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EVE Alliance Tournament Discussion

 
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The crickets slumber while the tumbleweeds roll by

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Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-05-30 09:40:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Cody Zamorah
For days now a lot of people asked some valid questions.

After removing a lof of blue posts CCP decided it's better to remain in silent instead of answering the questions asked.
This isn't the lines of communication promised by CCP.
How far do things have to get out of hand before we get exactly that what was promised in the passt?
Howmany forum bans down the line will be sufficient to douse the flame of indignation but finally sets off a bigger blaze?

It's absurd to think that everything will just go away by just ignoring it. I for one will not ignore it and I hope to see more people get vocal about this.
Screegs who was quit forward in his replies, up to a point that we could see a side which wasn't really in line with CCP, then his posts got deleted for the biggest part.
Is this the kind of communication we bargained for?

Is the community just going to do the sit down and accept it again thing as they do for most of the time?
Or are people slowly getting aware that the point of acceptance has been crossed and we, as paying customers, insist on abiding of the promises made by CCP in the passt as something they have to uphold.

Let the roar for communication slowly grow in volume untill it's so loud even the deaf can hear it.
Wheedily
Megaton Inc.
#2 - 2012-05-30 09:49:10 UTC
Cody Zamorah wrote:
For days now a lot of people asked some valid questions.

After removing a lof of blue posts CCP decided it's better to remain in silent instead of answering the questions asked.
This isn't the lines of communication promised by CCP.
How far do thing have to get out of hand before we get exactly that what was promised in the passt?
Howmany forum bans down the line will be sufficient to douse the flame of indignation sets off a bigger blaze?

It's absurd to think that everything will just go away by just ignoring it. I for one will not ignore it amd I hope to see more people get vocal about this.
Screegs who was quit forward in his replies, up to a point that we could see a side which wasn't really in line with CCP, then his posts got deleted for the biggest part.
Is this the kind of communication we bargained for?

Is the community just going to do the sit down and accept it again thing as they do for most of the time?
Or are people slowly getting aware that the point of acceptance has been crossed and we, as paying customers, insist on abiding of the promises made by CCP in the passt as something they have to uphold.

Let the roar for communication slowly grow in volume untill it's so loud even the deaf can hear it.


Amen.

Blahblah
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#3 - 2012-05-30 09:52:03 UTC
Cool story bro
Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-05-30 10:14:14 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro


Did I ask to be trolled?
Is this the extend of a Dev's reply?
Is this all a customer can expect?
Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#5 - 2012-05-30 10:23:40 UTC
Please stay on topic without trolling, flaming etc.

Only way to get answers is to stay on topic without derailing it into yet another flame war.
Chekxxx
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-05-30 10:31:01 UTC
Cody Zamorah wrote:
Please stay on topic without trolling, flaming etc.

Only way to get answers is to stay on topic without derailing it into yet another flame war.


You seem to have proven your point. Only eve-search will know... :P

That being said, full support to the OP question.
Qlfon
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-05-30 11:18:26 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro


What type of ******** answer is that to own customers?
Suitonia
Order of the Red Kestrel
#8 - 2012-05-30 11:44:57 UTC
This is lotka.org not the eve online tournament forums m8

Contributer to Eve is Easy:  https://www.youtube.com/user/eveiseasy/videos

Solo PvP is possible with a 20 day old character! :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvOB4KXYk-o
Hroya
#9 - 2012-05-30 12:01:42 UTC
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro


Here's another one "bro".

The way you guys (2?) acted these past few days, your highly constructive interaction with the playerbase, the removal and not owning up to your own trolling was the reason why i unsubbed.
I couldnt care less for any shennanigans and bad booboo play going on in the game. I do have problems with selfentiteled smartasses who think they are better then anyone else. Put such people in a position of power and it's becomes very very hard trying to defend their actions or plea to reason when **** hits the fan.

My subs dont matter the slightest i know so keep up the good work "Bro".

You go your corridor but.
Chekxxx
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-05-30 12:03:43 UTC
Hroya wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro


Here's another one "bro".

The way you guys (2?) acted these past few days, your highly constructive interaction with the playerbase, the removal and not owning up to your own trolling was the reason why i unsubbed.
I couldnt care less for any shennanigans and bad booboo play going on in the game. I do have problems with selfentiteled smartasses who think they are better then anyone else. Put such people in a position of power and it's becomes very very hard trying to defend their actions or plea to reason when **** hits the fan.

My subs dont matter the slightest i know so keep up the good work "Bro".



Indeed, luckily Planetside 2 and other good stuff will soon be coming our way
Lemster
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#11 - 2012-05-30 12:05:28 UTC
Qlfon wrote:
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro


What type of ******** answer is that to own customers?


