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CCP: a question about FW for the forseeable future

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Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#41 - 2012-05-30 01:12:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Muad 'dib
Haulie Berry wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
Okay so, the patch is in are we are a week in now so heres the thoughts and questions to ccp.

So Amarr are outnumbered heavily by the minmatar - never had an issue with this before, lots to shoot.



Not... not really. 5539 Min pilots to 4853 Amarr pilots. Caldari outnumber Gallente 8482 to 6399.

Quote:
CCP released the laughable rules about the sov implications, lock out from station in low sec (not high sec lol) and LP changes based on total system occupancy and the levels of upgrade on those systems.


What's "laughable" about them, precisely? It mainly sounds like you don't like them because they adversely affect you. That's understandable, but it doesn't make them poor design decisions.

Maybe less QQ, more pewpew and before long you will be > T1?


Bringing those numbers to make a point proves you dont know jack about fw, those numbers are totally and complelty irrelivant as ANYONE in fw will tell you.

Laughable? The fact that once beaten down, any side will not be able to make a come back - and no new players will want to to even try (bar a few hard core nutters with JFs and carrier alts all over the place of course). The is no ballance to these fw mechanics - laughable for a company that pre nerfs every new module and system - except this fw change everything at the same time, dealing with it all in one blow was WAY too much WAY too fast.

You know what, why dont you join up with amarr fight and amaze me with your amazing skill to beat this system and win the day - no? no? exactly.

It may sound like QQ to you, this thread is about me and my corp as game play for the last few years and most importantly the future of FW.

Im like that crazy guy wearing a "the end is neigh sign." this is as much as warning as a question to ccp to find out that if this really is working as intended - because if it is - its going to fail once the morale, isk and fights are gone.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Haulie Berry
#42 - 2012-05-30 01:30:15 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:


Im like that crazy guy wearing a "the end is neigh sign." this is as much as warning as a question to ccp to find out that if this really is working as intended - because if it is - its going to fail once the morale, isk and fights are gone.



Is that really the analogy you want to go with? Because everyone ignores that guy for good reason.

You guys have actually made pretty decent progress in Lamaa and Oyonata. I'll assume you've been involved in neither.

A large part of your membership currently exists in the form of Fwedditors. They're numerous but inexperienced. Pretty soon, though, they'll be numerous and experienced, and I expect that Minmatar - which can't be arsed putting a defensive fleet together for any reason at all - will start losing systems in droves.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#43 - 2012-05-30 01:40:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Muad 'dib
Yeah probably not the best analogy in the world i will agree, but thats how my views might be seen, im not actually saying that i am crazy - i have been playing and trying to plex while monitoring the situation from multiple angles - my own corp and other corps/players on my side.

You cannot really say much about it if you have not actually tryed to fight from the amarr side, you wont know and thats why i have made this thread.

For the minmattar its mostly busniess as usual - only more isk and cheaper faction ships, no docking problems etc - who would complain about that, right?

Well they will be complaining once theres no one left to fight.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#44 - 2012-05-30 01:47:42 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Arianna Satellizer wrote:
Which most Amarrs love and prefer than non stop PLEX grinding all day.

So here's a question for you. If you don't want to particpate in the Occupancy Warfare portion of FW, then what's the big deal? Log on, hunt plexers/wts, kill them, log off.



1. Before the station lockout issue comes up: There's plenty of high sec/non-FW systems one-two jumps from massive numbers of WTs.


2. Before the whine about rewards comes up: What does it matter if you don't make any isk off of FW plexes or run missions? You don't do those things anyways.



Why even join faction war to do this?

Certainly it would be stupid to join amarr where you are locked out of stations. Pirates can chase off faction war pvers just as well as militia.


I just finished a minor plex in the most contested amarr system. Just me sitting there alone with the timer. No minmatar ever entered the plex at all. Most of the pvpers probably never even knew I was there. Now it reduced the contested nature of the system from 79.1 to @78.3. So I guess i can sit there and do another 100 or so plexes and decontest the system. Great fun.

I did chase out a minmatar breacher and cormorant out of a medium though. As soon as I came in my destroyer they warped off.


Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#45 - 2012-05-30 01:56:52 UTC
Cearain wrote:
Why even join faction war to do this?
Casual pvp, free war dec, lots of targets without having to worry about gate guns.

Quote:
I just finished a minor plex in the most contested amarr system. Just me sitting there alone with the timer.
That's funny, when I sat in a minor in the most contested Amarr systems I got WTs coming at me left and right. But I'm Gallente FW and not Amarr FW. Go figure.
Cearain
Plus 10 NV
#46 - 2012-05-30 02:12:15 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Why even join faction war to do this?
Casual pvp, free war dec, lots of targets without having to worry about gate guns.


I don't think pirates need to worry about gate guns at faction war plexes or missions.

X Gallentius wrote:

Quote:
I just finished a minor plex in the most contested amarr system. Just me sitting there alone with the timer.
That's funny, when I sat in a minor in the most contested Amarr systems I got WTs coming at me left and right. But I'm Gallente FW and not Amarr FW. Go figure.


I guess Amarr are fighting for plexes allot more than minmatar.

You know you never answered how many plexes you actually closed when you went on that fantastic run:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1368712#post1368712

Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#47 - 2012-05-30 02:35:06 UTC  |  Edited by: X Gallentius
Cearain wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Cearain wrote:
Why even join faction war to do this?
Casual pvp, free war dec, lots of targets without having to worry about gate guns.


I don't think pirates need to worry about gate guns at faction war plexes or missions.

Good catch. Pirates have to worry about gate guns on stargates. So if you're in FW you can engage a number of players on gates with your cruiser and below that you wouldn't try if you were not in FW.

Quote:
I guess Amarr are fighting for plexes allot more than minmatar.
Maybe Minmatar fight for plexes alot more if it's one of their home systems. Plus, if I waste 10 minutes in an enemy system and don't get a fight, at least I get 10k LP for it. Better than nothing, right?

Quote:

You know you never answered how many plexes you actually closed when you went on that fantastic run:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1368712#post1368712
I don't think I capped a single plex. Being in space most of the tiem, having active corp mates, and a good intel network (in game comms channels) were great at helping me find fights that night.

In the case of the first fight, the four Thorax pilots purposefully went to a Gallente FW home system (Nennamaila) looking for a fight. We obliged and I think both sides had fun. They were doing it right. They went to the ENEMY'S home system.
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#48 - 2012-05-30 03:06:06 UTC
Bengal Bob wrote:
...

How is a factual post like the one you quoted a whine? Smile

Almost everyone in FW have been switching sides and taking breaks every so often .. we never did. RP was not even on the table for that decision I think, we are all just tired/frustrated/bored and needed a change of scenery.

But you are right of course, we have had zero impact on anything or anyone. The lol-RP corps are not the ones who did/arranged 99% of Amarr plexing the first 2.5 years, nor were they the ones who have tried to get CCP to look over their shoulder once in a while and they certainly did not make people smile out of amusement or wince out of anger/pity.

RP makes any game in which it rears its head .. better, more fun and for the lol-RP'er .. mor challenging.

The fact that we have left should in the ideal world, have served as a warning bell or wake-up call if you like for CCP .. much like when Pandemic Legion turned their backs on the sovereignty "game" should have been a warning about game play needing attention.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#49 - 2012-05-30 04:07:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Muad 'dib
Pie didnt do much? LOL

back in the day they kicked alot of ass and killed alot of minnies, in fact they are STILL number 4 on the all time on the amarr killboard - and bare in mind they have not been pvping much for the last year!! Yeah TMFED had more kills in a year and a half but they (pie) were more about the plexing and RP smacking :P

People see a structured argument for somthing and just auto post a QQ or whine bash post - like mindless idiots.

If there was no p[roblems there would be no posts like these soooo, ya deal wiht it and ccp please - did you really think that this would be a good plan to suffocate the underdogs (whoever they may be, im not saying ccp hate amarr fw LOL) in the long run.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
Joanna Ramirez
Intaki Militia
#50 - 2012-05-30 06:24:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Joanna Ramirez
Andre Vauban wrote:
You can do Caldari minors in a dessie, but to do a medium or major you need a pimped out PVE fit AF. The majors will start to break most AF's tanks by the last spawn, so it will either be very close or you have to kill some NPCs which is hard when you are perma jammed in the majors.


