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Wall Street: The Silence Of US media?

Author
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#41 - 2011-10-02 23:58:12 UTC
Astenion wrote:
I wonder if inactive reserve counts as well. I'm sure it does.

However, I'm sure that the last thing on any JAG's mind is prosecuting a bunch of veterans for joining a protest in their uniform when they may not be completely done with inactive reserve. I mean, you're a civilian at that point anyway. The red tape would be staggering and the PR hit would seriously damage morale.

It's not like they're active duty or activated reservists. It's basically a Veteran's Day parade scenario.


You're still considered a "reservist". IRR, inactive, etc. is still part of the contract, so yes, you would fall under the UCMJ. However , to properly charge you they'd have to call you back to active duty, start the investigation (alternatively, start the investigation, then call you back to AD when they have the evidence), convene an Article 32 hearing, then go from there. In many instances, it'd just be a letter sent home saying, "Hey, don't do this. It's bad and you can be charged for it." It's all about the cost and if they want to pursue it.
Astenion
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2011-10-03 00:07:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Astenion
Yeah, just like I thought: tons of red tape.

I was in for nearly 9 years so I never had inactive reserve. The only stipulation I had to sign when separating was a form saying that only the Secretary of Defense could call me back to active duty, and only for two years after I separated.

Therefore, if I wanted to break out my old desert BDUs, woodland BDUs, dress blues, or any other of my uniforms stashed away in a box in the attic, put them on and go protest, I could because the UCMJ can't touch me.
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#43 - 2011-10-03 00:14:58 UTC
Astenion wrote:
Yeah, just like I thought: tons of red tape.

I was in for nearly 9 years so I never had inactive reserve. The only stipulation I had to sign when separating was a form saying that only the Secretary of Defense could call me back to active duty, and only for two years after I separated.

Therefore, if I wanted to break out my old desert BDUs, woodland BDUs, dress blues, or any other of my uniforms stashed away in a box in the attic, put them on and go protest, I could because the UCMJ can't touch me.


Ehhhhhh, that depends. If you're a Marine veteran and use your cammies, you can be hit with charges of failure to obey a directive, which is not to wear cammies in public. However, since you said 'BDUs' I'll assume you're Army, and thus allowed to walk around in them in public.
SpaceSquirrels
#44 - 2011-10-03 02:32:25 UTC
Only counts when in uniform or on base not in uniform...who would protest on base... I dunno. Veterans are exempt (which it is a veterans group)

I did hear that officers even not in uniform cannot make political statements however. Not sure if it's true or not never bothered to verify.
Azelor Delaria
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#45 - 2011-10-03 03:02:49 UTC
SpaceSquirrels wrote:
Only counts when in uniform or on base not in uniform...who would protest on base... I dunno. Veterans are exempt (which it is a veterans group)

I did hear that officers even not in uniform cannot make political statements however. Not sure if it's true or not never bothered to verify.


You can't make political statements in uniform, nor can you invoke rank or branch of service while out of it. This applies to officer and enlisted, though there may be additional stipulations for officers. I'm a terrible officer who was promoted from the enlisted ranks and never attended OCS. <.<

I can look it up for you, if you'd like.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#46 - 2011-10-03 15:26:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
VKhaun Vex wrote:
Bane Necran wrote:
And even if they are blocking traffic, is that really justification for outright violence towards people who pose no threat to anyone?


Yes, actually.

Not all violence is bloody sunday, rodney king, and raping and pillaging then burning the village down. At some point you do, obviously, need officers to be violent to a degree if someone won't follow their directions about blocking traffic. If officers didn't force compliance it wouldn't be law, it would be suggestion.

Hell, if you try and stop me from going to work I'll get violent myself. Talk all you like about an officer in the wrong, but remember he's also between you and other citizens, too. If no cop stopped them and they filled a street, what would happen when a hundred angry motorists started trying to drive through them? You think they'd all play nice?

Get run down by a Wall Street exec in a tank of a luxury car with two body guards and his own legal team on speed dial, then complain to me about pepper spray and justice. Big smile




You must be one of those people who live under the illusion of being some kind of "insider" or special.

