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CCP should refund Hulk training points

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Bunnie Hop
Bunny Knights
#81 - 2012-05-30 16:22:27 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Bunnie Hop wrote:
It wasn't a demand in any form.
Uh-huh…

“If you want to force people into Rokhs, refund their points and let them put them into it instead.”

Just because it was based on a flawed and uninformed premise doesn't make it any less of a demand.

It's silly because all kinds of “sp remap/refund” requests are silly to begin with and because of that flawed premise. There is absolutely no reason CCP should give you something because of something players decide to do, and there is definitely no reason why they should give you any SP back.


I wasn't suggesting it for myself as I have no points in those skills. Well we disagree, lets leave it at that, no sense in this becoming more than a disagreement.
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
#82 - 2012-05-30 16:23:16 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
silens vesica wrote:
Good Lord.
Roll

Every day, I find myself thinking more and more like a Goon.
It's threads like this that push me that way....

You're falling to the dark side.

Soon you'll be looking at a list of Catalysts with shiny blasters ... and it'll come naturally to you.
You know... I *have* been collecting a lot of blasters lately.

Hmmm...

Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.

Didn't vote? Then you voted for NulBloc
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#83 - 2012-05-30 16:23:37 UTC
The Rokh is decent PvP if you use.. BLASTERS !! Big smile

BlasterRokh, go get some killmails !

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#84 - 2012-05-30 16:25:11 UTC
Twulf wrote:
EvE is anything but a Sandbox, it has some Sandbox elements but it is not a true sandbox, not even close.
Oh really? What keeps it from being a sandbox?
silens vesica
Corsair Cartel
#85 - 2012-05-30 16:27:06 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Twulf wrote:
EvE is anything but a Sandbox, it has some Sandbox elements but it is not a true sandbox, not even close.
Oh really? What keeps it from being a sandbox?

No swingsets or jungle bars.

Tell someone you love them today, because life is short. But scream it at them in Esperanto, because life is also terrifying and confusing.

Didn't vote? Then you voted for NulBloc
Myz Toyou
Nekkid Inc.
#86 - 2012-05-30 16:28:22 UTC
If all the crybabies would spend the same time searching for alternatives/solutions/reskilling as they spend here whining to CCP to take care of their sore buttes, they already would:

- fly a tanked Hulk
- fly a Covertor
- mine in a BS
- moved in to 0.0 or WH space

I feel sorry for you and your lack of will to adapt.
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
#87 - 2012-05-30 16:32:06 UTC
HAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA, you act like you have a RIGHT to WIN Eve.

Grow up and stop taking it so seriously, why do you play a game you obviously are not enjoying?

Eve is a game about taking risks and MAYBE getting rewarded.

Not fun? Well, why on earth did you subscribe in the first place, didn't you read the product description?

You are nothing more than a spoiled brat.
Twulf
Thunder Clap Industry
#88 - 2012-05-30 16:56:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Twulf
Tippia wrote:
Twulf wrote:
EvE is anything but a Sandbox, it has some Sandbox elements but it is not a true sandbox, not even close.
Oh really? What keeps it from being a sandbox?


The fact that you cannot do what you want to do when you want to do it.

Example, My corp had been war dec for the last couple of weeks and I wanted to move some stuff around and do some missions but since High Sec is not safe during a War, I spend the last 2 weeks in Null running Anom's. Not what I wanted to be doing but what I was forced to due based on how EVE works.

A Sandbox allows players to play the game how they want, when they want. Just because its an MMO game, does not change what a Sandbox is. EvE has sandbox elements but it is not a true Sandbox.

Also so of you VETs point out that players that play in High sec only are "Not playing EVE correctly" which is another sign that EVE is not a Sandbox as in a Sandbox, there is no wrong way to play.

Last point, in a Sandbox, I could equip and fly any ship anyway I pleased, you cannot do that in EVE due to the game design, not a true Sandbox.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#89 - 2012-05-30 17:21:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Twulf wrote:
The fact that you cannot do what you want to do when you want to do it.
For one, you can — you're just not ensured of success.
For another, that doesn't particularly keep it from being a sandbox.

To quote something Malcanis wrote a few days back: “‘sandbox’ doesn't mean ‘I get to succeed at whatever I feel like attempting’, it means that ‘I get to attempt whatever I want to succeed at’.”

Quote:
Example, My corp had been war dec for the last couple of weeks and I wanted to move some stuff around and do some missions but since High Sec is not safe during a War, I spend the last 2 weeks in Null running Anom's. Not what I wanted to be doing but what I was forced to due based on how EVE works.
That's a particularly bad example because it doesn't demonstrate that you can't “do what you want to do when you want to do it” (which is a rubbish definition of a sandbox anyway). No, you weren't forced. You chose to do that.

