These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Warfare & Tactics

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

The Amarr factional war is over.

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Of Essence
#81 - 2012-06-15 21:01:42 UTC  |  Edited by: chatgris
Mutnin wrote:

edited.. also between Caldari & Gallente, Caldari has had more kills this week and for the month according to the FW stats in game. So those that try to claim we aren't fighting are full of it. Roll (keep in mind it only counts war target kills & not neuts/pies)


Does it count Minmatar militia that you kill/are killed by?

Also, the Caldari have never been outnumbered, militia stats have always had you with a significant numbers advantage over the gallente, just a lot of that advantage used to be farmers in stealth bombers: Now you have a mechanic to leverage all the farmers you have in your militia.
Ethan Argoin
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#82 - 2012-06-15 21:06:37 UTC
Alba mate...

You know me, we plex together all the time! lol

Whats the point being with the IWIN button, screw the Minnies....

We are the true faction, having to fight for it is what we do best....

If this **** was boring, no one would do it!!!

KEEP FIGHTING MATE!

Dont let me down!!

PS for the haters, Alba is by far one of the top guys I have met in FW!
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#83 - 2012-06-15 21:23:36 UTC
chatgris wrote:
Does it count Minmatar militia that you kill/are killed by?

"Mew"matar - Members of the Minmatar militia fighting in the Gallente/Caldari theater of operation.
Shadow Adanza
Gold Crest Salvage
#84 - 2012-06-15 21:54:31 UTC
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:



100 guys on comms yesterday and we were running plexes in gangs, looking for fight.
When gallente did finally show their faces was after we flipped 2 systems, and they came with a BS heavy fleet with heavy logistic support.

You had 100 guys on comms and couldn't come up with a fleet to match that? Really???
We had a 40 man fleet. So we came out in BSes? Go get yours and let's go! I find it hard to believe that out of "100 guys" you couldn't come up with BSes and logi support.

Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?
chatgris
Quantum Cats Syndicate
Of Essence
#85 - 2012-06-15 22:00:20 UTC
Shadow Adanza wrote:
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:



100 guys on comms yesterday and we were running plexes in gangs, looking for fight.
When gallente did finally show their faces was after we flipped 2 systems, and they came with a BS heavy fleet with heavy logistic support.

You had 100 guys on comms and couldn't come up with a fleet to match that? Really???
We had a 40 man fleet. So we came out in BSes? Go get yours and let's go! I find it hard to believe that out of "100 guys" you couldn't come up with BSes and logi support.


Or you know, 100 drakes == 300,000 alpha IIRC. Just alpha the BS's one by one.
Shadow Adanza
Gold Crest Salvage
#86 - 2012-06-15 22:38:27 UTC
chatgris wrote:
Shadow Adanza wrote:
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:



100 guys on comms yesterday and we were running plexes in gangs, looking for fight.
When gallente did finally show their faces was after we flipped 2 systems, and they came with a BS heavy fleet with heavy logistic support.

You had 100 guys on comms and couldn't come up with a fleet to match that? Really???
We had a 40 man fleet. So we came out in BSes? Go get yours and let's go! I find it hard to believe that out of "100 guys" you couldn't come up with BSes and logi support.


Or you know, 100 drakes == 300,000 alpha IIRC. Just alpha the BS's one by one.

It sounds more to me like they rolled out a big fleet as a show of force so they could say: "Oh, we brought out a fleet but the big bad Gallente were too scared to play with the mighty Caldari." And when the Gallente brought out their own, bigger fleet instead of using those "100 guys" to ship up and get a fight (like they "wanted"), they turned tail and docked up not to be seen for the rest of the day.

If you claim to have 100 guys in comms, you have no room to complain about an enemy's fleet comp when it's less than half of what you have in comms. You tell a room with 100 Gallente in it there's a 42 man Caldari fleet flying BSes with logi, I guarantee you you'll get a fleet to spar with them and probably have to turn people away to boot.