You have whined so hard that caldari npcs have been nerfed to a point that a new incursus will solo tank a caldari major plex. And as for permajamming, major plex has exactly two npcs which can even attempt to jam you. And here you argue that proper pvp drake would have any problems taking any races major plex solo. Hint: It does not have any problems with any races plex, been there, done that.

So I have two questions:

1) Are you whining on purpose that CCP would nerf caldari rats even more? (is that even possible)
2) Are you just so utterly horrible player in eve that you need several drakes to take a major plex?
Joanna Ramirez
Intaki Militia
#51 - 2012-05-30 06:33:22 UTC
Haulie Berry wrote:
A large part of your membership currently exists in the form of Fwedditors. They're numerous but inexperienced. Pretty soon, though, they'll be numerous and experienced.


There was once such group in Cal front too. They were called 22nd Black Rise Defense unit. After they got some experience and teamed up with one faintly remembered but capable group, funny things happened Twisted
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#52 - 2012-05-30 08:35:51 UTC
X Gallentius wrote:
Mutnin wrote:


I guess us Caldari are the only ones that ever actually kill the NPC's? It takes a single Arti Thrasher to run a minor and you can kill every NPC rat before they do any damage.. It's takes 2 Arti Thrashers or a Caracal to run any Med doesn't matter what race. Major out posts from any race can be solo'd in a Drake.. or a aggro ship & Caracal or small gang of Dessies.

You are just lazy end of story.
I don't think anybody has a problem with what you're doing. They have a problem with a sh** fit condor soloing majors. Anyways, CCP acknowledges it's an issue, and they have a post up on Features and Ideas. Hopefully they'll figure it out soon.


Yes but we see same out of Gals now soloing majors with Incursus. They should just make killing the NPC spawns as something that has to be done in order to capture the plex. This is the simplest way to fix the issue of low sp alt farmers.
Silence iKillYouu
Girls Lie But Zkill Doesn't
Pandemic Legion
#53 - 2012-05-30 08:48:00 UTC
i like the changes.
Buff titans they cost 100bill after all

EVE Mail me i dont check forums often.
marketjacker
Mr. Clean Corp..
#54 - 2012-05-30 09:16:56 UTC
Mutnin wrote:
Veshta Yoshida wrote:
Mutnin wrote:
..lots of references to events from before CCP took a dump on FW .. again ..

Causing them "grief" does absolutely nothing other than allow for the accumulation of infini-LP through plexing .. (maximum of half what a Shakorite would get as they can solo any plex by the way).
Even if by some miracle, Shakorites are asleep for several days and a system is flipped somewhere in the sticks the plex balance is so broken that it will be a practical impossibility to hold such a system .. (ref: any system held beyond Dal pre-idiocy)

Reset wouldn't have helped much, merely delayed the current situation. Difference in plexing is really that pronounced, a small fact that the Gal/Cal chest-beaters can't seem to fathom as they both have stupidly solo'able NPCs and a warzone specifically designed for FW.



I guess us Caldari are the only ones that ever actually kill the NPC's? It takes a single Arti Thrasher to run a minor and you can kill every NPC rat before they do any damage.. It's takes 2 Arti Thrashers or a Caracal to run any Med doesn't matter what race. Major out posts from any race can be solo'd in a Drake.. or a aggro ship & Caracal or small gang of Dessies.

You are just lazy end of story. I've never speed tanked Gal rats, always killed the NPC's. All the NPC's don't spawn at once so if you can't kill what amounts to not even a lvl 3 mission worth of NPC's in a BC then you are extremely lazy.

Also you had plenty of time to do this prior to the system change, as it was known about for a few months.. Much less anyone that had ships get stuck in stations because they were to lazy to move them is a moron.



