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Faction Warfare - why CCP NEED to fix plexing and NPCs

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Har Harrison
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2012-06-13 03:42:05 UTC
IbanezLaney wrote:
Har Harrison wrote:
ModeratedToSilence wrote:
Easy solution: Keep ganking them for easy kills and to earn your own LP. Eventually the risk will outweigh the reward.

Not when they warp out as soon as you come into the plex. They just log or move to another system and go again. This is the new version of the mission farming...


It's not like mission farming - Many FW missions are easier as there can be only 1 target to kill to complete the mission if the player knows which missions to pick and which to ignore.
Very easy to get in and out without being attacked.
Add to that 90% of the missions were done in Stealth Bombers so they could just cloak up and waste your time.
FW Missions did not provide PvP to those looking for it.


With a plex you know they are stuck there for a minimum of 10min.
This gives you the chance to get a fleet up and deny them the plexes almost everywhere they go - set up on the escape routes and catch them.
If they change system - follow and repeat.
The chances of pew have increased lots since the patch. I used to goto low sec and plex and not see anyone.
Now there is lots of fun and games while plexing.

You obviously haven't seen the new wave of minmitar LP farmers who are not there to pvp, just farm massive LP in a system that lets them buy ships for next to no LP. So in that sense, they ARE the new FW carebear mission runner who is just there to make ISK and not to do FW.
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#42 - 2012-06-13 03:44:55 UTC
Reinstituting NPC EWAR might help reduce this crap. I mean, seriously. What respectable military force doesn't use EWAR of some kind?

I predicted this exact thing would happen when I tried it on SiSi. And look what? FW plexes are being farmed for r3t4rded amounts of LP by noob alts in speed-fit rifters with no weapons.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#43 - 2012-06-13 04:37:45 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
Har Harrison wrote:
Still no comments from a dev on this... Nice to see their interest in FW and a BALANCED war for us to fight in...



CCP Soundwave wrote:

Why would I want to balance a fight? That's never really been the goal in EVE and the war dec system wasn't built for that either.


Honestly this exploight of using 8 day old speedtank alts if done for directly PvP purposes woulda got a BAN notice by CCP IMHO since its on the sly thru PvE although it affects PvP 'balance' which is not supported its got a hilariously sad responce. The smart peeps in Amarr FW are training Minitmar speedtanking alts to cash in right now before the CCP Inferno bug fire brigade throws a bucket of water instead of a bucket of fuel on top of it like they did originally.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
ISD Stensson
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#44 - 2012-06-13 04:59:26 UTC
Please keep in mind rules about pyramid quoting.

Quote:
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. Posts of this nature are not conducive to community spirit and are unwelcome.

[b]ISD Stensson Captain Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs) Interstellar Services Department[/b]
Jhango Fett
X-Zest Voyage
X - Z E S T
#45 - 2012-06-13 05:21:33 UTC
ISD Stensson wrote:
Please keep in mind rules about pyramid quoting.

Quote:
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. Posts of this nature are not conducive to community spirit and are unwelcome.



Makes it easier to follow, added spaces makes it easier to read and this is first I hear of it being unwelcome.

(You learn something new in EVE every day.)

Anyway, on topic and a bit off, how is FW VS running level 4s per hour now? I am curious.
Har Harrison
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#46 - 2012-06-13 05:46:50 UTC
ISD Stensson wrote:
Please keep in mind rules about pyramid quoting.

Quote:
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. Posts of this nature are not conducive to community spirit and are unwelcome.

Where was the Pyramid quoting? Forums prevent too many nested quote levels and all the posts I see have reasonable spacing to make them readable rather than a wall of text.

ISD posting an off topic quote that is not related to the OP is more unwelcome IMHO...
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#47 - 2012-06-13 07:12:04 UTC
It's a very thin line. Plexes instigate PvP. You don't want the npc's to be so difficult that they inhibit it when a WT actually does show up. At the same time weaponless rifter a are ridiculous.

1) ewar is slated to be removed from plexes
2) one suggestion out there that is brutally simple is to have to kill the rats to move the plexes timer down.
3) divorce the two war fronts. You should only get lp for services on your own front.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#48 - 2012-06-13 07:17:56 UTC
seriously, no one thinks that having two buttons and rats that need to be killed before the second button appareas (or a gate is unlocked to another stage where a second button is) is a good idea?

I do :)

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#49 - 2012-06-13 10:06:22 UTC
Har Harrison wrote:
ISD Stensson wrote:
Please keep in mind rules about pyramid quoting.

Quote:
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. Posts of this nature are not conducive to community spirit and are unwelcome.

Where was the Pyramid quoting? Forums prevent too many nested quote levels and all the posts I see have reasonable spacing to make them readable rather than a wall of text.

ISD posting an off topic quote that is not related to the OP is more unwelcome IMHO...


At least it means that someone at CCP has been following the thread.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Vyktor Abyss
Abyss Research
#50 - 2012-06-13 10:31:52 UTC
You guys need to read the forums more/better.

It was stated in Dopified's Warfare and Tactics thread by CCP that they will be balancing the NPCs "soon". The first step is removing the racial E-war.

Try to keep up before you whine.

PS - I agree its daft they didn't sort out NPCs before releasing the FW changes. Really daft.
Har Harrison
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2012-06-13 10:44:21 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Har Harrison wrote:
ISD Stensson wrote:
Please keep in mind rules about pyramid quoting.

Quote:
Pyramid quoting is a response to a forum thread that contains the quotes of four or more previous posters, sometimes with additional spaces added unnecessarily. Posts of this nature are not conducive to community spirit and are unwelcome.

Where was the Pyramid quoting? Forums prevent too many nested quote levels and all the posts I see have reasonable spacing to make them readable rather than a wall of text.