When it's your turn to be beaten up by thug cops, and then charged with assaulting them, think of me.

Blind worship of all things police will not put you on the "do not step on neck" list.

People like you are the reason why they will never fill up the FEMA camps. Gathering "undesirables" in large places en masse is very 19th century and not necessary with the advent of computers. But it will be people like yourself who, even with masses of people being hauled off and "disappeared", will point at empty camps and say "See? see? There's no tyranny!!! You are just believing what you want!!!1!!".

Well, I have a message for you. Believing what you want, even in the face of what scares you, does not change reality. You should have learned that when you were at least 5 years old. How many Jews dies expecting water to come through that faucet overhead? They marched right in.

You will march alone.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#47 - 2011-10-03 15:51:21 UTC
Interesting takes...


So far, the Tea Party movement has been the most prominent, and it has been dominated mostly by Republicans.
Now, Occupy Wall Street is becoming a national movement, and it is being dominated mostly by radical leftists and socialists.
Both movements have attempted to appeal to the growing core of libertarians in this country, and to a certain extent both movements have had some success.




---




Despite the sincerity of most Occupy Wall Street protesters and their desire to close down Wall Street and even the Federal Reserve, the movement is quickly becoming a catch-all for socialists and large unions determined to tax millionaires out of existence.





Ok so we got people saying "those hippies protesting on Wall St. yet that "left" thing that hippies are associated with is hijacking the Wall St. protest.

(NOTE: the REAL hippies from the 1960s were not leftists, nor rightist, or any kind of "ist" nor did they follow any kind of "isms". I know a lot of old original hippies and there are two things I can say: 1. They hate both political parties and 2. They were right about the future they warned us about decades ago).



But we also see, right up to a snide comment by Mittani, the "those evil coservative Tea Partiers" crap - another movement that started out with good intentions and got hijacked by political hacks bending it to their own means

But it’s now a year later, and the Tea Party seems to be transforming from a libertarian gathering to promote less intrusive government and celebrate our freedoms to a neo-con group promoting War in Iran, criticizing immigrants and diversity, and persecuting those with different religious views. Rachel Maddow and David Weigel from The Washington Post have provided excellent coverage of this transformation from the very beginning, interviewing libertarian bloggers like Steve Gordon and Jason Pye and even interviewing Congressman Ron Paul to gain their perspective on the Tea Party hijack. Maddow was shocked to learn that three so-called Tea Party supporters challenged the inspiration behind the Tea Party — U.S. Rep. Ron Paul — for Congress in his rural Lake Jackson/Victoria area district in Texas..


I recall a year ago during the so called "rise of the Tea Party" hitting a "progressive" radio station fearmongering every false platitude of the movement. It was all about the big bad Sarah Palin out to get everybody when in fact the Tea Party was 40 percent democrats BEFORE the FOX (right) media started to say she was the mother of it. Yet the Left-leaning radio station parrotted and harped on the same false premise. Anybody with a browser could find the truth. But who at the radio station was called up by who at the RNC to spew the lies?

That was the intention. It's called Full Spectrum Dominance.


So what's new here?

Nothing. Protesting Wall St is a good idea because of their crimes. But that movement gets hijacked. Protesting overbearing government is a good idea but that got hi-jacked too.

All that left is for brainless sheeple like yourselves to fall for the ruse. If you go about thinking the Tea Party is what it was never intended to be (a bunch of neo-nationalists out to make you goose-step in hackboots) or thinking the protestors on Wall St. are a bunch of hippies and leftys, then congratulations: you got fooled. You were not paying attention.

Most of the empire of lies upon which your prison is built - like The Matrix for example - depends on you not paying attention.

Now go find a mirror and admit you were wrong, if any of you are capable of that, and then press on with some more discernment.

Do it, or else you'll find yourselves in a war or a cage.









Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Carceret Rinah
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#48 - 2011-10-03 16:27:37 UTC
I've seen plenty of mainstream news reports, nothing special. Usually about the pepper spray cop. I don't really see why they should give it any special attention. Protests are a dime a dozen in the US. They don't change anything, as long as the fundamental incentive structure is the same. People do bad things because it pays (in money), they do good things because it pays (in social currency). People milling around in the streets chanting cliched slogans won't affect that.

