuff with a little minmitar stuff


Versatility is always in style. Adding Minmatar skills to your repetoire will also open up the Serpentis and Angel ships to you, which is well worthwhile. Gallente and Minmatar have a very good cross-train synergy IMO.

Incidentally, if you already have large hybrids trained up, then it wouldn't be a bad idea to quickly train Caldari Cruiser 3 before you start on Minmatar, to get access to the Naga as well.

If you like small ships then take note that the Hybrid AFs (specifically including the Harpy) are pretty awesome right now as well.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Alara IonStorm
#42 - 2012-06-20 08:44:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Alara IonStorm
Dethis wrote:

I have no real interest in blobby fleet stuff just roaming gangs and smaller engagements. I prefer cruiser class sized ships and interceptors.

Gallente should serve you well then. If I were you I would consider getting medium Autocannons for the Hurricane and Rupture. Getting them also gets you the Rifter, Cyclone and Thrasher as well. Also the new Slasher designs are not looking bad. A months training to pull several good fast ships that are very fun.

There isn't really a rush since small and mixed gangs are a good home for Gallente Ships now days. A lot of people tend to pull out their Radar Guns to measure speed but in most cases it isn't as big a factor as people think. There are those rare times when you do get kited but in a gang with tackle even Drones / Range it is rarer that it out and out kills you. Overheat MWD burn in melt face. There Agility is also a bit better as well helping to get out of tough spots.

Crucible did a lot of good for Gallente.
Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#43 - 2012-06-20 08:59:04 UTC
For small gang, gallente are very effective and versatile.

If you like frigates, gallente ones are almighty and deadly.

For super large fleet, they have the Lachesis/Arazu/Proteus which are very wanted by every FC for long range tackle.

No need for minmatar flying garbages.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#44 - 2012-06-20 09:18:16 UTC
Dethis wrote:


I have no real interest in blobby fleet stuff just roaming gangs and smaller engagements. I prefer cruiser class sized ships and interceptors.

Time to start cross training minimitar anyway so I have something if I stumble my way into a big corp at some point, still getting my feet wet.

Quote:
Why should you? Gallente is just as great as any race.


So I can breath a sigh of relief? I can still fly my blaster/drone boats?


Yes you can :) I don't fly anything else, small gang warfare in wormholes and low. The effect of race is minimal compared to your own (and gangs) combat skills and tactical excellence, choose your engagements so they favor your ship/gang comp and you can succeed with any ship. That said, Gallente today has several ships that rank very highly, starting with frigates (AFs and ceptors included) to the deadly cloaky Proteus and the almost-OP Talos.

I regard Talos as a game changer for Gallente, it offers a very powerful option for nano-gangs, something we didn't have before. It's faster and lays a lot more hurt at superior range to a nano-Cane, for example.

T1 cruisers are not common in w-space, but post-Crucible Vexor compares very favorably to a Rupture, and Thorax is a classic.

.
Songbird
#45 - 2012-06-20 09:39:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Songbird
Have you seen the scene in Indiana Jones where a local swings wildly his sword showing off and looking really dangerous, you can see it at youtube. Gal are a lot like that swordsman
Rashmika Clavain
Revelation Space
#46 - 2012-06-20 09:54:42 UTC
Songbird wrote:
Have you seen the scene in Indiana Jones where a local swings wildly his sword showing off and looking really dangerous, you can see it at youtube. Gal are a lot like that swordsman


Failtfit to be honest. He should've had some propulsions mods fit, mebbe a T1 Horse.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#47 - 2012-06-20 09:57:07 UTC
Songbird wrote:
Have you seen the scene in Indiana Jones where a local swings wildly his sword showing off and looking really dangerous, you can see it at youtube. Gal are a lot like that swordsman


That's the Minmatar fantasy. On Tranquility, however, the situation is more like a riot. Gallente, the riot police advancing relentlessly while Minmatar hippies pitifully plink them with little stones. In the end the hippies either run away, or get beaten to a bloody pulp.

.
Songbird
#48 - 2012-06-20 10:20:38 UTC
Rashmika Clavain wrote:
Songbird wrote:
Have you seen the scene in Indiana Jones where a local swings wildly his sword showing off and looking really dangerous, you can see it at youtube. Gal are a lot like that swordsman


Failtfit to be honest. He should've had some propulsions mods fit, mebbe a T1 Horse.

Tbh cavalry has been redundant since they improved the guns
shortattenionsp
Doomheim
#49 - 2012-06-20 12:28:08 UTC  |  Edited by: shortattenionsp
Imo they are (a bit) underused because most Gal ships are armour tankers and with this + short ranged weapons they are forced to commit to fights rather than kite / skirt around a fight with the option of breaking off. With other races I can stay aligned or out of scram range meaning I can GTFO if I think things are going against me or more people turn up etc. With Gallente you are charging into scram/web range and praying nothing else turns up.

Blaster DPS and Gal ship EHP really isn't hugely higher than other races frankly. Unless you can get within scram range really fast it's often not enough to kill your opponent before you pop if you've taken damage on the way in. Other ships can sucessfully brawl you down.

Shield tanking is a bit better for most situations imo. Shield ships ends up faster and with higher DPS and range. Less tackle but you don't need it as badly because you're faster and can keep up with more things and have range so you don't have to stay really close to your target.