ISD posting an off topic quote that is not related to the OP is more unwelcome IMHO...


At least it means that someone at CCP has been following the thread.

Not really. ISD are volunteers. They don't work for CCP. CCP is just outsourcing forum moderation to some of the community
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#52 - 2012-06-13 10:54:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Mutnin
ModeratedToSilence wrote:
Har Harrison wrote:



How many systems do they own? Lots. They can take an offensive plex easier than we can - That means you can have more offensive opportunities than them

How many of them are empty? No idea - fighting on the front line When your enemy has you out numbered and out gunned you need to change tactics

How come you are not doing the same to them? We can't AFK a major in a rifter due to the amount of incoming MISSILE damage from TARGET PAINTING NPCs... That point is valid all the pesky gallente do is sensor damp




If I were in Amarr right at this very moment I would be in Aset/Turnir round that very quiet area gradually lifting the contention level.



I've suggested that to Amarr guys on the forums many times.. In fact I have an alt in Amarr that I sometimes log on.. I stuck him down in Brin area and started running a 4 system loop of minors. By the time I made my round to the 4th system I got a fight.

Few days later I did it again, and got a fight after the 2nd plex. If they want to attack & capture systems they should be hitting the back end systems where the farmers wont bother going.

The problem is while yes both Caldari & Minmatar can run plexes easier, the bulk of the whines about it being unfair are because they want to just easily farm plexes as well. It's not that they can't get PVP, but they want PVE made easier.

If you want PVP.. Then you choose the right ship for the size plex you intend to run and you go run it and you kill the NPC's. If you want to play farmvile & warzone control you go play PVE with alts.. At least that's what seem to be the general trends and what FW has now become.
Lexmana
#53 - 2012-06-13 12:13:38 UTC
Mutnin wrote:
The problem is while yes both Caldari & Minmatar can run plexes easier, the bulk of the whines about it being unfair are because they want to just easily farm plexes as well. It's not that they can't get PVP, but they want PVE made easier

No. You miss the point. But make them easier is what CCP is planning to do by removing e-war. The most popular fix presented by players is to enforce killing all NPCs to capture a plex. Thats not making PVE easier for farmer alts now is it?
Har Harrison
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2012-06-13 12:35:36 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
Mutnin wrote:
The problem is while yes both Caldari & Minmatar can run plexes easier, the bulk of the whines about it being unfair are because they want to just easily farm plexes as well. It's not that they can't get PVP, but they want PVE made easier

No. You miss the point. But make them easier is what CCP is planning to do by removing e-war. The most popular fix presented by players is to enforce killing all NPCs to capture a plex. Thats not making PVE easier for farmer alts now is it?

Someone who gets it.

Amarr don't want the plexes made easier for US. We want them made HARDER for the Minmitar, coming in line with what we face!!!
Yogsoloth
Call of Cuthulu
#55 - 2012-06-13 12:52:39 UTC
Someone suggested this already, but I'd like to see timers run back up once people leave the plex.

Force people to stay fight for their reward, instead of running to the next empty plex all day long, only to circle back when the system is clear.
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#56 - 2012-06-13 14:32:40 UTC
The problem is the Amarr want to sit in their home systems and just PvP on stations and gates with carrier support and little risk of losing ships, and unlike the frogs, they haven't figured out that this isn't going to work in FW anymore. So now they must ***** because they have to actually move around and dare I say it, PvEww.

There is a reason that the Cal/Gal front is balanced, it's because we both go out and roam around plexing and PvPing. The Amarr don't do that and honestly how they are unable to stop offensive plexers is proof that they don't roam because they only own like 10 systems...How can you not stop people from plexing in so few systems? Honestly if the Amarr really wanted to **** of the minnies I would start making minny alts and just take all of the remaining Amarr systems so that the only place they could plex is in the Cal/Gal front. See how much they like missile spam and SeBo arty Thrashers abound.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Lexmana
#57 - 2012-06-13 14:52:03 UTC
Schalac wrote:
The problem is the Amarr want to sit in their home systems and just PvP on stations and gates with carrier support and little risk of losing ships,

And where did you make up that information? We have welped 2.5k ships this month so far.
Schalac
Apocalypse Reign
#58 - 2012-06-13 15:21:26 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
Schalac wrote:
The problem is the Amarr want to sit in their home systems and just PvP on stations and gates with carrier support and little risk of losing ships,

And where did you make up that information? We have welped 2.5k ships this month so far.

Fweddit is an anomaly in the Amarr scene. You guys are slowly bringing Amarr out of the funk it's in, credit due, but the rest of the militia...

Honestly, I see your best course of action, and that is seppuku. Let all the Amarr systems get taken, take part with minny alts if necessary. Let the LP fountain run dry and force CCP to look at NPC balancing. At the same time it forces minny pilots to do Cal plexes and those can't be done as easy as Amarr.

SCHALAC HAS SPOKEN!! http://eveboard.com/pilot/Schalac
Bronnwynn
Gradient
Electus Matari
#59 - 2012-06-13 15:29:57 UTC
This is not quite as cut-and-dry as you make it seem. The Amarr can camp our stations in high sec with much more impunity, and have a more favorable resist profile when attacking. To be honest, what should be done is to have no EW or the same EW, and omni resist/damage profiles in plexes. It shouldn't be preferred to be one race over another, in what you fly or what you face.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#60 - 2012-06-13 15:58:10 UTC
IbanezLaney wrote:
It's not like mission farming -
It's worse! Big smile

Seriously,they are the same in that the farmer can bail with little to no consequences. They just move on to next mission/plex a few jumps away. Then they come back after the "griefer" gets bored and goes looking elsewhere for targets.

There should be a way for the "griefer" to win other than staying to cap a plex with no chance of a fight, or camping a mission forever.