I almost hope the protesters do get violent, just so the cops have an excuse to drive them all out.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#49 - 2011-10-03 16:46:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Five Lessons the Protestors need to learn.

Quote:
At the time of the Federal Reserve's founding only a noble and vigilant few in America realized that American sovereignty and American independence was being destroyed by the treacherous directors of the Federal Reserve. The allegiance of Federal Reserve directors and presidents is not to the U.S. constitution and the American nation but to a foreign, private banking cartel based in London, England.

Most Occupy Wall Street protesters refuse to look into the evil nature of the Federal Reserve. They are blinded because of their economic ignorance. Michael Moore, who has a reputation of exposing banksters' greed and Wall Street criminality, is missing in action on the real battlefield - the one that pits the evil Federal Reserve Banking Cartel versus the American people and the world.

So although Occupy Wall Street protesters have good intentions, they have a low degree of knowledge about the roots and causes of the world financial crisis. Their knowledge is so lacking that their protesting will not accomplish their goals. What they need is not a revolution, but an education. An education is the best kind of revolution - it is the revolution of the mind.




Quote:
The thousands of Americans currently expressing their disgust at Wall Street and the bankers who have ruined the economy to the detriment of the poor and middle class should be commended for getting off their hind ends and doing something, unlike the millions who will continue to watch American Idol, drink beer and laugh in ignorance as the country is flushed down the toilet. It should also be added that there is a sprinkling of “End the Fed” demonstrators who truly understand the root cause of the problem.

However, the fact that the majority of the Occupy Wall Street demonstrators are advocating “solutions” which the very elite they claim to be protesting against also want should set alarm bells ringing.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#50 - 2011-10-03 17:07:00 UTC
The reason why the Occupy Wall Street protests are so populated by leftist radicals, Marxists, and socialists is because they've been planning it for about 8 months. There is nothing spontaneous about this 'movement' - it had been announced by its organizers long ago with the stated intend of being the left's answer to the tea party (some explicitly said so). Since that time, the strategy has changed somewhat but the goal has remained the same.

Glenn Beck brought up an interesting observation this morning about how you see some groups protesting alongside their political opposites and how there doesn't seem to be a unified message, and speculated that was now by design for the purpose of gathering as many people as possible. In other words, hide the socialist/Marxist roots of the movement as best you can (of course the actual marxists at these protests aren't gonna be smart enough to go along with that) so you don't turn off normal Americans.

Fortunately, that sort of muddy vision will ultimately undermine the organizers' objective of seeing Obama re-elected. If anything, it just adds to the national sense that society is unravelling under Obama. So in that way, I support what they are doing.

No president gets re elected with employment as low as it is, heading into a double dip recession, and with hordes of rabble rousers causing troubles in the streets. So live it up, hippies and Ron Paul supporters. The more trouble you cause, the worse it is for Jimmy Carter 2.0. Big smile
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#51 - 2011-10-03 17:44:42 UTC
Here's an interesting one. Note the "building coalition" headline on Freedom Watch?


Well, there WAS one, now people are sitting around going "those hippies on Wall St....."


Works as intended. There is a reason why the call the news and TV schedule "Programming".


If you had the wrong impression, you were programmed.

How does it feel to be weak? Twisted

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Bane Necran
Appono Astos
#52 - 2011-10-03 18:06:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Bane Necran
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
However, the fact that the majority of the Occupy Wall Street demonstrators are advocating “solutions” which the very elite they claim to be protesting against also want should set alarm bells ringing.


I don't think the people protesting on the streets even have a solution. They've just grown to dislike international bankers, and all their signs and chants reflect that. I think when these kinds of things happen other groups step in to put forward 'solutions' on behalf of the protesters. For example, the first thing done after the dust settled from the Egypt riots was the establishment of an international bank, which i'm certain wasn't on the mind of anyone involved in the riots. Unless you have clear outlined goals for your protest or revolution, someone is going to hijack it for their own gain, and that someone just might be the very people you think you're fighting.