Are you suggesting coconuts migrate?
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#87 - 2012-06-15 23:54:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Flyinghotpocket
Shylari Avada wrote:
Flyinghotpocket wrote:

no we still cant.

removing ewar isnt enough you dunder head.

even in our own highsec with our rats having 90% web on wartarget minmatar dramiel they can still orbit and our npcs wont lay a shot on em.


I would like to introduce you to the Huginn and Rapier... they do hilarious things to people speed tanking majors. (Extra Credit if you team up with a Arazu/Lachesis)

Try it out sometime.


id like to introduce you to the reality of playing this game.

1 our npcs in highsec have 90% webs and still wont hit for ****

2 our npcs in major plexs dont have webs at all.

Using aforementioned logic EVEN IF WE HAD THEM WEBBED' OUR NPCS WOULDNT HIT THEM.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
Pinky Feldman
Amarrian Vengeance
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#88 - 2012-06-16 00:38:32 UTC
Mutnin wrote:
Veshta Yoshida wrote:
So in short: FarmVille™.

People willing to accept my statement, made just after the patch, that FW was over-incentivized and downright broken by changes yet? Smile



What makes you think you are the only one that said changes were gonna be bad? There were a lot of us that said this would likely end with one side not being able to recover. It looked like Caldari were going to go the same route as Amarr and lose all our space. Gals counted on it and Caldari expected it.

We instead fought back, and have now reached a almost even war zone control being 50/51 between Caldari & Gallente. We have 4 Gal systems vulnerable and have a few of our own close to vulnerable. Caldari fought out numbered and simply used better tactics to hold our head above water long enough for the new influx of numbers to FW to make a difference.

Amarr on other hand rolled over and stopped trying with corps like your own giving up.

edited.. also between Caldari & Gallente, Caldari has had more kills this week and for the month according to the FW stats in game. So those that try to claim we aren't fighting are full of it. Roll (keep in mind it only counts war target kills & not neuts/pies)


Not really even comparisons considernig the NPC Ewar imbalances and the fact that the Amarr got roflstomped in the days leading up to Inferno patch day. I do admit that at this point, at least until the ewar changes occur there really isn't any reason to offensive plex on the Amarr side considering you're just putting ISK into Minmatar pockets once you flip systems.

I think that as a whole the Amarr do need to "man up" and overall I do like the incentivizing of FW, but the scaling is a bit lopsided which the Amarr/Minmatar side of things has shown. I could care less about the LP rewards since I fund my PVP through other ways and my alliance didn't join for the ISK rewards, but making our LP shop essentially worthless while scaling the benefits so positively for the other side feels pretty demoralizing even though I really don't care about LP.

I think the Gallente/Caldari side is a perfect example of how interesting and fun FW can be when sides are relatively equal in terms of system control, but the Amarr/Minmatar side is an example of how it doesn't really work when things start out that way. There needs to be some sort of built in game mechanism that forces things towards equilibrium when things become overly lopsided and currently there isn't any. In fact, the current game mechanics are the complete opposite and do nothing to promote Amarr to regain system control. Think of racing games with boost enabled, once one player falls hopelessly behind they get a speed boost which allows them to catch back up and not quit all together. The current situation resembles a racing game where one side is several laps behind, sure they could potentially come back, but to anyone who has ever played a racing game without boost, once you're that far behind, unless you love racing, there isn't really any reason to continue the race.

Like I said before, i'm not terribly concerned with the system control or LP aspects of FW and am just enjoying the PVP as much as I can right now. Game mechanics aren't going to keep me from undocking. With that being said, as someone new to FW with a fresh perspective, these are my observations.

tldr; A good solution to one side overly dominating the other side would be to reduce the timers or increase system influence gain for each offensive plex the losing side runs based on how far they are behind the other side. For the sake of balance, if you're going to get massive benefit for having system control, there also needs to be negatives attached. Sov warfare has this in the fact that overexpanding means that its difficult to defend your territory, but FW is much smaller scale and compartmentalized such that it needs to use a slightly different model.

