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I think its time to take a vacation..
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King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#81 - 2012-06-02 14:00:21 UTC

Quote:

Where exactly did you get 23k from? Because looking at the graphs I see an average of 38k every single weekend. The only time it drops down to 23k is around 4am GMT during the week, which is hardly a surprise. As for the drop of around 5k players in the last month or so, that is something that happens about the same time every year.


You cant look at recent graphs as they have raw data. The bottom graph of all time history does a running daily average. If you look on the far left part of the graph you see a VERY noticeable downturn in the last 3 weeks. Hover your mouse over and you will see daily averages in the 23k to 26k range for the last half of May.

Total online at any given data point is not relevant, total average for a given day is. And any time you have a Sunday with an average below 30k you can without reasonable doubt say that the player base simply is not logging in.
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din
Commonwealth Vanguard
#82 - 2012-06-02 14:04:02 UTC
Musashi IV wrote:
Yesterday one of my hulks got killed by 7 ships in in hi sec. All of these players had a security rating of -8 or worse. Im very cautious when I mine but you cant hide a Hulk very easily. Normally the high-sec game mechanics work pretty good. CCP has allowed Goonswarm to circumvent these game mechanics. Yes I know this is a sandbox but if someone is circumventing the game mechanics, its an exploit. Im not going to plead proverty. I have enouph ISK to play my three accounts for several more years. Why should I if game mechanics allow 7 players with a security rating less than -8 to play in high-sec with emmunity. When CCP has returned hi-sec to more reasonable game play I will return.

I think all high-sec players should think about taking a vacation from EVE. The only thing CCP cares about is monitary loss. This is the only way high-sec players can get thier attention.

Pirates that want my stuff can meet me in Jita at 1930 hours on Saturday.



I agree, Hisec should be returned to its previous state. Take it back to the old days when there was NO CONCORD.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#83 - 2012-06-02 14:04:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Cutter Isaacson
King Aires wrote:

Quote:

Where exactly did you get 23k from? Because looking at the graphs I see an average of 38k every single weekend. The only time it drops down to 23k is around 4am GMT during the week, which is hardly a surprise. As for the drop of around 5k players in the last month or so, that is something that happens about the same time every year.


You cant look at recent graphs as they have raw data. The bottom graph of all time history does a running daily average. If you look on the far left part of the graph you see a VERY noticeable downturn in the last 3 weeks. Hover your mouse over and you will see daily averages in the 23k to 26k range for the last half of May.

Total online at any given data point is not relevant, total average for a given day is. And any time you have a Sunday with an average below 30k you can without reasonable doubt say that the player base simply is not logging in.



Now look at the averages over the last few weeks in the graphs near the top of the page, specifically the dates running from the 14th to 31st of May, and note the TIMES when the users numbers dropped to those levels. The major drop off starts at around midnight GMT, which for most of Europe is around 1-3am, hardly a surprise you get a drop off at that time of the morning, and it then continues right through until downtime, also hardly a surprise.

If you are going to quote figures, at least bother to check the context of those figures.

EDIT: It should also be noted that there have been national holidays, new games being released and many bot's banned in that time frame as well. Also, the last date on the bottom graph is the 24th of May, which is a Thursday. Traditionally EVE is busiest at the weekends.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#84 - 2012-06-02 14:07:25 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
King Aires wrote:

Quote:

Where exactly did you get 23k from? Because looking at the graphs I see an average of 38k every single weekend. The only time it drops down to 23k is around 4am GMT during the week, which is hardly a surprise. As for the drop of around 5k players in the last month or so, that is something that happens about the same time every year.


You cant look at recent graphs as they have raw data. The bottom graph of all time history does a running daily average. If you look on the far left part of the graph you see a VERY noticeable downturn in the last 3 weeks. Hover your mouse over and you will see daily averages in the 23k to 26k range for the last half of May.

Total online at any given data point is not relevant, total average for a given day is. And any time you have a Sunday with an average below 30k you can without reasonable doubt say that the player base simply is not logging in.



Now look at the averages over the last few weeks in the graphs near the top of the page, specifically the dates running from the 14th to 31st of May, and note the TIMES when the users numbers dropped to those levels. The major drop off starts at around midnight GMT, which for most of Europe is around 1-3am, hardly a surprise you get a drop off at that time of the morning, and it then continues right through until downtime, also hardly a surprise.

If you are going to quote figures, at least bother to check the context of those figures.


Dude, averages are averages... doesnt matter if 150k players log in for 15 minutes at one time if there are 0 players logged in the rest of the day.