He's whining, you are just sh*t posting. Killing Gallente NPC's isn't anyone's definition of hard, you moron.
marketjacker
Mr. Clean Corp..
#55 - 2012-05-30 09:18:23 UTC
Muad 'dib wrote:
Pie didnt do much? LOL

back in the day they kicked alot of ass and killed alot of minnies, in fact they are STILL number 4 on the all time on the amarr killboard - and bare in mind they have not been pvping much for the last year!! Yeah TMFED had more kills in a year and a half but they were more about the plexing

People see a structured argument for somthing and just auto post a QQ or whine bash post - like mindless idiots.

If there was no p[roblems there would be no posts like these soooo, ya deal wiht it and ccp please - did you really think that this would be a good plan to suffocate the underdogs (whoever they may be, im not saying ccp hate amarr fw LOL) in the long run.



More whining please, you are a great source of laughs.
Kade Jeekin
Masuat'aa Matari
Ushra'Khan
#56 - 2012-05-30 11:40:42 UTC
First off let me say that I agree that CCP should have fixed plex bugs and NPC balance before rolling out the penalties for losing

I think that the NPC balance is out of kilter mainly because plex capture does not require you to kill the navies, this is where the neuting, TD and SD would come into play with the Amarr and Gallente tankier ships.

To PIE: did you dock in Minmatar/Gallente stations when the system was occupied by the Minmatar? ie weren't they already practising a kind of self-imposed station lock out on the basis of RP? What was your attitude to killing/not killing navy spawns when plexing?

To the Imperial Feydakin, Imperial Outlaws: You intentionally turned you back on the legal war and now find travelling in legal space difficult, even if it is your own faction's. Working as intended. Amarr FW space has loads of hisec entrances, this could have played to your advantage, and may do so in the future.
Frosteele
Bellax Borealis
Arkhos Core
#57 - 2012-05-30 11:42:55 UTC
Hiya,

2 years out from eve. Come back to check the new FW changes (after finding out my subscription is still being charged... lucky ccp)

station lockouts, ok... I guess this makes sense in lowsec. At the end of the day, this is going to get less fights, and more time spent on lolgistics. If I was a dev, I would have put more emphasis on the actual fighting, and less on the "time it takes to fight" for the FW experience. But hey, warping is like... something I could build a business on, right? Whatever, CCP is kinda lol with the way they change their game and this should be no suprise.

GUERRILLA! - smuerrilla - I prefer small ships, fast moving, opportunistic guerrilla fancypants. The new changes require these tactics for the losing team. GREAT!@!

Problem, why the F*** am i doing it for a side with no F******* reward? Because RP? OR wtf? Just explain to me how the whole "sliding LP" was a good idea. Im gonna be quick, RP is not very... um... rewarding to myself ( MLG FPS player). Sure its not for everyone, BUT WHAT OTHER INCENTIVE IS THERE TO JOIN A LOSING TEAM? Targets? ok.... but lame, and not very motivating.

The losing side should have an LP boost. If it was a war, I bet the "EMPIRE" would make it a focus to equip the frontlines... speaking of RP, or reasoning in general. So.... crash the market for the winners ships or what? It is even more in line with economics to allow the side with fewer pilots, to purchase cheaper, ultimately in the hopes of maintaining some form of balance?

I guess that's what I am getting at, Balance. As someone who doesn't even play this game anymore. (due to ccp's cocky, s***filled nature, + joke patches) I am only posting here to say, LOL and WTF.

If you are fighting on a losing side, I would be interested in your comments as to why. If you are on a winning side, please explain how you think its balanced. As it stands, there are a lot of people posting about "us/them"... grow up and look at your game balance children.

If all your posting is "QQ" and "deal with losing" it is obvious you are more about d***wagging than intelligent balance discussion. This economic/combat scenario is broke as a joke, unless ofc, u lolrp and actually care about "FactionA", which in that case, there is no help for you.
X Gallentius
Black Eagle1
#58 - 2012-05-30 11:47:03 UTC
Mutnin wrote:
X Gallentius wrote:
Mutnin wrote:


I guess us Caldari are the only ones that ever actually kill the NPC's? It takes a single Arti Thrasher to run a minor and you can kill every NPC rat before they do any damage.. It's takes 2 Arti Thrashers or a Caracal to run any Med doesn't matter what race. Major out posts from any race can be solo'd in a Drake.. or a aggro ship & Caracal or small gang of Dessies.

