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Incursions and CCP
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Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#81 - 2012-05-28 21:05:01 UTC
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MZD6-vGQms - 3:30 mark, WH space gained approx 25% more players from Q1 2011 to Q1 2012 (also note: @ the 3:30 mark, Dr E states "as eve gets older and larger, we are into the "Law of Large Numbers": "All changes will be gradual and slow"). *You* may not have seen more people, but over the last year, more and more people were finding WH's to be a viable alternative to Sov Sec...

Well for one thing, my view of wormholes is limited from c1 through c4, so part of my personal perspective is biased in that respect.

But another is just how useful Dr. E's statistics are. I've highlighted this in the past, but he never provides any information on how he reaches the numbers used in his stats*. Especially in wormholes, where the number of people living in them is somewhat irrelevant compared to the number of people actually running the sites.

I know a lot of people that regularly run wormholes, to the extent that it is their only source of income, but do not "live" in wormhole space. They log off in high sec or low sec, and raid wormholes from there. If he reached those statistics by using a metric like the number of players logged off in wormholes at any one time then the statistics are largely useless for showing the number of players actually active in wormholes.

Again the only evidence I have to the contrary is the drop in nanoribbon prices, while T3 sales have remained constant. My personal observations may be inclined to bias due to my only operating in c1-c4, but nanoribbon prices falling are pretty indicative of a rise in WH PvE activity.

*This is something that has been brought up a lot in the past, even by CCP employees. If you read the glassdoor company entry on CCP quite a few employees are particularly scathing of CCP's love for inaccurate meaningless pie charts, and especially the way in which it often leads them to act on very suspect conclusions concerning their player base.

Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Your comments about exploration / incursions: /shrug - I have had weeks where my isk was better from exploration than incursions, but to each his own . . . .

Well, sure, I've had days when I've made billions. I think my record was 5 bhaalgorn BPCs in a day (plus a load of x+a type loot), but that is hardly the norm.

Plus I wouldn't exactly count myself as the average exploration pilot, whereas dual boxing incursions is pretty easy to do and rather commonplace.

Asuri Kinnes wrote:
I notice that you didn't address my statements about Sov Sec being it's own worst enemy and that Missions have been nerfed to hell and back...

Obviously not, because they don't really make any sense. How is sov space it's own worst enemy? What's wrong with nerfing missions? How do either points relate to incursions?

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#82 - 2012-05-28 21:29:21 UTC
Asuri Kinnes wrote:
Simi Kusoni wrote:

Wormholes were becoming more and more empty. They're still pretty bad, but I've seen a slight increase in the number of people in them since the incursion nerf. This is supported by the corresponding drop in ribbon prices, so I'm guessing my observations are correct when I say people are back running WHs.

(Including quite a few people mining, which I probably have the drone region changes to thank for)

Exploration in low sec pays less than incursions pre-nerf, null sec probably about equal. Post-nerf incursions pay less than null sec exploration, as it should be. Although probably still more than low sec exploration, from what I've heard dual boxing HQs is still pretty damn good ISK.


(nullsec exploration stuffz)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MZD6-vGQms - 3:30 mark, WH space gained approx 25% more players from Q1 2011 to Q1 2012 (also note: @ the 3:30 mark, Dr E states "as eve gets older and larger, we are into the "Law of Large Numbers": "All changes will be gradual and slow"). *You* may not have seen more people, but over the last year, more and more people were finding WH's to be a viable alternative to Sov Sec...

Your comments about exploration / incursions: /shrug - I have had weeks where my isk was better from exploration than incursions, but to each his own . . . .

I notice that you didn't address my statements about Sov Sec being it's own worst enemy and that Missions have been nerfed to hell and back...



wh corps run incursion, you can tell how profit and broken incusion is
YuuKnow
The Scope
#83 - 2012-05-28 22:17:16 UTC
I'm a PvE player myself. The incursion changes were necessary as VGs were too lucrarative. Making assaults and HQs more attractive is a good idea as it forces larger groups and more player cooperation which is good for any MMO.

yk
Dread Nanana
Doomheim
#84 - 2012-05-28 22:35:06 UTC
Nirnias Stirrum wrote:
TriadSte wrote:
Before this gets trolled to high heaven,


/me stamps his feet and picks his nose.


What I would like to know is WHY is Nirnias picking TriadSte's nose!??!?
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#85 - 2012-05-28 22:36:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Vimsy Vortis
Engaging in a social activity and meeting new people who you might otherwise never engage with, or getting together with a group of good friends to do a fun activity are irrelevant and meaningless, the only thing that matters is isk per hour. If something doesn't earn the largest possible quantity of fictional currency it isn't worth doing and you may as well go back to grinding L4s in your CNR 23/7 by yourself in your 1 man corp because the experience and outcome is exactly the same.

Carebears make me want to vomit.
Apolyon I
Shadow of ISW
#86 - 2012-05-29 06:41:22 UTC
Vimsy Vortis wrote:
Engaging in a social activity and meeting new people who you might otherwise never engage with, or getting together with a group of good friends to do a fun activity are irrelevant and meaningless, the only thing that matters is isk per hour. If something doesn't earn the largest possible quantity of fictional currency it isn't worth doing and you may as well go back to grinding L4s in your CNR 23/7 by yourself in your 1 man corp because the experience and outcome is exactly the same.

Carebears make me want to vomit.

isnt it the nature of carebears??????
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#87 - 2012-05-29 08:18:00 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
TriadSte wrote:
Before this gets trolled to high heaven, I believe I have a valid point when I say why is it that when CCP know full well they have made a huge error of judgement they become quiet about it on the forums and don't respond to topics made about said problem.
CCP please respond.

Additional : This is a serious topic but I knoe alot of you are going to make immature stupid comments like a child would. So feel free and be that child.


CCP's response so far seems to be lip service IMHO they've got a wait & see attidue in hopes it'll blow over. The problems with Inferno were predictable & before the shiate hit the fan they could have done something but held off with a promise to do something maybe next month. I'm not holding my breath.
The only thread which saw any official CCP replies was locked 2 weeks ago...
Unsubbing I guess is the only thing that gets thier attention.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
sweetrock
#88 - 2012-05-29 08:31:27 UTC
DarthNefarius wrote:
TriadSte wrote:
Before this gets trolled to high heaven, I believe I have a valid point when I say why is it that when CCP know full well they have made a huge error of judgement they become quiet about it on the forums and don't respond to topics made about said problem.
CCP please respond.

Additional : This is a serious topic but I knoe alot of you are going to make immature stupid comments like a child would. So feel free and be that child.


CCP's response so far seems to be lip service IMHO they've got a wait & see attidue in hopes it'll blow over. The problems with Inferno were predictable & before the shiate hit the fan they could have done something but held off with a promise to do something maybe next month. I'm not holding my breath.
The only thread which saw any official CCP replies was locked 2 weeks ago...
Unsubbing I guess is the only thing that gets thier attention.



sadly This game has gone to **** over the past 2 expansions. Whats even worse Goons can hold CCP to ransom and basicaly have what ever they want in the game, we couild all be flying pink my lil ponys which fire rainbows out of thier a$$ if they wanted.

If all goons were told to unsub it would certainly get ccp's attention, what is it 15k of them now?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#89 - 2012-05-29 08:41:11 UTC
So… has anyone provided any kind of reason why Incursions are (supposedly) no longer popular that doesn't further reinforce the need to have them changed yet?

sweetrock wrote:
Whats even worse Goons can hold CCP to ransom and basicaly have what ever they want in the game, we couild all be flying pink my lil ponys which fire rainbows out of thier a$$ if they wanted.
Way to scuttle your own argument…