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Crime & Punishment

 
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No Insurance, Suicide Ganking Effects

Author
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-05-14 16:10:33 UTC
Bunny, this version of your port is much better.
Darius Brinn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2012-05-14 17:13:01 UTC
Lysaeus wrote:
If it's fine to not get insurance from a suicide gank then it should be fine to remove insurance payouts from self desctructing.


Actually, self destructing your ship and getting the insurance payout is a pretty stupid idea, and it should be removed.
Doctor Caprician
The Denisovan Initiative
#23 - 2012-05-14 22:05:13 UTC
Angry Onions wrote:
Boomhaur wrote:
Angry Onions wrote:
Boomhaur, I can't understand a word you're saying, must be the echo.


Yeah man I tell ya what... Did one of them snipe hunts last night... man with them dang ol' sticks and bags and Whack! Whack! man, go Woooo-loo-loo-loo!... Talk about big mistake y'all... It's right there in that cooler.


You have won my admiration, good sir.



Mine as well!
Dar Saleem
VDD Logistics
#24 - 2012-05-15 01:42:00 UTC
I would laugh my ass off if you ganked someone in high sec they would also bill the ganker the insurance payout they gave the ganked.


Boomhaur
#25 - 2012-05-15 01:44:27 UTC
Dar Saleem wrote:
I would laugh my ass off if you ganked someone in high sec they would also bill the ganker the insurance payout they gave the ganked.




Shhh, be quite or the carebears will hear you and demand it.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#26 - 2012-05-15 04:40:57 UTC
Istvaan Shogaatsu wrote:
You don't really need to gank well-tanked ships when there are this many carebears flying billions of ISK around in un-tanked frigates.

Oh, and suicide ganking is just as profitable as ever, if not more - the insurance nerf had little effect. My corp tends to choose the most efficient method for a small organization like ours to make money - currently, that method is preying on fat Jita grubs.


I've been sitting on the wrong gate :<

ganking haulers is pretty easy solo work, for ganking mission runners it usually takes a few more, threshold went up a bunch but I'm sure some still make themselves a target

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Obakta
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#27 - 2012-05-16 15:34:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Obakta
I for one welcome our new Destroyer Overlords !
Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#28 - 2012-05-19 04:10:36 UTC
Boomhaur wrote:

So is my assessment so far true that we are doing a lot of suicide ganking of lightly armored ships, and significantly less of the more heavily armored ones due to the nerf? Or have I just been lucky and not seen any of those more formable camps?


Well. The CONCORD insurance nerf came along around the same time with the destroyer buff and the introduction of the tornado. So we have a good cheap dps ship in the catalyst and a good alpha ship in the tornado. But you are correct in that it is not a good idea anymore to t1 fit a BC or BS and just see what you can kill. Gotta go after high value targets. Tornado still king of suicide ganking outside of hulkageddon. Also, suicide ganking is quite rare outside of hulkageddon/goonananigans
Boomhaur
#29 - 2012-05-19 05:57:51 UTC
When I fly along trade routes which I do semi regularly it seems to me suicide ganking happens quite often. I see people in pods sometimes, people who were freshly suicide ganked and the gankers. And I see a LOT of destroyers setup to alpha people and than tornado's to do the same, and some frigs setup to scan ships.

I actually went out and setup one of my ships and started scanning everyone along the trade routes to confirm this after making this thread and it seems like it holds true. Suicide ganking is live and well, it's just that it has evolved into being more precise on who you attack.

And that with the insurance nerf taking out larger targets seems to be less profitable unless you get a particularly stupid hauler who hauls a LOT of valuable goods. I didn't stick around long enough to see how many of them I saw who would worth the effort, I only scanned around 10 freighters and none of them would be worth the effort. I saw a lot of fail fits though including a machariel fitted with civilian guns, reppers, afterburners, and mining lasers I wanted to suicide gank that to give that ship a mercy killing but unfortunately I didn't have the manpower available at the time.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2012-05-19 22:41:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Hammer Crendraven
Hmm we all know and love our insurance companies don't we?! They always come out on top of every transaction in RL!
So why not in EVE as well? If a toon gets say (subject to change) one payout in a month from a concorded ship then they pay 10% more to insure any other ships that month. If they get 2 concorded insurance payouts in that month then 20% more to insure any other ships that month, etc... Same can apply to self destruct insurance payouts. These toons are tracked and known by insurance companies as high risk. And we all know how insurance companies treat high risk toons! Any other ships that toon wants to insure that month has a risk premium attached to it. Payouts remain the same just the cost to insure goes up. How much can be any amount as CCP sees fit for the risk to the insurance corp.

Toons created and deleted just for ganking purposes would be an exploit. Created toons is fine, but deletion within the same month to avoid the insurance premium and to free up a spot to create a new toon for ganking would be the exploit.

