These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Fixing Technetium

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
dontbanmebro
Doomheim
#301 - 2012-06-18 21:12:37 UTC
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
EVE doesn't need more outposts anymore. If anything, some areas need less.


Ya...maybe combined with a huge buff to manufacturing and research so people can actually do nullsec industry, thereby making stations worth saving and mollifying some of the inevitable hurtebutte.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#302 - 2012-06-18 21:35:54 UTC
dontbanmebro wrote:
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
EVE doesn't need more outposts anymore. If anything, some areas need less.


Ya...maybe combined with a huge buff to manufacturing and research so people can actually do nullsec industry, thereby making stations worth saving and mollifying some of the inevitable hurtebutte.

Nah, I like having the highsec people make things.

Now if they nerfed the jump freighters...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#303 - 2012-06-18 21:48:42 UTC
I'm gonna wait and see how these new POSs operate before deciding how I feel either way about destructable stations.
Living in POSs stretched out for 10-12 regions would suck if they worked like the modern system, and that's pretty likely if da South has gotta face down 70-80% of EVE's supercaps again.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#304 - 2012-06-18 22:16:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Scatim Helicon
For all the talk of destructible stations, there are greater or lesser variations of 'destructible' that could be implemented here, from your station and everything contained in it turning to a slowly expanding dust cloud, to a scorched wreck that can be interacted with in some limited fashion, to station services being permanently disabled until you freighter in a new set of cloning bays and manufacturing lines and erect scaffolding for a week to run the repair jobs.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#305 - 2012-06-18 22:30:33 UTC
You should be able dock into a wrecked station husk in your pod and jettison all of your goods into space outside the station undock
TweedIe Dum
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#306 - 2012-06-19 15:27:00 UTC
For the sake of making the tax system easier on mining etc. Why not remove the ability to refine minerals etc any where but at a POS.

To me its a logical next step in the game if people cant get to a pos to refine then they sell the ore and the people who can refine it buy it and refine it for a profit.

Allow the corp controlling the pos to set their own tax rate.

The idea being that in null it would be easier and more profitable for the miners in the corp to refine their minerals at the corps pos which will take the tax cut for the corp and then give the miner back his ore .

Allow the pos to be upgraded to allow a perfect refine and you have a simpler solution to the problem of taxing miners. yes you may get one or 2 who compress their ore and find a cheaper place to refine but then thats down to how high you set your tax.

This will work 2 fold when ring mining is brought in and moons phased out
corestwo
Goonfleet Investment Banking
#307 - 2012-06-19 17:31:29 UTC
Two reasons. First, it does nothing to prevent people from taking their ore to lowsec/highsec and refining there, and second, because POS refines suck.

This post was crafted by a member of the GoonSwarm Federation Economic Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

fofofo
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#308 - 2012-06-19 17:40:41 UTC
A little late to the party but upon reading this thread...

CCP Soundwave wrote:
*snip*

No disagreement there. But what if we based it on a system where you for example could upgrade your space at the expense of someone elses space? Let that simmer for a while and people will be fighting in no-time Big smile

I'd rather rely on a mechanic where people poke each other than moons.


This is the best idea for re-charging the hate into null and getting people to fight I've heard offered by anyone yet. I'm surprised people aren't jumping out of their chairs and begging for this! To hell with ring mining... there can be no such thing as a static empire if their 'empireness' is being leached by an alliance holding neighboring space. It would cause so many problems and drama in null sec... everyone would be at each others throats. Is this doable? Are you serious or is this a clever troll?

Signatures should be used responsibly...
Marconus Orion
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#309 - 2012-06-19 17:48:24 UTC
As long as it can't be meta gamed. Such a system should degrade neighbors, even if they are blue.
Luis Graca
#310 - 2012-06-19 17:49:43 UTC
Gogela wrote:
A little late to the party but upon reading this thread...

CCP Soundwave wrote:
*snip*

No disagreement there. But what if we based it on a system where you for example could upgrade your space at the expense of someone elses space? Let that simmer for a while and people will be fighting in no-time Big smile

I'd rather rely on a mechanic where people poke each other than moons.


This is the best idea for re-charging the hate into null and getting people to fight I've heard offered by anyone yet. I'm surprised people aren't jumping out of their chairs and begging for this! To hell with ring mining... there can be no such thing as a static empire if their 'empireness' is being leached by an alliance holding neighboring space. It would cause so many problems and drama in null sec... everyone would be at each others throats. Is this doable? Are you serious or is this a clever troll?



Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#311 - 2012-06-19 17:52:27 UTC
Gogela wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
No disagreement there. But what if we based it on a system where you for example could upgrade your space at the expense of someone elses space? Let that simmer for a while and people will be fighting in no-time Big smile

I'd rather rely on a mechanic where people poke each other than moons.

This is the best idea for re-charging the hate into null and getting people to fight I've heard offered by anyone yet. I'm surprised people aren't jumping out of their chairs and begging for this! To hell with ring mining... there can be no such thing as a static empire if their 'empireness' is being leached by an alliance holding neighboring space. It would cause so many problems and drama in null sec... everyone would be at each others throats. Is this doable? Are you serious or is this a clever troll?

Let's see some mechanics first. Wouldn't want it to be the next POS sovereignty where you spam (insert structures here) to reduce (statistic). I'd be the first to jump at the idea of people putting up hundreds of (insert structures here) at every moon or something, but ...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
dontbanmebro
Doomheim
#312 - 2012-06-19 17:55:12 UTC
Luis Graca wrote:
Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something


Agreed. Even more stacked in favor of the big blobs. The exact opposite of what nullsec needs.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#313 - 2012-06-19 17:59:54 UTC
dontbanmebro wrote:
Luis Graca wrote:
Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something

Agreed. Even more stacked in favor of the big blobs. The exact opposite of what nullsec needs.