A thorax beats a rupture up close on paper but I get waaay more kills and survive a lot more fights in a rupture than a rax. Same with the Hurricane vs Brutix. Not having to commit fully means you can actually engage more targets (since you can break off if its not working out, taking a fight is less of a risk).

Both Minnie and Gall trained but fly Min 80% of the time now for these reasons.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#50 - 2012-06-20 12:39:05 UTC
shortattenionsp wrote:
Talos is awesome and if you want to have speed, dps and range, you should fly Gallente.


FYP

For other Gal ships, toss the opponent with ECM drones and warp away.

.
shortattenionsp
Doomheim
#51 - 2012-06-20 15:24:52 UTC
Roime wrote:
shortattenionsp wrote:
Talos is awesome and if you want to have speed, dps and range, you should fly Gallente.


FYP

For other Gal ships, toss the opponent with ECM drones and warp away.


Yup the Talos is awesome. Dishonour drones work well enough but I hate using them frankly as I hate it when other people use them!
Metal Icarus
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#52 - 2012-06-20 15:40:03 UTC
If medium rails didnt suck so hard, they would be way better at being aHACs.
Lunkwill Khashour
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#53 - 2012-06-20 18:53:59 UTC
Sentry Ishtar can do the aHAC thing aswell but you need a fleet of people organized and skilled/sp'ed enough for sentry drones.
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2012-06-20 23:26:35 UTC
Thank you for your responses guys. So it seems that the main problems summed up are:

1. They are fine solo and in small gangs, so in a number of cases there are no glaring problems.
2. Rig penalties hurt them, aside from that their speed is fine
3a. Blasters don't have good damage projection in large gangs
3b. The fact that eve has trended towards large gangs kind of hurts them
4. Drones could be easier to use
5. Aside from the Talos, they lack a good DPS ship for larger fleets.

Some of these fixes seem self evident.


As an aside, the talk about damage projection made me think. Gallente EW is based on hampering sensor range, which would be fine in small gangs to reduce the damage projection of other races, but not in larger ones for evening out the odds.

I can has blogging skills!
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#55 - 2012-06-21 00:18:10 UTC
Brutix
Armeggeda iscariah
Ganja Labs
Exodus.
#56 - 2012-06-21 00:40:34 UTC
Gallente boats are used quite a bit for pvp. No one ever see's them because 90% of eve is stuck on Maelstrom/drake blobs. (Yay for gankbears everywhere.) Or aren't skilled for the damn blasters. As with every other race in eve most ships are used situationaly. I can name off a couple gallente ships that are used quite a bit.

Lachesis/Arazu: Good long range tackle for small gangs all the way up to the big blobs
Talos: Probably the most powerfull mix of glass cannon/nano faggotry ship in the game
Brutix: Good solo boat
Proteus: Best Tank/dps ratio for any subcap in game and probably the best heavy tackle for armor fleets.
Ares: One of the best interceptors in game
Ishkur/enyo: Extremely durable solo frigs that can dish out good applied dps.
Megathron: Still the coolest and best bang for your buck close range battleship in game.
Myrm: extremely durable solo ship that can tank quite a bit.
Deimos: Suprisingly still a good ship despite its Die most reputation. Probably the best ship to fight drakes with and ive seen Ahac blobs of deimos's as well.
Vindicater: (i know its a pirate BS , it still uses blasters so shut your face) The most DPS out of any subcap in game and a nasty web bonus to make anyone who looks at it funny die in a fire. Super nasty if used for hotdrops with triage support.

All in all , you have to look in the right places to find them being used. just because the big Gankbear nullsec blobs don't use them all the time doesn't mean they aren't popular.





Hail Satan.
Alara IonStorm
#57 - 2012-06-21 00:43:54 UTC
Linna Excel wrote:

5. Aside from the Talos, they lack a good DPS ship for larger fleets.

Talos isn't a fleet ship it is a small gang ship through and through. Mid Range it is out preformed by the Oracle and in Sniping it is out preformed by all three other ships in different areas. Nado/Volley, Naga/Range, Oracle DPS.

It isn't DPS they lack. It is a bunch of different things. Tank / DPS / Accuracy and so forth. Would a fleet of 50 Rail Megathrons with tackle and support be a dangerous force. Absolutely but the Abbadon has more resists, better EHP and is more accurate with Scorch in mid range. Drake has the EHP, good range with low DPS at a 3rd the cost. Rokh does slightly less damage at a greater range. I could go on.

When you talk fleets it has less to do about what works but a lot of factors are taken into account.

* Cost.
* Average pilot Training Lvl.
* Ease of use.
* Range.
* Accuracy.
* Speed.
* DPS.
* Ect.

It is a Crap Shoot what people pick for there gang. People figure other ships have it 5-25% better so they go with them instead.
Linna Excel wrote:

As an aside, the talk about damage projection made me think. Gallente EW is based on hampering sensor range, which would be fine in small gangs to reduce the damage projection of other races, but not in larger ones for evening out the odds.

Yes but it got nerfed pretty bad I hear. It isn't very effective overall with Gal Ships. Often times it doesn't shrink target range far enough to get people into scram range and when it does they run rather then dumbly run into the grinder.

So you are in the same position you were in as before where they don't close range. There are Long Range Niche Gang setups I've heard of that use but nothing like ECM or TD's which are very effective.
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#58 - 2012-06-21 00:47:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayrendo Karr
Brutix is basically a cheaper slightly less powerful talos.
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