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Warfare & Tactics

 
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Amarrian Factional Warfare: The Evolving Front

Author
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#61 - 2012-06-13 22:57:38 UTC
Dan Carter Murray wrote:
Quote:
The Minmatar conquests pre-patch were amazingly cheeky really - all that territory taken without a decisive advantage in numbers mainly because of the negative morale the forum-whiners were producing.


Cheeky indeed.

Did everyone thank Hans for the heads up that system reset wasn't going to happen?


As far as I could tell Hans was in favour of a system reset and there was a fair amount of discussion in channels about "do we seriously think this lunacy could happen?" The answer is of course "no". System reset would be a huge kick in the teeth for Eve's player led sandbox.

And well, I've got to break to you Amarrian guys ... the real issue with trying to get game changes rolled back in your benefit is well .. you're not the goons!


/joking Cool

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom

Thomas Kreshant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2012-06-13 23:44:32 UTC
Didn't need a reset and doesn't need a reset it's fine.

If Amarr takes space back we do and if we don't oh well it's not a big deal, fight for what you want and if you achieve it well done and if not try harder or go do something else.
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#63 - 2012-06-14 14:49:59 UTC
Jade Constantine wrote:
As far as I could tell Hans was in favour of a system reset and there was a fair amount of discussion in channels about "do we seriously think this lunacy could happen?" The answer is of course "no". System reset would be a huge kick in the teeth for Eve's player led sandbox.

And well, I've got to break to you Amarrian guys ... the real issue with trying to get game changes rolled back in your benefit is well .. you're not the goons!

/joking Cool

CCP have done plenty of roll-backs when they messed up in an epic way, but lately they have introduced some intermediary mechanic in place (tower fuel for 1-2 weeks when changing to bricks f.ex.) when doing the 'Big Ticket Items' .. and well, changing system flips from 6-7hr to 2-3 days, incentivizing everything and adding lock-outs in an abnormally high reship part of Eve does make their last attempt at sorting FW a 'Big Ticket Item'.

As in so many other things, they handled it exceedingly poorly.

Since they must have known that they had no intention of actually balancing anything FW related at the time of FF (first official announcement of changes), what they should have done was to freeze all VP gain (ie. inability to flip anything), same kind of freeze I called for 3 years ago after I witnessed a Rifter speed tanking a minor (yes, a bloody MINOR!) without even bothering to shoot a single rat Big smile
Shakorites would have had their 4-5 systems in Amarr space, Amarr 1-2 Labour camps and we could have started this vastly different war on a much more even footing .. instead the Shakorites got to abuse the unbelievably stupid 6-7hr flip time Soundwave intro'ed in December.

Reset makes no sense without balancing the damn thing and was never on the table to begin with .. with winter/summer fixes (winter may/may not have actual NPC balance) hopefully sorting out the plexing side of things it will have been nearly five years with an incredibly broken balance and seemingly very random 'fixes', probably due to no one person/team having FW on his/their itinerary.

NB: When I say broken balance, I mean imagine one bloc in null having 150% jump ranges on all their capitals .. that is how bad the plexing balance is.

Either way, it makes no difference. They are rewriting practically everything in the coming year .. iHub upgrades, NPCs (hopefully) and probably missions/plexes .. only wish they had done so when they say they would .. back in the months/years immediately following the release of Empyrean, you know the 'iteration phase' Blink
FIRST GENERAL
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#64 - 2012-06-14 14:56:53 UTC  |  Edited by: FIRST GENERAL
Veshta Yoshida wrote:


NB: When I say broken balance, I mean imagine one bloc in null having 150% jump ranges on all their capitals .. that is how bad the plexing balance is.



What you meant to say was probably "I mean imagine one (or a couple) bloc(s) in null having all of the (O)TeChnetium Moons, that's how bad the plexing balance is."

CCP would never tolerate such a thing, i mean player made imbalance in a sandbox - heresy, burn the heathens!

There is but one solution: adapt or die. or play another game.
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#65 - 2012-06-14 15:07:18 UTC
FIRST GENERAL wrote:
Veshta Yoshida wrote:


NB: When I say broken balance, I mean imagine one bloc in null having 150% jump ranges on all their capitals .. that is how bad the plexing balance is.



What you meant to say was probably ...

No it really wasn't since players have zero influence on the existing discrepancy between NPC's/Geography on the Amarr/Shakorite front .. it is 100% mechanics based so your alternative makes very little sense.

Nice troll attempt though, very "Status Quo, best Quo" of you Smile
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#66 - 2012-06-14 15:14:39 UTC
Doesn't matter whether or not there was a reset. The current state is good in that the balancing mechanic can be tested to see if it will or won't work.