There was a more comprehensive answer given days ago, laying out the reasons and saying that everyone had had a chance to make representations and that the matter was now decided and closed and that further spam on the tourney forums was not permitted.

In light of that and the fact that they are making a new thread pretty much every day since to continue spamming, I reckon that's a pretty mild response.
Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#12 - 2012-05-30 12:07:21 UTC
Lemster wrote:

In light of that and the fact that they are making a new thread pretty much every day since to continue spamming, I reckon that's a pretty mild response.


Responce doesn't equal answer.
And I personally want answers, not just responces.
Lemster
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2012-05-30 12:10:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Lemster
Cody Zamorah wrote:
Lemster wrote:

In light of that and the fact that they are making a new thread pretty much every day since to continue spamming, I reckon that's a pretty mild response.


Responce doesn't equal answer.
And I personally want answers, not just responces.


They've made one or two statements about it. They've fielded a few questions, they've posted one or two clarifications, and that's just the communication on the public forums. Slightly rephrasing the question every day as an excuse to keep spamming or try to make ccp go over the whole thing again is a rather obvious tactic which it would seem they have seen straight through. Could you please pack it in so that those involved with the tourney can use the tourney forum to discuss the tourney kthxbye
Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#14 - 2012-05-30 12:19:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Cody Zamorah
Sadly enough the questions were never answered.

Actions were taken based upon assumptions. Nowhere there was proof they were in cahoots with eachother in the upcomming tournament.
But based on what happened last year it was subsequentially easier to just assume they were up to no good.
Verification wasn't needed.
Even though they broke no rules last year we have to assume they will this year?
They played within the rules set at AT9, who then can say they will break the new rules for ATX?

Also the question of mine in clarification towards the following
Penalties

A player found breaking any rules can be penalized to various degrees, depending on the severity of the offence. All penalties are incurred at the tournament organizer's discretion. Decisions are final. Penalties may be levied against a player or team and may include but are not limited to:
•Points deduction
•Reducing the offending ship(s) shield / armor / hull / capacitor to 50%
•Removal from the fightBan from competing for one or more matches.
•Ban from competing for the remainder of the tournament, and/or any future tournaments.
•For Alliance Tournament X the referees can call a match null and void or declare a result if they believe that one of the teams is not competing. This tournament is designed to showcase the talents of pilots and should be entertaining.


Bolded and underlined the section which made me curious.

Does this imply that the referee can read minds and listen in on voicecomms to hear / read what the teams are thinking / planning and as such can judge on all relevant information?
Because it seems a bit off, that it boils down to how the referee feels at that moment.

The whole "at the referee's discretion, at the GM's discretion" etc seems to pop up a lot, but that makes it pretty vague in my humble opinion.

Personal guttfeelings shouldn't be the point to judge on because we all know that guttfeeling aren't 100% accurate.
I would like to see a bit more elaboration on that to ensure the referees "believes" aren't the only thing which can result in declaring a match null or void.
Simple question, no answer.

Then this question by Digital Solaris:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114542&find=unread

no reply.

and look another one by Suleiman Shouaa:

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=113853&find=unread

no reply.

we can continue, but this gives a slight indication to what I am hinting.

What we do get is
CCP Soundwave wrote:
Cool story bro
Luis Graca
#15 - 2012-05-30 12:52:56 UTC
dude they don't give a ****, thats the problem
Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-05-30 12:59:31 UTC
All I see is a lot of people asking for more clear and transparant communication.
Luis Graca
#17 - 2012-05-30 13:01:07 UTC
what's the part of "they don't give a ****" you didn't understand?
michael boltonIII
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#18 - 2012-05-30 13:30:19 UTC
Ok, let me lay this **** out for you guys. You're not going to get a personal answer to all of the special snowflake threads because your questions have all already been answered elsewhere. This isn't whinybabby.com, for all your whining needs, it's a forum to talk about a tournament, and tournaments have rules and consequences. But I am a nice guy, and will answer your stuff, because as a member of Test I am accustomed to dealing with the mentally challenged.

1. Any actions you take have to be based on all of the evidence THAT YOU HAVE ACCESS TOO. If someone could be 100% sure about anything they'd understand all the mysteries of the universe. CCP looked at all of they evidence that they had access to (more than anyone outside of the outbreak and hydra teams btw) and saw that EVERY PIECE OF EVIDENCE SHOWED THEM PRACTICING AS A SINGLE TEAM. Literally the only piece of counter evidence is the word of Hydra and Outbreak members, which would obviously be that they are not a single team. I can think of no way in which 2 teams could have looked more like a singular team to any outsider observer than Hydra and Outbreak, which is shocking especially because they knew that the role was designed specifically to prevent what they did last year. Nobody denies that the unanswered emails were an oversight, but not getting an answer from the police about how close you can come to breaking a law doesn't really count for **** when you get arrested for breaking it.