Tsk. Oh well, time for another idea.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#314 - 2012-06-19 18:00:59 UTC
Luis Graca wrote:
Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something

I disagree. Small groups need to band together to form big groups to challenge a powerful alliance. As a small group, you can take cheaper, run down null space. As you develop it it will reduce the value of the large alliance's space, right? So now that larger alliance has to constantly project power to wipe out the small guys draining their space's value. This is very taxing on resources. Every time a smaller group moves in, it costs the larger alliance the value of their home space and the resources needed to evict the newcomer. As soon as your weak group leaves, someone else is moving in again. It's almost like tag-teaming with the smaller alliances. Eventually you will ware down the larger group.

Alavaria Fera wrote:
Let's see some mechanics first. Wouldn't want it to be the next POS sovereignty where you spam (insert structures here) to reduce (statistic). I'd be the first to jump at the idea of people putting up hundreds of (insert structures here) at every moon or something, but ...

This is valid... ^

Never know how it will actually shake out w/ CCP... no offence.

Signatures should be used responsibly...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#315 - 2012-06-19 18:06:21 UTC
Gogela wrote:
Luis Graca wrote:
Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something

I disagree. Small groups need to band together to form big groups to challenge a powerful alliance. As a small group, you can take cheaper, run down null space. As you develop it it will reduce the value of the large alliance's space, right? So now that larger alliance has to constantly project power to wipe out the small guys draining their space's value. This is very taxing on resources. Every time a smaller group moves in, it costs the larger alliance the value of their home space and the resources needed to evict the newcomer. As soon as your weak group leaves, someone else is moving in again. It's almost like tag-teaming with the smaller alliances. Eventually you will ware down the larger group.

So people will be going to nullsec to get sov and be stomped just because it will hurt... someone?

I mean you can try to take Providence or something, but Solar Fleet is a lot closer, and I daresay if you disrupt their farming they'll turn that tractor around and run you over.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
arcca jeth
Dark Alliance
#316 - 2012-06-19 18:11:44 UTC
I've said before in a thread LAST YEAR that if CCP wants to restore any industry to null or low sec that refining bonuses on POS's erected in low/null should EXCEED the benefits of the current refining system in high sec. That would fix the risk vs reward problem for refining in low/null. It would give people more incentive to move operations there to gain those bonuses. This is not a hard thing to do as the system already determines where you can erect certain structures. So in comparison to moon mining, you could have 2 separate classes of refiners. High yield refineries anchorable only in .2 or below and low yield refineries (although still substantially better than high sec refineries) at between .4 and .2

Also, I'd still like a new variant of the rorqual introduced that only refines and again, at bonuses that exceed the yield of refining in high sec. Easy fix ccp, make it so for winter? That would be sweet.
dontbanmebro
Doomheim
#317 - 2012-06-19 18:14:23 UTC
Ya, bonuses to industry in nullsec seem like a no-brainer.
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#318 - 2012-06-19 18:22:23 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Gogela wrote:
Luis Graca wrote:
Wouldn't work, instead of starting fights it would end then because there will be even less chances to small/medium alliances to actually make some isk to face or simple to **** the big blocks and it would be just a matter of time until they stop or even try to actually do something

I disagree. Small groups need to band together to form big groups to challenge a powerful alliance. As a small group, you can take cheaper, run down null space. As you develop it it will reduce the value of the large alliance's space, right? So now that larger alliance has to constantly project power to wipe out the small guys draining their space's value. This is very taxing on resources. Every time a smaller group moves in, it costs the larger alliance the value of their home space and the resources needed to evict the newcomer. As soon as your weak group leaves, someone else is moving in again. It's almost like tag-teaming with the smaller alliances. Eventually you will ware down the larger group.

So people will be going to nullsec to get sov and be stomped just because it will hurt... someone?

I mean you can try to take Providence or something, but Solar Fleet is a lot closer, and I daresay if you disrupt their farming they'll turn that tractor around and run you over.

Maybe everyone should just surrender.

Signatures should be used responsibly...
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#319 - 2012-06-19 18:31:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Gogela wrote:
Maybe everyone should just surrender.

Maybe they already did.

Supposedly that's why we're blue "to everyone" (as per the EVEO Forums) and are "surrounded by pets and NAs" (also from EVEO forums).

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
hungrymanbreakfast
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#320 - 2012-06-20 02:04:44 UTC
Kismeteer wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Ring mining might have to move back in favor or re-doing POSs.

In the meantime, I'd really just like to alchemy every single tier of moons (like it was done with 64s).


I benefit from technetium a lot. And I deal with more POS's more than most people. That being said:

Please add Ring Mining first before redoing POS's. Give people a reason to mine (so PVPers can kill them) and give me a reason to tear down current POS's. Plus, once you redo POSs, you can then get rid of moon minerals entirely and I can tear down a LOT of tech moon towers.

Good luck with the Alchemy thing as well. Should be interesting.



Honestly this. It doesn't make sense to work on the POS first. Doing the belts first allows for the market to saturate, stabilizing the economy with a bit of a bubble while the POS are redone. YES it will be less ISK in ring mining while this happens, but it will make sure there isn't a sudden lack of materials until people are at work mining the rings. There are alot of people waiting on the ring belts including myself. Theres a good chunk of people I imagine waiting on the POS fixes, but its not entirely broken. I hear far more about people waiting on the ring belts than bitching about the POS mechanics. It can keep on working away while new content is released. I would really like to see this new mining content somewhere around the time that you plan to release the mining barge changes.
Less work for devs too I would imagine as the moon mining arrays can be edited out while you are at the POS code.