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Ninja salvagers?
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Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-05-22 06:56:01 UTC
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-05-22 07:10:18 UTC
Why shoot them in the first place?
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#3 - 2012-05-22 07:22:13 UTC
You shot someone who had hidden reserves of force, WuuuuuuaaaaaaAAAAAT!! Shocked

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-05-22 09:37:43 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer?


No, they don't lose the timer. It persists until the 15 minutes pass, doesn't matter if they switch ships, jump systems, log off, kill you, etc.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#5 - 2012-05-22 09:44:27 UTC
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer?


No, they don't lose the timer. It persists until the 15 minutes pass, doesn't matter if they switch ships, jump systems, log off, kill you, etc.


OP was trying (poorly) to make a feature suggestion.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-05-22 13:02:01 UTC
pop your wrecks to troll them, abandon all to see if they're just baiting.
nahjustwarpin
SUPER DUPER SPACE TRUCKS
#7 - 2012-05-22 13:18:41 UTC  |  Edited by: nahjustwarpin
ninja salvager once jumped in helios when i was running mission, then he started salvaging, so i warped off and he got aggro. not sure if his ship popped or not, but when i got back , he warped back 2 mins later in kronos and literally finished mission for me. i got lp and isk for completing mission, so i started next one.
Vimsy Vortis
Shoulda Checked Local
Break-A-Wish Foundation
#8 - 2012-05-22 13:31:07 UTC
nahjustwarpin wrote:
ninja salvager once jumped in helios when i was running mission, then he started salvaging, so i warped off and he got aggro. not sure if his ship popped or not, but when i got back , he warped back 2 mins later in kronos and literally finished mission for me. i got lp and isk for completing mission, so i started next one.

That's one of the strangest things I've ever heard
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#9 - 2012-05-22 13:41:04 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


So you're saying I should be able to freely steal ore and loot all day long as long as I cycle through my stack of ships to do it?


OK!

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-05-22 14:00:57 UTC
it pays to be in a player corp.

agress them and watch them change into a bigger ship

at the same time you should be arranging your corpmates to arrive in logi and dps to turn the tables on him

kill his gank ship, you have no idea how much that hurts a ninja, they bling fit them like nobodys business

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#11 - 2012-05-22 14:01:06 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


So you're saying I should be able to freely steal ore and loot all day long as long as I cycle through my stack of ships to do it?


OK!

Yeah, OP didn't really think through those consequences. You could flip a can full of ore and then have your own hauler empty the new can while you reship to shed aggression.

Keep shooting those ninjas! One day they'll learn their lesson!

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#12 - 2012-05-22 14:39:08 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


So you're saying I should be able to freely steal ore and loot all day long as long as I cycle through my stack of ships to do it?


OK!

Yeah, OP didn't really think through those consequences. You could flip a can full of ore and then have your own hauler empty the new can while you reship to shed aggression.

Keep shooting those ninjas! One day they'll learn their lesson!

I'm saying he jumps in flying salvager, I destroy it. He cannot reship and come shoot me he must then be shot in his new ship before he can return fire. So he can't use the mission ships to his advantage because I got pissed off with him salvaging my wrecks.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#13 - 2012-05-22 14:50:56 UTC
I know that's what you said you wanted. I was telling you what you'd actually get if your request was granted.

There's no way to say this without being patronising, so I won't even try: you need to learn to think about the unintended consequences of your suggestions. It's a skill that's extremely useful in life as well as EVE.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Sir Livingston
Doomheim
#14 - 2012-05-22 15:34:05 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


Even though this suggestion is silly, as detailed why in the above posts, this belongs in the "Features & Ideas Discussion" section

Sci-fi games as played by an earthbound human in the 21st century http://www.youtube.com/JonnyPew
Aeril Malkyre
Knights of the Ouroboros
#15 - 2012-05-22 16:39:38 UTC
They want you to blow them up. So they can switch to a ship designed specifically to kill you. They lose a frigate, you lose a BC or worse. Your proposal, as has been stated, would allow people to jump responsibility at will just by docking and switching ships.