You are just lazy end of story.
I don't think anybody has a problem with what you're doing. They have a problem with a sh** fit condor soloing majors. Anyways, CCP acknowledges it's an issue, and they have a post up on Features and Ideas. Hopefully they'll figure it out soon.


Yes but we see same out of Gals now soloing majors with Incursus. They should just make killing the NPC spawns as something that has to be done in order to capture the plex. This is the simplest way to fix the issue of low sp alt farmers.

FWIW, Incursus solo'ing anything larger than a minor is unacceptable as well. And I agree that killing all NPCs in a plex appears to be the only solution at this point. We'll see what CCP comes up with.
Muad 'dib
State War Academy
Caldari State
#59 - 2012-05-30 12:10:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Muad 'dib
Kade Jeekin wrote:


To the Imperial Feydakin, Imperial Outlaws: You intentionally turned you back on the legal war and now find travelling in legal space difficult, even if it is your own faction's. Working as intended. Amarr FW space has loads of hisec entrances, this could have played to your advantage, and may do so in the future.


living in low sec means shooting neutrals and repping logistics to protect your space and stations - this means that your sec drops if you have been a REAL low sec pvper and what does this mean - YOU SEC STATUS DROPS DOWN this means a great many players who have lived and defended low sec cannot go into high sec. This situation is "working as intended by ccp" and yet another stunning failure of ccp to realize their stupidity and implication to this travesty of FW changes.

Saying "quit whining and base in high sec", or "leave fw space to base out of a low sec non fw system
" is woefully stupid and ignorant to the facts of low sec life.

Dont give me this "well why dont you rat it up" - give me a break low sec is the easiest place to lose sec and the hardest place to gain it back.

FW is become a low sec version of incursions spliced up with Sovereignty like it was 0.0 - this is lazy code splicing at best from ccp who do not want to spend real coders time and efforts coming up with something unique thats actually going to work - also major slacking from the creative designers that cant come up with good original ideas for the coders to code!

get your heads out of your asses and look at the big picture - if you cant see it you dont want to see it because "I'm okay so funk everyone else and stop crying" arrogant ignorant and small minded. The writings on the wall in feces people open your eyes, if you dare and take a look.

Kade Jeekin wrote:


To the Imperial Feydakin, Imperial Outlaws: You intentionally turned you back on the legal war


Yeah i post on the forums to make up fake facts for a whine with no base for it... get real. Me and my corp have killed more minnies EVERY month for OVER a year consistently do not tell me im turning my back by attempting to deal with the new mechanics, this shows a shocking lack of empathy and ignorance toward ballence.

Join amarr and find out, then i will take your opinions more seriously rather than QQ and suck it up spam posts of little to no value in this discussion.

Cosmic signature detected. . . . http://i.imgur.com/Z7NfIS6.jpg I got 99 likes, and this post aint one.
BolsterBomb
Perkone
Caldari State
#60 - 2012-05-30 12:36:31 UTC
Haulie Berry wrote:
Muad 'dib wrote:
Okay so, the patch is in are we are a week in now so heres the thoughts and questions to ccp.

So Amarr are outnumbered heavily by the minmatar - never had an issue with this before, lots to shoot.



Not... not really. 5539 Min pilots to 4853 Amarr pilots. Caldari outnumber Gallente 8482 to 6399.

Quote:
CCP released the laughable rules about the sov implications, lock out from station in low sec (not high sec lol) and LP changes based on total system occupancy and the levels of upgrade on those systems.


What's "laughable" about them, precisely? It mainly sounds like you don't like them because they adversely affect you. That's understandable, but it doesn't make them poor design decisions.

Maybe less QQ, more pewpew and before long you will be > T1?



1) Half of all Caldari "militia" pilots are carebear alts running plexes. I have also heard that a bunch of new carebears are now in Mini trying to farm LP (dont know from what)

Button line is Amar needs to stop pissing and whining and go out and get it done

Brig General of The Caldari State

"Don" Bolsterbomb

Traitor and Ex Luminaire General of The Gallente Federation