Quote:
A Sandbox allows players to play the game how they want, when they want.
You're missing a very important detail: it's a multiplayer sandbox, and adding that crucial “multiplayer” pre-modifier does indeed drastically change what a sandbox is.

In a multiplayer sandbox, you can't do what you want — everyone can do what they want, which can and will include things that you do not want them to do (to you). Moreover, that is not what it means to be a sandbox. Being a sandbox means that the game doesn't really come with any pre-defined gameplay but rather gives the player(s) tools to create their own content and then lets them do what they want with those tools. Also, being a sandbox doesn't mean there are no limits (that would be something more akin to a desert). The toolset itself is limited, and there are limits to what each tool will let you do with it — the sandbox part is what you can do within (and in spite of) those limits.

EVE does exactly that: it gives the players tools and it gives everyone those tools tools. It doesn't discriminate and let you separate yourself from the sandbox by giving you different tools, but rather lets everyone affect everyone with said same set of tools. It is as true a sandbox as you'll ever find.

Quote:
Last point, in a Sandbox, I could equip and fly any ship anyway I pleased
Good news: you can. The game provides you with every tool required to make that happen, and then it's up to you to do so.
Logan LaMort
Screaming Hayabusa
#90 - 2012-05-30 17:26:18 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Twulf wrote:
The fact that you cannot do what you want to do when you want to do it.
For one, you can — you're just not ensured of success.
For another, that doesn't particularly keep it from being a sandbox.

To quote something Malcanis wrote a few days back: “‘sandbox’ doesn't mean ‘I get to succeed at whatever I feel like attempting’, it means that ‘I get to attempt whatever I want to succeed at’.”

Quote:
Example, My corp had been war dec for the last couple of weeks and I wanted to move some stuff around and do some missions but since High Sec is not safe during a War, I spend the last 2 weeks in Null running Anom's. Not what I wanted to be doing but what I was forced to due based on how EVE works.
That's a particularly bad example because it doesn't demonstrate that you can't “do what you want to do when you want to do it” (which is a rubbish definition of a sandbox anyway). No, you weren't forced. You chose to do that.

Quote:
A Sandbox allows players to play the game how they want, when they want.
You're missing a very important detail: it's a multiplayer sandbox, and adding that crucial “multiplayer” pre-modifier does indeed drastically change what a sandbox is.

In a multiplayer sandbox, you can't do what you want — everyone can do what they want, which can and will include things that you do not want them to do (to you). Moreover, that is not what it means to be a sandbox. Being a sandbox means that the game doesn't really come with any pre-defined gameplay but rather gives the player(s) tools to create their own content and then lets them do what they want with those tools.

EVE does exactly that: it gives the players tools. It gives everyone tools. It doesn't discriminate and let you separate yourself from the sandbox, but rather lets everyone affect everyone with said tools. It is as true a sandbox as you'll ever find.

Quote:
Last point, in a Sandbox, I could equip and fly any ship anyway I pleased
Good news: you can. The game provides you with every tool required to make that happen, and then it's up to you to do so.


Exactly what I wanted to say.
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
#91 - 2012-05-30 17:31:00 UTC
You should go back and read the product / service description that you subscribed to.

It is not the game service you THINK it is.


Mummy Online -> this way.
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
#92 - 2012-05-30 17:32:10 UTC
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
#93 - 2012-05-30 17:34:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Miilla
Twulf wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Twulf wrote:
EvE is anything but a Sandbox, it has some Sandbox elements but it is not a true sandbox, not even close.
Oh really? What keeps it from being a sandbox?


The fact that you cannot do what you want to do when you want to do it.

Example, My corp had been war dec for the last couple of weeks and I wanted to move some stuff around and do some missions but since High Sec is not safe during a War, I spend the last 2 weeks in Null running Anom's. Not what I wanted to be doing but what I was forced to due based on how EVE works.

A Sandbox allows players to play the game how they want, when they want. Just because its an MMO game, does not change what a Sandbox is. EvE has sandbox elements but it is not a true Sandbox.

Also so of you VETs point out that players that play in High sec only are "Not playing EVE correctly" which is another sign that EVE is not a Sandbox as in a Sandbox, there is no wrong way to play.

Last point, in a Sandbox, I could equip and fly any ship anyway I pleased, you cannot do that in EVE due to the game design, not a true Sandbox.


https://gate.eveonline.com/Profile/Twulf

From your own BIo.

Quote:
Call Sign: Twulf
Death is not something one should fear, for it Death will come when it decides you have wasted enough time.