The moar you cry the less you pee
Crosi Wesdo
War and Order
#89 - 2012-06-16 01:24:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Crosi Wesdo
Flyinghotpocket wrote:
Shylari Avada wrote:
Flyinghotpocket wrote:

no we still cant.

removing ewar isnt enough you dunder head.

even in our own highsec with our rats having 90% web on wartarget minmatar dramiel they can still orbit and our npcs wont lay a shot on em.


I would like to introduce you to the Huginn and Rapier... they do hilarious things to people speed tanking majors. (Extra Credit if you team up with a Arazu/Lachesis)

Try it out sometime.


id like to introduce you to the reality of playing this game.

1 our npcs in highsec have 90% webs and still wont hit for ****

2 our npcs in major plexs dont have webs at all.

Using aforementioned logic EVEN IF WE HAD THEM WEBBED' OUR NPCS WOULDNT HIT THEM.



THIS is how you deal with people speed tanking.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13E4UTefjhg

I post this in the interest of everyone, solo t1 frigates running majors is ******** and have to be stopped one way or another. This is just the funnest way.
Tanaka Sekigahara
United Space Marine Corp
#90 - 2012-06-16 02:03:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Tanaka Sekigahara
Cearain wrote:
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:

Well, i agree with you on most points. I also actually agree with the OP to a point. but the lack of will in my mind takes precedence over anything else.

if CCP were to change mechanics, I would think that forcing all the rats to be killed before plex closes would do enough.You want webbing rats as well, will that solve the issue? Ok, if you like, but I still think a minor should be able to be completed solo.



Well there would be allot more "will" to fight this occupancy war if it involved allot of quality pvp. You can blame the players for not having the "will" to do allot of pve all you want. I guess I don't really see my lack of interest in shooting red crosses for hours on end as any sort of flaw in my character.

If ccp wants players in faction war to have a "will" to win then they need to make faction war something that is viewed as something as meritorious to win. IMO if they made winning faction war based on being good at small scale pvp they would accomplish that. But as long as winning is based on who can sit there shooting red crosses, fw will always be lolfw.

I have posted my views on what should be done with the rats many places. I won't go into it allot here. But in sum the rats shouldn't play much of a role if any at all. The war should be won by the players not the npcs.
Has nothing to do with shooting crosses, to be honest. If your systems fall you lose access to your FW agents, and then you cant pull missions to make your isk. I would think you would realize this isnt your grandmothers FW, where plexing means nothing. When it meant nothing I didn't do it, now if you lose the systems you lose the stations and the agents with them
If that isn't enough reason to run the plexes to defend i dunno what to say...
Tanaka Sekigahara
United Space Marine Corp
#91 - 2012-06-16 02:08:23 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:
...I just form or join gangs, go out looking for gallente to kill and when they dont show, run plexes hoping they do...
Your killboard says otherwise.

Anyways, the fact that Gallente having second most VP every day (which does not count the four corps who plex heavily while in Minmatar militia) means they are very much participating in Occupancy War. The Caldari + farming alts are simply plexing like crazy.
What exactly is your point??? 3 posts and i still see no point.Is your point I am not active? I am active. Is your point Caldari has no will to fight?? Or are you saying we dont PvP and just run plexes. If thats your claim that's a lie.
Tanaka Sekigahara
United Space Marine Corp
#92 - 2012-06-16 02:20:00 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Tanaka Sekigahara wrote:
...I just form or join gangs, go out looking for gallente to kill and when they dont show, run plexes hoping they do...
Your killboard says otherwise.

Anyways, the fact that Gallente having second most VP every day (which does not count the four corps who plex heavily while in Minmatar militia) means they are very much participating in Occupancy War. The Caldari + farming alts are simply plexing like crazy.
Zen Guerrilla
CTRL-Q
Ushra'Khan
#93 - 2012-06-16 09:31:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Zen Guerrilla
I can't wait for CCP to balance FW NPCs. Not to see what that's gonna change for FW (nothing) but what crappy reason those whiny amarrios bring up next to defend their fails.