Gallente/Caldari front was roughly even and we'll see which way it goes (probably not well for Gallente side) and whether or not that side of the war will balance out as well.

FIRST GENERAL
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#67 - 2012-06-14 15:46:33 UTC  |  Edited by: FIRST GENERAL
Veshta Yoshida wrote:
FIRST GENERAL wrote:
Veshta Yoshida wrote:


NB: When I say broken balance, I mean imagine one bloc in null having 150% jump ranges on all their capitals .. that is how bad the plexing balance is.



What you meant to say was probably ...

No it really wasn't since players have zero influence on the existing discrepancy between NPC's/Geography on the Amarr/Shakorite front .. it is 100% mechanics based so your alternative makes very little sense.

Nice troll attempt though, very "Status Quo, best Quo" of you Smile


It really wasn't a troll, honest! The point I was trying to make is that if you're given lemons by CCP are you going to be upset about the fact that you can't make Tequila Sunrises or are you going to be alongside me sitting on the beach sipping Margaritas along day long?

(Look up the drinks if you don't get the analogy)
Gullibility Fool
Doomheim
#68 - 2012-06-15 00:43:55 UTC
Yes, Veshta.

Apparently you should adapt to the new FW in the same way Wolfsbrigade has; by creating Minnie militia Alts and running plexes in amarr held systems other than your own. Even seen Wolfsbrigade pilots helping their Minnie Alts to complete FW missions...
FIRST GENERAL
Hostile.
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#69 - 2012-06-15 06:23:59 UTC  |  Edited by: FIRST GENERAL
Gullibility Fool wrote:
Yes, Veshta.

Apparently you should adapt to the new FW in the same way Wolfsbrigade has; by creating Minnie militia Alts and running plexes in amarr held systems other than your own. Even seen Wolfsbrigade pilots helping their Minnie Alts to complete FW missions...


Posting with Alt = weak forum-fu.

Also : come at me bro!

NB. Oh and to clarify: anybody saying we're running minmatar plexes in amarr systems is a liar - and if you think we do, then come shoot 'us' in those plexes.
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#70 - 2012-06-15 15:43:47 UTC
FIRST GENERAL wrote:
It really wasn't a troll, honest! The point I was trying to make is that if you're given lemons by CCP are you going to be upset about the fact that you can't make Tequila Sunrises or are you going to be alongside me sitting on the beach sipping Margaritas along day long?

(Look up the drinks if you don't get the analogy)

What the hell would I want with girly drinks like that .. last I tried that sugar crap was as a teen (Reagan era), then I grew up and discovered micro-brewery products, single malts and aged dark sugar cane rum .. Smile

Problem with current system is that everyone are better off gaming the snot out of it rather than actually play the game .. now if CCP had used the brain they share they would have:
- Made missions only spawn in hostile systems, forces some very real decision for steamrollers/snowballs.
- Had diminishing returns built into the capture mechanics.
- Found some way to incentivize defensive plexing.
- Solved the "solo everything in bomber and/or frigate" issue.
- Etc.

But all that would require work whereas the solution we got was some database tweaks, a tick here and a figure changed there after which it was thrown into the pile of :Awesome: with no further work done.
Wan't proof? What FW got was 100% what was presented months prior at FF .. AND .. they are prepared/preparing to make massive sweeping changes and calling it iterations, a very clear indication that the original material had no real work put into it.

So no, adapting is not even on the table as far as I am concerned.


Jones Bones
Battle Toad Brigade
Ribbit.
#71 - 2012-06-15 18:14:18 UTC
You're not even in FW. Why are you posting here? This is honorable space warrior forum for bushido knights.

Go post in the peasant RP forums.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#72 - 2012-06-16 00:18:11 UTC
Jones Bones wrote:
You're not even in FW. Why are you posting here? This is honorable space warrior forum for bushido knights.

Go post in the peasant RP forums.

why are you in amarr militia? go back to being pirate scum.

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro

Stalking Mantis
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#73 - 2012-06-16 07:02:26 UTC
I am trying hard to keep my mouth shut.

Because if I really spoke my peace I would make more enemies within my corporation/militia than I care to have among people I consider my friends and current/former fleet mates.

But to sum it up I am extremely disappointed in my militia and they have no one to blame but themselves for what they are in.

Although I did like the 'sitting on a beach sipping tequila' analogy.

Reporting from the trenches sipping nothing but blood sweat and tears.

-Mantis

Amarr Liason Officer Extraordinare -->Check Out Amarrian Vengeance/Amarr FW History from 2011 to 2014 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=352629&find=unread