And here you are crying about a sandbox and not being able to do what you want when you want it :)


Embarassed much? I would be too with a bio like that and posts like the above :)
EvilweaselSA
GoonCorp
Goonswarm Federation
#94 - 2012-05-30 17:36:41 UTC
Twulf wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Twulf wrote:
EvE is anything but a Sandbox, it has some Sandbox elements but it is not a true sandbox, not even close.
Oh really? What keeps it from being a sandbox?


The fact that you cannot do what you want to do when you want to do it.

but what i want to do is kill you and hang your corpse from my ship

clearly, a "sandbox" game in the way you imagine it is logically impossible in a multi-player game

so obviously you're completely wrong dictionary boy
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#95 - 2012-05-30 17:40:25 UTC
Miilla wrote:
You should buy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/X%C2%B3:_Reunion

That is all.
…if only they got rid of the out-of-sector nonsense, the auto-pillock, and the artificial stupidity. Cry
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#96 - 2012-05-30 17:41:23 UTC
sandbox
Miilla
Hulkageddon Orphanage
#97 - 2012-05-30 17:42:49 UTC
Lyron-Baktos wrote:
sandbox


I can see why the sandbox is failing,, all the water ruining the sand and sandcastles.
Alua Oresson
Aegis Ascending
Solyaris Chtonium
#98 - 2012-05-30 18:06:18 UTC
Bunnie Hop wrote:
Since CCP is releasing Mittani and his bøsser boys upon high sec miners, they should let those miners have the option to have skill points refunded so that they can go do something else or fly a battleship while mining. It seems to me that many people have months of paid training time for a ship they can not safely use anymore (Not me, I never flew one). If you want to force people into Rokhs, refund their points and let them put them into it instead.


I think I will do something novel and respond seriously to your suggestion. Your suggestion, if implemented, would set a precedent that would force CCP into refunding skill-points whenever a significant event occurred. There are many changes that occurred in the past that would merit the refund of skill-points.


  1. Drone bay and amount nerf (Suddenly Thoraxes can't fit 5 Heavy drones): refund drone and gallente ship skill-points down to the frigate level.
  2. Nano Nerf (Vagabonds can now not travel at insanely fast speeds with faction MWDs: refund Minmatar Cruiser, HAC, AS skills, refund any money invested in Vagabonds.
  3. Super Capital Nerf (Super Carriers can no longer use drones, Titans nerfed, Super Cap HPs nerfed): refund all skillpoints related to Super Capital ships


The problem with your suggestion is that there has been no balance change by CCP to Hulks. This is a reaction to how people play the game have changed things up. Eve is a game of consequences. Every action you take can have huge ramifications to you. You live with the consequences of your choices. That is what makes Eve so special. There are no do overs. If you do something or someone does something to you that completely bankrupts you then you are bankrupt, there is no getting that money back because you don't like it. It's that risk of losing it all that makes this game so wonderful, so addictive.

I like my consequences, please keep them.

FYI: I personally have near perfect Hulk skills that I never use, this change would be a HUGE influx of sp's that I no longer use.

http://pvpwannabe.blogspot.com/
Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#99 - 2012-05-30 18:14:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Simetraz
Bunnie Hop wrote:
Since CCP is releasing Mittani and his bøsser boys upon high sec miners, they should let those miners have the option to have skill points refunded so that they can go do something else or fly a battleship while mining. It seems to me that many people have months of paid training time for a ship they can not safely use anymore (Not me, I never flew one). If you want to force people into Rokhs, refund their points and let them put them into it instead.


Now that is funny.
Despite the number of threads out on both sides.
I believe most of us are only half serious and half trolling at this point.

And asking for SP's back, well even when CCP nerfed things into the ground they never gave skill points back.

And despite the the threads that state EVE is hurting because there are no minerals being mined.
Well the market says otherwise (for how much longer hard to say).

Bottom line people are still mining in Hulk's

And if CCP start seeing Issues with the market.
Well they can always use my solution (see sig)

EVERYBODY KNOWS
Grohl Dovah
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#100 - 2012-05-30 18:21:35 UTC
seany1212 wrote:
Bunnie Hop wrote:
Since CCP is releasing Mittani and his bøsser boys upon high sec miners, they should let those miners have the option to have skill points refunded so that they can go do something else or fly a battleship while mining. It seems to me that many people have months of paid training time for a ship they can not safely use anymore (Not me, I never flew one). If you want to force people into Rokhs, refund their points and let them put them into it instead.


I heard CCP give your skillpoints back if you biomass Shocked



you sir are evil heheheTwisted