But i don't think it's some kind of throwback to a cold war mentality, where secret communists lurk behind every corner and are plotting to destroy the American dream or whatever with things like this, like Glenn Beck told Jada. Glenn Beck is probably CIA, and when you should be blaming corporations for unemployment he has you blaming immigrants. When someone suggests tax dollars be spent on something other than war he tells you it's socialism, etc. The communism boogeyman has been so overused in the last 50 years i'm amazed people still fall for it. There is zero actual evidence of a communist plot to take over the US, but mountains of evidence for a corporate takeover of the US, and Glenn Beck is doing what he can to help the latter.

I support the sentiments of the protesters, but maybe not where things are headed. If they can't all agree on a solution other than "arrest bankers nao" then they're just wasting their time, and the movement will indeed be used to further the corporate/banker agenda.

"In the void is virtue, and no evil. Wisdom has existence, principle has existence, the Way has existence, spirit is nothingness." ~Miyamoto Musashi

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#53 - 2011-10-03 18:38:21 UTC
Jada Maroo wrote:

No president gets re elected with employment as low as it is, heading into a double dip recession, and with hordes of rabble rousers causing troubles in the streets. So live it up, hippies and Ron Paul supporters. The more trouble you cause, the worse it is for Jimmy Carter 2.0. Big smile


Because this problem only started to happen after he got elected and could be fixed in less than a single term of officeRoll
Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#54 - 2011-10-03 18:43:32 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Jada Maroo wrote:

No president gets re elected with employment as low as it is, heading into a double dip recession, and with hordes of rabble rousers causing troubles in the streets. So live it up, hippies and Ron Paul supporters. The more trouble you cause, the worse it is for Jimmy Carter 2.0. Big smile


Because this problem only started to happen after he got elected and could be fixed in less than a single term of officeRoll



Odd, Ronald Reagan began to turn around the mess that was left by Jimmy Carter 1.0 and was re-elected by a landslide because of it. But as we all know, Barack Obama is no Ronald Reagan.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#55 - 2011-10-03 19:08:20 UTC
Jada Maroo wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Jada Maroo wrote:

No president gets re elected with employment as low as it is, heading into a double dip recession, and with hordes of rabble rousers causing troubles in the streets. So live it up, hippies and Ron Paul supporters. The more trouble you cause, the worse it is for Jimmy Carter 2.0. Big smile


Because this problem only started to happen after he got elected and could be fixed in less than a single term of officeRoll



Odd, Ronald Reagan began to turn around the mess that was left by Jimmy Carter 1.0 and was re-elected by a landslide because of it. But as we all know, Barack Obama is no Ronald Reagan.


That man set the seeds for what we are suffering now. Turns out, banks DO need regulation.

Not to mention that the current crisis is far far worse than back then.
Jada Maroo
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2011-10-03 19:17:56 UTC
baltec1 wrote:


That man set the seeds for what we are suffering now. Turns out, banks DO need regulation.

Not to mention that the current crisis is far far worse than back then.



I thought everything was George Bush's fault. Ya'll really need to pick a talking point and stick to it.

Oh, and you mean banking regulation like the Community Reinvestment Act, which threatened banks that refused to hand out loans to people who couldn't afford to pay them back? Which happens to be precisely the practice that started the collapse in the first place. You can thank the first Carter for that little gem as well.
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#57 - 2011-10-03 19:30:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
Bane Necran wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
However, the fact that the majority of the Occupy Wall Street demonstrators are advocating “solutions” which the very elite they claim to be protesting against also want should set alarm bells ringing.


I don't think the people protesting on the streets even have a solution. They've just grown to dislike international bankers, and all their signs and chants reflect that. I think when these kinds of things happen other groups step in to put forward 'solutions' on behalf of the protesters. For example, the first thing done after the dust settled from the Egypt riots was the establishment of an international bank, which i'm certain wasn't on the mind of anyone involved in the riots. Unless you have clear outlined goals for your protest or revolution, someone is going to hijack it for their own gain, and that someone just might be the very people you think you're fighting.