Note: This only applies to insurance payouts. If you want to avoid the escalation of high risk premiums with your planed multiple gankings then do not insure your ganking ships. The choice is yours to make. Or same applies to self destruct.
Zanza Mechonis
What is tax
#31 - 2012-05-20 19:20:54 UTC
Hammer Crendraven wrote:
Hmm we all know and love our insurance companies don't we?! They always come out on top of every transaction in RL!
So why not in EVE as well? If a toon gets say (subject to change) one payout in a month from a concorded ship then they pay 10% more to insure any other ships that month. If they get 2 concorded insurance payouts in that month then 20% more to insure any other ships that month, etc... Same can apply to self destruct insurance payouts. These toons are tracked and known by insurance companies as high risk. And we all know how insurance companies treat high risk toons! Any other ships that toon wants to insure that month has a risk premium attached to it. Payouts remain the same just the cost to insure goes up. How much can be any amount as CCP sees fit for the risk to the insurance corp.

Toons created and deleted just for ganking purposes would be an exploit. Created toons is fine, but deletion within the same month to avoid the insurance premium and to free up a spot to create a new toon for ganking would be the exploit.

Note: This only applies to insurance payouts. If you want to avoid the escalation of high risk premiums with your planed multiple gankings then do not insure your ganking ships. The choice is yours to make. Or same applies to self destruct.


Although RL insurances do this, it is for a very general good, for example you won't see much variation in a bike that's used every day. With the money of the EVE insurance though, you can for example lose a BS, and buy a load of frigates with the insurance payout. The general idea of this is good, however in EVE it's not good at all.

"On the internet you can be anything you want... It's strange that many people choose to be stupid."

Taryn Oskold
Doomheim
#32 - 2012-05-24 08:42:40 UTC
Boomhaur wrote:
I started playing again close to 2 months ago and it seems the Carebears have whined enough that the Concord insurance was taken away from suicide ganking.


It wasn't carebears that did it; it was the sheer ridiculousness of getting rewarded for blowing up your own ship. That's like deliberately driving your car into a crusher and then trying to claim it on your car insurance.

(Then again, suicide was once punishable by death, so I can't really comment. And no, I'm not kidding. Look it up.)
Hammer Crendraven
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2012-05-24 09:04:41 UTC
Taryn Oskold wrote:
[quote=Boomhaur]I
(Then again, suicide was once punishable by death, so I can't really comment. And no, I'm not kidding. Look it up.)


LOL, Yep so that would be an exploit to do a suicide gank and live to do it again and again as a career.Smile
Talon Kitsune
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#34 - 2012-05-26 04:38:44 UTC
Traditionally suicide ganking isn't about profit, and worrying about financial loss isn't a big deal. Look at the killboards sometime, the majority are financial losses by a pretty good margin, it's a griefing and entertainment thing mostly. Some peeps dig it, some don't, to each his own. Since the majority of suicide gankers utilize destroyers or frigates outfitted for 2-10 mil depending on how serious of a target they are dealing with, it's not that big of a financial loss, so the insurance is a non factor. If it's too costly to bring a ganking BC or BS just get a few friends and bring a bunch of destroyers/frigs to accomplish the same goal.

Anytime I see people accuse CCP of trying to protect PVE'ers I laugh, this is probably one of the few MMO's in existence that has no PvP protection whatsoever (aside from sitting on a station). They've gone out of their way to make sure if you want someone dead, you can kill them no matter where they decide to play the game unless they decide they prefer the station life permanently.

I've played EVE off and on for years, tried to recruit friends to play over that time as well, and from talking to them, and to other players who tried EVE in other games, the #1 reason they didn't like it, or didn't stay: EVE forces PvP on it's player base. Me personally? I love PvP in most MMO's, not as much in EVE, because I love to have the option of when I PvP. Soon as I log into EVE and leave the station, I've entered a PvP arena. So I play for a few months, get burnt on the constant PvP environment, and take a break. I always seem to come back for another round of it though.

Trying to protect PvE'ers? Come on, if they'd do something as simple as adding a flagging option for high sec (if your flagged you leave yourself open to the current rules, if not you can't be touched outside of war decs), I guarantee you they'd see new players, because say what you will about PvE'ers or carebears, but they make up the majority of the online gaming community. CCP knows this, and still has never taken that simple step.

They're not stupid, they want a PvP based game, both sides need to accept it. Hardcore PvE'ers need to find another game, hardcore PvP'ers have found their game, and those that enjoy both aspects (like myself) can have fun for a while, but will probably burn out.
Michael Giacolone
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#35 - 2012-05-27 21:19:00 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
I kersploded a Hulk and it's on the killboard but the goons send no monies? I thought goons where the most trustworthy in eve Sad

RTFM
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