Personally, i'm very happy with FW now. Tons of new people on both sides and even though quite a lot are there just for the LP, there's fighting going on everywhere. And it heavily shifted from blobby gangs and station camps to smaller, more agile gangs with a lot more diversity on ship types and sizes.

TBH those whiny amarr corps that are still dreaming of the good old days when they would curbstomp us on most occasions with those patented Xeno logi fleets, take a look at FWEDDIT. They might be horrible at pvp, cheap at fitting ships and absolutely desastrous at local chat but they fight. And they enjoy it. They're also getting better finally (at pvp and fitting, the local smack is still terribad).

TLDR: Stop whine, adapt, have fun.

pew pew
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#94 - 2012-06-16 10:17:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Mutnin
chatgris wrote:
Mutnin wrote:

edited.. also between Caldari & Gallente, Caldari has had more kills this week and for the month according to the FW stats in game. So those that try to claim we aren't fighting are full of it. Roll (keep in mind it only counts war target kills & not neuts/pies)


Does it count Minmatar militia that you kill/are killed by?

Also, the Caldari have never been outnumbered, militia stats have always had you with a significant numbers advantage over the gallente, just a lot of that advantage used to be farmers in stealth bombers: Now you have a mechanic to leverage all the farmers you have in your militia.


Considering we have had to put up with the thousands of loss mails those farmers add to the kill-boards I think it's about time we get a slight bit of benefit out of them. Don't also forget that normal high sec mission farmers join FW to avoid paying taxes in the NPC corp and inflate our numbers. We get a lot more of those being most mission farmers run Caldari missions.

Aside from that you know very well what was meant in the "outnumbered" part.. You guys always grab on to those fake inflated numbers of "Caldari Militia members" but most of them are no where to be seen and are not active in FW. We were outnumbered in active PVP pilots, when you guys would easily have 30 or 40 guys in a single system and we would be lucky to have 10.

Lately things have become a lot more even on the active pilot numbers, but that's not what it's been like for months when we struggled to get even 10 guys in a gang.
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#95 - 2012-06-16 10:45:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Mutnin
Pinky Feldman wrote:



Not really even comparisons....


You do realize that prior to the patches we were something like 15 or more systems in the hole to Gallente? We had lost our home system Enaluri. We had maybe 3 agent systems left in low sec and came very close to losing two of those 3, the week of the patch.

We were in no better shape than Amarr, prior to the week before the patch came out and in all honestly I think Amarr were better off because Caldari couldn't even field a BC gang at the time. We didn't have a rosy out look and pretty much everyone had to evac their stuff to high sec or to some station system that wasn't a likely target.

The thing that made the difference for Caldari is our plexing guys kept plexing and Caldari would get a system flip every once in a while and manage to flip a bunker in the odd hours of the night. Gals would of course just take it back, but we knew we could take systems but just couldn't hold them.

That gave us one opportunity.. The week of the patch we didn't roll over and let Gals steam roll our last few important systems. Instead we went on the offensive and put an all out effort to flip station systems that Gals were living in. We put them on the defense which meant they couldn't roll anymore of our system instead they had to defend.

We failed at capturing any systems in our efforts but we succeeded in stopping them from taking any new systems prior to the patch. After the patch, it started to become apparent that the patch wasn't going to be as bad as we thought and actually might favor the way Caldari has been playing the last year.

Simply put the patch favors the side that spreads out it's forces and attacks all across the map, instead of staying boxed up in one area. This is what Caldari had been forced into doing by the Gal blobs, but ironically it became what has allowed turn the fight in our favor.

Amarr could have done what Caldari has done and in all honestly you still can.. To win the new sov system you have to spread your corps out across the map where they can attack their local systems but more importantly defend those systems that are captured.
Silence iKillYouu
Girls Lie But Zkill Doesn't
Pandemic Legion
#96 - 2012-06-16 11:17:55 UTC
Another ammar tears thread.
CCP cant change the fact that the minnies worked hard to get were we are today. We are all communicating and working together like never before. I'm even being nice to jade o.0

While u all sit back and complain. We are full steam ahead.
Its sad that we can plex for hours in kamela and no one undocks unless First General is there to hold your hands.