But i don't think it's some kind of throwback to a cold war mentality, where secret communists lurk behind every corner and are plotting to destroy the American dream or whatever with things like this, like Glenn Beck told Jada. Glenn Beck is probably CIA, and when you should be blaming corporations for unemployment he has you blaming immigrants. When someone suggests tax dollars be spent on something other than war he tells you it's socialism, etc. The communism boogeyman has been so overused in the last 50 years i'm amazed people still fall for it. There is zero actual evidence of a communist plot to take over the US, but mountains of evidence for a corporate takeover of the US, and Glenn Beck is doing what he can to help the latter.

I support the sentiments of the protesters, but maybe not where things are headed. If they can't all agree on a solution other than "arrest bankers nao" then they're just wasting their time, and the movement will indeed be used to further the corporate/banker agenda.


The Occupy Wall Street protesters are campaigning for the Obama administration to “Pass the Buffett Rule on fair taxation, so the rich pay their fair share.” This demand is posted on their own website. The campaigners are demanding that the US Congress pass a bill backed by the Obama administration, which is comprised of Wall Street operatives and is a creature of Wall Street.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#58 - 2011-10-03 19:35:33 UTC
Jada Maroo wrote:
baltec1 wrote:


That man set the seeds for what we are suffering now. Turns out, banks DO need regulation.

Not to mention that the current crisis is far far worse than back then.



I thought everything was George Bush's fault. Ya'll really need to pick a talking point and stick to it.

Oh, and you mean banking regulation like the Community Reinvestment Act, which threatened banks that refused to hand out loans to people who couldn't afford to pay them back? Which happens to be precisely the practice that started the collapse in the first place. You can thank the first Carter for that little gem as well.


It was his falt too, trouser boy did at least start the bring the debt down over there but he never fixed the banks. Over here it was maggie thatchers falt for de regulating the banks and labours falt for going on a spending binge and not fixing an incomming problem.

The difference between our two countries is we have people in charge doing things to fix it while you have a mob in power, fighting at eachother over everything in the hope of getting re-elected rather than working together to fix the problems. This is why the UK didnt lose its A+++ and you did.


Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#59 - 2011-10-03 19:40:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Herzog Wolfhammer
baltec1 wrote:
Jada Maroo wrote:

No president gets re elected with employment as low as it is, heading into a double dip recession, and with hordes of rabble rousers causing troubles in the streets. So live it up, hippies and Ron Paul supporters. The more trouble you cause, the worse it is for Jimmy Carter 2.0. Big smile


Because this problem only started to happen after he got elected and could be fixed in less than a single term of officeRoll



Yeah I've been duelling with the "insiders" who got their marching orders in 2009 to go with "Obama this and Obama that". Try to remind people that Obama is Bush's third term, and that both parties work for the same bosses, and you get all kinds of labels thrown at you.

The goal, as usual it, out with the old boss, in with the new boss, getting the same boss.

But what does change is the complaining: the people who complained about what Bush did are silent now that Obama is doing the same thing. The people who complain about what Obama does will be silent when they get their own bankster puppet in place - these were also the same people who became silent when Bush started doing the very things they complained about when Clinton did it.

What I wonder is, what kind of leverage do they hold over Limbaugh, Maddow, O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Matthews (note I am naming BOTH the left and right media sock puppets) to avoid the truth? Where they caught messing with kids? Closet lifestyles? Drug use? It must be a real collection of dirt to keep these people in such a line that they would have any credibility left only with people are are either brain dead or love being conned.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#60 - 2011-10-03 20:06:35 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:


What I wonder is, what kind of leverage do they hold over Limbaugh, Maddow, O'Reilly, Hannity, Beck, Matthews (note I am naming BOTH the left and right media sock puppets) to avoid the truth? Where they caught messing with kids? Closet lifestyles? Drug use? It must be a real collection of dirt to keep these people in such a line that they would have any credibility left only with people are are either brain dead or love being conned.



Money. Always money.

Many polititions over there have made a lot of cash while in office. Just look at Cheney and his companies that just happened to get a fair few contracts in Iraq. All sides are at it although some are better than others at covering it up. America desperatly needs political reform.