So moral is: don't shoot them. I once had a ninja hop in and start salvaging my field. My tank was fine against the few rats left, so I started targeting the wrecks. I'd wait for him to get to just about salvage range, and I'd send artillery shells through the hull. He even flipped one of the wrecks just to get me to shoot at him. But when he saw that I wasn't going to shoot back, and that I was willing to destroy the wreck rather than let him profit, he cursed me in Local and jumped out.

Don't shoot them. Shoot their profit, and deny them their ignoble PvP. They hate that.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#16 - 2012-05-22 17:38:31 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


So you're saying I should be able to freely steal ore and loot all day long as long as I cycle through my stack of ships to do it?


OK!

Yeah, OP didn't really think through those consequences. You could flip a can full of ore and then have your own hauler empty the new can while you reship to shed aggression.

Keep shooting those ninjas! One day they'll learn their lesson!

I'm saying he jumps in flying salvager, I destroy it. He cannot reship and come shoot me he must then be shot in his new ship before he can return fire. So he can't use the mission ships to his advantage because I got pissed off with him salvaging my wrecks.


Why should you get a guarantee of your opponent's forces? Every other form of PvP comes with traps, why shouldn't shooting defenseless salvage tugs have the possibility of a trap?

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-05-22 20:40:00 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
I know that's what you said you wanted. I was telling you what you'd actually get if your request was granted.

There's no way to say this without being patronising, so I won't even try: you need to learn to think about the unintended consequences of your suggestions. It's a skill that's extremely useful in life as well as EVE.

I'm not suggesting the thief loses his flag, but I lose mine, so:
he steals
i pop his frig
he switches to nightmare
I can shoot him if i choose, he cannot shoot me until I have fired again.

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
Moonlit Raid
Doomheim
#18 - 2012-05-22 20:41:33 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Moonlit Raid wrote:
or just people who aggress in general.
When aggression is received the aggressor (thief) only retains the agro timer when in the same ship. Once they switch to a battleship from their frig they lose the timer? What you guys think? pisses me off getting shot up during a mission by some ninja salvager who then switches to a mach whilst im being shot by several NPC's.


So you're saying I should be able to freely steal ore and loot all day long as long as I cycle through my stack of ships to do it?


OK!

Yeah, OP didn't really think through those consequences. You could flip a can full of ore and then have your own hauler empty the new can while you reship to shed aggression.

Keep shooting those ninjas! One day they'll learn their lesson!

I'm saying he jumps in flying salvager, I destroy it. He cannot reship and come shoot me he must then be shot in his new ship before he can return fire. So he can't use the mission ships to his advantage because I got pissed off with him salvaging my wrecks.


Why should you get a guarantee of your opponent's forces? Every other form of PvP comes with traps, why shouldn't shooting defenseless salvage tugs have the possibility of a trap?

Why shouldn't jumping into someones mission get you shot at by the NPC's?

If brute force isn't working, you're just not using enough.

Please Note: Any advice given comes with the caveat that nothing will be suitable for every situation.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#19 - 2012-05-22 20:48:13 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Yeah, OP didn't really think through those consequences. You could flip a can full of ore and then have your own hauler empty the new can while you reship to shed aggression.

Keep shooting those ninjas! One day they'll learn their lesson!

I'm saying he jumps in flying salvager, I destroy it. He cannot reship and come shoot me he must then be shot in his new ship before he can return fire. So he can't use the mission ships to his advantage because I got pissed off with him salvaging my wrecks.

Losing aggression when you reship means it's impossible to react to escalating situations. Suppose I canflip a miner in a destroyer. He doesn't bite, but suddenly five of his corpmates show up and take a few shots at me before I warp off (because they're idiots and don't have points). I grab something better suited to fighting a small gang and come back...only I'm no longer allowed to shoot at them, because *gasp* I'm in a different ship!

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#20 - 2012-05-22 20:49:04 UTC
Moonlit Raid wrote:

Why shouldn't jumping into someones mission get you shot at by the NPC's?


Ok, give Mission rats sleeper AI. Have fun, Drone boats.

Anyway, real answer, because Mission AI is intentionally stupid so that you can easily fleet newbies in to let them help you. (Well, it wasn't intentional to begin with, but they haven't updated it in 10 years, so I call the inattention intentional).

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
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