EVE Mail me i dont check forums often.
Salicaz
Verrimus Caelum
#97 - 2012-06-16 11:21:55 UTC
Silence iKillYouu wrote:
Another ammar tears thread.
CCP cant change the fact that the minnies worked hard to get were we are today. We are all communicating and working together like never before. I'm even being nice to jade o.0

While u all sit back and complain. We are full steam ahead.
Its sad that we can plex for hours in kamela and no one undocks unless First General is there to hold your hands.



QFT^

Most of us can't be arsed to play Thrasher Online atm :)
Zen Guerrilla
CTRL-Q
Ushra'Khan
#98 - 2012-06-16 11:29:51 UTC
Salicaz wrote:
Silence iKillYouu wrote:
Another ammar tears thread.
CCP cant change the fact that the minnies worked hard to get were we are today. We are all communicating and working together like never before. I'm even being nice to jade o.0

While u all sit back and complain. We are full steam ahead.
Its sad that we can plex for hours in kamela and no one undocks unless First General is there to hold your hands.



QFT^

Most of us can't be arsed to play Thrasher Online atm :)

It's a shame there's only one size of plexes, right? Roll


Also, stop derailing this wonderful thread with gallente/caldari whines, start your own for that! P

pew pew
Salicaz
Verrimus Caelum
#99 - 2012-06-16 11:32:36 UTC
Zen Guerrilla wrote:
Salicaz wrote:
Silence iKillYouu wrote:
Another ammar tears thread.
CCP cant change the fact that the minnies worked hard to get were we are today. We are all communicating and working together like never before. I'm even being nice to jade o.0

While u all sit back and complain. We are full steam ahead.
Its sad that we can plex for hours in kamela and no one undocks unless First General is there to hold your hands.



QFT^

Most of us can't be arsed to play Thrasher Online atm :)

It's a shame there's only one size of plexes, right? Roll


Also, stop derailing this wonderful thread with gallente/caldari whines, start your own for that! P


I'm talking about minmitar's use of Thrasher after Thrasher. And yeah, you can pretty much use them for all your plexing needs I here Lol
Zen Guerrilla
CTRL-Q
Ushra'Khan
#100 - 2012-06-16 12:19:01 UTC
Salicaz wrote:
Zen Guerrilla wrote:
Salicaz wrote:
Silence iKillYouu wrote:
Another ammar tears thread.
CCP cant change the fact that the minnies worked hard to get were we are today. We are all communicating and working together like never before. I'm even being nice to jade o.0

While u all sit back and complain. We are full steam ahead.
Its sad that we can plex for hours in kamela and no one undocks unless First General is there to hold your hands.



QFT^

Most of us can't be arsed to play Thrasher Online atm :)

It's a shame there's only one size of plexes, right? Roll


Also, stop derailing this wonderful thread with gallente/caldari whines, start your own for that! P


I'm talking about minmitar's use of Thrasher after Thrasher. And yeah, you can pretty much use them for all your plexing needs I here Lol


True enough. Though at least we in Iron Blobside(tm) would love to switch to other ships but CCPs ******** small plex mechanics (not to mention the latest destroyer buff, oh and the upcoming destroyer buff) pretty much force people into destroyers. And that they're just as good in mediums is because the Thrasher (and to some extent the Coercer) is just so damn powerful while being relatively cheap and reasonably agile.

Also lets not forget FWEDDITs gangs that consist of nothing but thrashers and rifters and can only be properly countered by fielding the same.

Personally, i'm absolutely pissed of by destroyers. I've been flying frigs for ages and generally prefer them over other ships. But it's pointless these days. A few frigs (mostly faction/pirate frigs which cost so much more than destroyers) are still semi-usable but only if fit to counter exactly what you're gonna go up against. And if that AC thrasher is sitting at the warpin you're dead no matter what frig you fly.

pew pew