Those top graphs are not averages, they are raw figures taken at specific points in the day, and even the peaks are lower than they were.

Learn to read graphs 5th grade style then come back here and use big boy forum pvp.
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#85 - 2012-06-02 14:10:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Cutter Isaacson
King Aires wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
King Aires wrote:

Quote:

Where exactly did you get 23k from? Because looking at the graphs I see an average of 38k every single weekend. The only time it drops down to 23k is around 4am GMT during the week, which is hardly a surprise. As for the drop of around 5k players in the last month or so, that is something that happens about the same time every year.


You cant look at recent graphs as they have raw data. The bottom graph of all time history does a running daily average. If you look on the far left part of the graph you see a VERY noticeable downturn in the last 3 weeks. Hover your mouse over and you will see daily averages in the 23k to 26k range for the last half of May.

Total online at any given data point is not relevant, total average for a given day is. And any time you have a Sunday with an average below 30k you can without reasonable doubt say that the player base simply is not logging in.



Now look at the averages over the last few weeks in the graphs near the top of the page, specifically the dates running from the 14th to 31st of May, and note the TIMES when the users numbers dropped to those levels. The major drop off starts at around midnight GMT, which for most of Europe is around 1-3am, hardly a surprise you get a drop off at that time of the morning, and it then continues right through until downtime, also hardly a surprise.

If you are going to quote figures, at least bother to check the context of those figures.


Dude, averages are averages... doesnt matter if 150k players log in for 15 minutes at one time if there are 0 players logged in the rest of the day.

Those top graphs are not averages, they are raw figures taken at specific points in the day, and even the peaks are lower than they were.

Learn to read graphs 5th grade style then come back here and use big boy forum pvp.



As I pointed out in my rather hasty edit above, learn to understand influencing factors when checking data. Data can be influenced by any number of factors, most of which are fairly simple to determine when you have access to a plethora of sources via the World Wide Web. Reading a graph is only a very small part of analysing a situation, as you and others of your ilk seem only too ready to point out.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Plaude Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#86 - 2012-06-02 14:11:42 UTC
gfldex wrote:
Musashi IV wrote:
Yesterday one of my hulks got killed by 7 ships in in hi sec.


That's a contradiction to:

Musashi IV wrote:
I have enouph ISK to play my three accounts for several more years.


If you have 100B in the bank you don't mine. (Unless you are a botter ofc.)

It never occured to you that some people use mining as a way to relax while doing something productive? Go back to the little hole in the middle of nowhere you come from, or learn to think twice before posting half-thoughtout sentences.

New to EVE? Want to learn? The Crimson Cartel will train you in the fields of _**your **_choice. Mainly active in EU afternoons and evenings. Contact me for more info.
Sverige Pahis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#87 - 2012-06-02 14:14:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Sverige Pahis
Quartzlight Evenstar Icefluxor wrote:
Musashi IV wrote:


I think all high-sec players should think about taking a vacation from EVE. The only thing CCP cares about is monitary loss. This is the only way high-sec players can get thier attention.




(tick tick tick tick) 2 accounts with 15 days left. 2 already dead. Done and done.


The irony of your sig now hehe

quoted for posterity:

Quote:
Ohh poor silly goon chillrens. Nobody in high sec cares about your plans to occupy jita like a bunch of dirty hippies.
"....as if 10,058 Goon voices cried out and were suddenly silenced."


Love it
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#88 - 2012-06-02 14:18:05 UTC
To King Aires,

I should like to make it clear that I do not deny that there has been a drop in the average number of people logging in, all that I disagree on is the exact cause of that drop. Most people discussing this subject seem only to focus on possible in game reasons, and seem utterly unwilling or incapable of even entertaining the prospect that outside influences are also at work here.

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
King Aires
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#89 - 2012-06-02 14:29:44 UTC
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
To King Aires,

I should like to make it clear that I do not deny that there has been a drop in the average number of people logging in, all that I disagree on is the exact cause of that drop. Most people discussing this subject seem only to focus on possible in game reasons, and seem utterly unwilling or incapable of even entertaining the prospect that outside influences are also at work here.



Ok I can accept that. I also accept that I have no idea why people are not logging in. Summer? Inventory BS? Hulkageddon? Economy?

At the end of the day however, I have the rather strong opinion that what is going on in highsec and the manipulation of markets is hurting this game's RL potential and not just nerd raging a bunch of pixel addicted game characters.
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#90 - 2012-06-02 14:30:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Darth Tickles
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
I should like to make it clear that I do not deny that there has been a drop in the average number of people logging in, all that I disagree on is the exact cause of that drop. Most people discussing this subject seem only to focus on possible in game reasons, and seem utterly unwilling or incapable of even entertaining the prospect that outside influences are also at work here.