2. If a judge declares a match to be bullshit, he's doing it based on all the information he has access to. If teams have a secret plan to not shoot for the first 5 minutes so they can catch their enemy by surprise, then they are ******* dumb and will have earned it. Cases that are more unclear are things like 12 v 12 T1 haulers, when the match doesn't matter or 1 team is already out. In those cases there is no competition occurring anyway as the outcome is already sealed, but don't be a **** and waste a bunch of time with boring congas. Basically don't be an ass like Wild Boars and CO2 last year.

3. The rules are clear about alliance membership requirements. Exceptions require extra work, and are a privilege because if you dropped to an NPC corp, in the end it's your fuckup.

4. That was a complete troll question.

People are really trying to bite of CCP's **** on this one for **** when it is plainly obvious to see that Hydra and Outbreak were either cheating, or massively incompetent and detached with worldly reason and caution beyond all imagination to have done what they did. After the patriots got caught filming other teams, I'm sure they didn't go around filming home movies inside of professional football stadiums, you know, just because they thought their kids looked good in the stadium atmosphere.

Also, your post's combination of flowery language and phrasing combine with blatant spelling, grammar, and language errors makes it a pretty cool story bro. I'd love to see who's actually behind that NPC alt.
Khanh'rhh
Sparkle Motion.
#19 - 2012-05-30 13:40:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Khanh'rhh
Given this is an alliance tournament discussion board, I don't see the reason why NPC corp alts should be able to post here. This board should follow the CAOD rules - or at least stop the new threads every day, jesus.

Though I am disappointed Hydra/0utbreak got banned (for reasons of wanting to see them compete) they literally couldn't have found a way to look any more dodgy than they were. As MB3 said, if you know you're walking on eggshells, you don't wear clogs.

Personally, "Cool story bro" is a better reply than you'd have gotten from me if my job was taken up by people like you going on and on and on and on about the same thing no matter what is said.

"Do not touch anything unnecessarily. Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." -Soviet infantry manual,

Cody Zamorah
Doomheim
#20 - 2012-05-30 13:42:51 UTC
michael boltonIII wrote:

Ok, let me lay this **** out for you guys. You're not going to get a personal answer to all of the special snowflake threads because your questions have all already been answered elsewhere. This isn't whinybabby.com, for all your whining needs, it's a forum to talk about a tournament, and tournaments have rules and consequences. But I am a nice guy, and will answer your stuff, because as a member of Test I am accustomed to dealing with the mentally challenged.


Why all the namecalling and trolling?

michael boltonIII wrote:

1. Any actions you take have to be based on all of the evidence THAT YOU HAVE ACCESS TOO. If someone could be 100% sure about anything they'd understand all the mysteries of the universe. CCP looked at all of they evidence that they had access to (more than anyone outside of the outbreak and hydra teams btw) and saw that EVERY PIECE OF EVIDENCE SHOWED THEM PRACTICING AS A SINGLE TEAM. Literally the only piece of counter evidence is the word of Hydra and Outbreak members, which would obviously be that they are not a single team. I can think of no way in which 2 teams could have looked more like a singular team to any outsider observer than Hydra and Outbreak, which is shocking especially because they knew that the role was designed specifically to prevent what they did last year. Nobody denies that the unanswered emails were an oversight, but not getting an answer from the police about how close you can come to breaking a law doesn't really count for **** when you get arrested for breaking it.


If they would really take in all evidence I would like to know why the simple fact they haven't broken any rules before is a clear indication they were going to break them now then.

michael boltonIII wrote:

2. If a judge declares a match to be bullshit, he's doing it based on all the information he has access to. If teams have a secret plan to not shoot for the first 5 minutes so they can catch their enemy by surprise, then they are ******* dumb and will have earned it. Cases that are more unclear are things like 12 v 12 T1 haulers, when the match doesn't matter or 1 team is already out. In those cases there is no competition occurring anyway as the outcome is already sealed, but don't be a **** and waste a bunch of time with boring congas. Basically don't be an ass like Wild Boars and CO2 last year.


And in howfar are we certain a judge is totally unbiased?
In howfar do we have to participate in a manner the judge himself deems as worthy to not get kicked out?
Does this mean every alliances PvP standards have to meet the personal quotum and calibre of the judges taste?

michael boltonIII wrote:

3. The rules are clear about alliance membership requirements. Exceptions require extra work, and are a privilege because if you dropped to an NPC corp, in the end it's your fuckup.


Seeing the ruling and also the statement by CCP they can and will adjust rulings at any time they deem fit, isn't it more than normal to get a clear cut answer from CCP in this matter?
Aleast then you have something to sorta fall back to incase you need to petition to Internal Affairs.

michael boltonIII wrote:

4. That was a complete troll question.


And you base that answer upon proof or assumption?
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