Or other in game reasons besides the particular one that has their panties in a bunch...or a combination of ingame and out of game reasons...or a statistical aberration...

As I've said before, Incarna is proof that ingame changes can drastically affect pcu and subs, but let's save the chicken-little song and dance for when that is clearly happening. Then we can discuss possible causes and offer corresponding solutions.

"Eve is dying because somebody blew up my hulk" arguments are just stupid.
Wilma Lawson
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#91 - 2012-06-02 14:35:05 UTC
Cutter Isaacson
DEDSEC SAN FRANCISCO
#92 - 2012-06-02 14:40:26 UTC
Darth Tickles wrote:
Cutter Isaacson wrote:
I should like to make it clear that I do not deny that there has been a drop in the average number of people logging in, all that I disagree on is the exact cause of that drop. Most people discussing this subject seem only to focus on possible in game reasons, and seem utterly unwilling or incapable of even entertaining the prospect that outside influences are also at work here.


Or other in game reasons besides the particular one that has their panties in a bunch...or a combination of ingame and out of game reasons...or a statistical aberration...

As I've said before, Incarna is proof that ingame changes can drastically affect concurrent pcu and subs, but let's save the chicken-little song and dance for when that is clearly happening. Then we can discuss possible causes and offer corresponding solutions.

"Eve is dying because somebody blew up my hulk" arguments are just stupid.


Hmm, I'm pretty sure I've argued with you over this at some point, but it seems as if we are actually in agreement. I love days like these Cool

"The truth is usually just an excuse for a lack of imagination." Elim Garak.
Alexandra Delarge
The Korova
#93 - 2012-06-02 14:59:32 UTC
Ten Bulls wrote:
gfldex wrote:

If you have 100B in the bank you don't mine. (Unless you are a botter ofc.)


Unless you enjoy mining ofc.

Nah, gfldex was right. The OP is a botter.

I use Bots *1

Botting is no different to scamming.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#94 - 2012-06-02 15:08:46 UTC
Ituhata Saken wrote:

While I don't agree with the wording of it, I am a firm believer in voting with your wallet. Even if it does nothing, at the end of the day, you're not paying for a product you aren't happy with. Now if it turns out the player subs drop like a rock, then its up to you to find like-minded players to fill the gap and keep the game you love alive. P


Good luck with that.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#95 - 2012-06-02 15:19:39 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:

Look at every summer before this one. EvE has an easily noticeable summer slump. An April-May bubble followed by a June-August trough.

We're finally hitting that trough.


Certainly this shows how year after year they can take huge costs for half a year, deliver a free expansion (so no entry barrier) yet lose a metric ton of player just few days later. This new content is compelling!

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#96 - 2012-06-02 15:22:16 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:

Look at every summer before this one. EvE has an easily noticeable summer slump. An April-May bubble followed by a June-August trough.

We're finally hitting that trough.


Certainly this shows how year after year they can take huge costs for half a year, deliver a free expansion (so no entry barrier) yet lose a metric ton of player just few days later. This new content is compelling!


The summer online pop slump does not indicate lapsed subs.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#97 - 2012-06-02 15:27:47 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:

The summer online pop slump does not indicate lapsed subs.


How many use multi-month subs? How many of those won't let subs lapse in the couple of dead months of the year?


Rico Minali wrote:


I agree, Hisec should be returned to its previous state. Take it back to the old days when there was NO CONCORD.


QFT, hi sec is one of the saddest implementations in the gaming industry, expecially for a self patting hard mode PvP MMO.

They may as well create EvE 2.0 using some of my suggestions listed here.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#98 - 2012-06-02 15:31:19 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:

The summer online pop slump does not indicate lapsed subs.


How many use multi-month subs? How many of those won't let subs lapse in the couple of dead months of the year?


SP is a hell of a drug.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Chokichi Ozuwara
Perkone
Caldari State
#99 - 2012-06-02 15:43:14 UTC
gfldex wrote:
If you have 100B in the bank you don't mine. (Unless you are a botter ofc.)

Someone should tell Chribba that.

Tears will be shed and pants will need to be changed all round.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#100 - 2012-06-02 15:50:08 UTC
Quartzlight Evenstar Icefluxor wrote:
Low sec and WH combined make up only 13% of the pop. Null is 20%.

http://scaurus.com/lowsec-by-the-numbers/

No thanks for your random Fantasy Facts.


I did say people, not bots.

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