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Networth
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HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#1 - 2012-05-13 20:34:28 UTC  |  Edited by: HARD STEEL
Now that we have kill mails with isk valuations, this opens to the door to a personal networth view (private, or maybe even private/public options) as well as reports on the top 10 richest peeps and corps

you could even graph it over time

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
mxzf
Shovel Bros
#2 - 2012-05-13 20:54:49 UTC
Why? If you want to post about your net worth and brag about it, you can (there are programs which can estimate the value of your assets). But there's no reason for CCP to forcibly reveal someone's net worth.
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#3 - 2012-05-13 21:15:05 UTC
yup, i guess the valuation can be done in game on a personal level now - as for outing the top ten yea that would cause problems. At least knowing the ranking would give people some context.

it would be cool tho to see some reports on the distribution of wealth, im sure they've probably done it in the past judging by some of the dev blogs ive seen.

knowing where you stand gives motivation for competition

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Staxed
Femboi Fan Club
#4 - 2012-05-14 00:31:25 UTC
I'm all for this, simply because I like numbers.

Though, outing people against their will I have a problem with, so it would have to be an optional thing to include your name/corps name in the statistics. Though, having everyone that hasn't given permission as 'anon' would still be nice...just to see where you lie. A ranking system of sorts for those that like to know those types of things.

As long as everything involving this is completely optional, and it's just a 'gee-whiz' type of thing, I think it would be neat. Though, I have to admit...plenty of other things I'd rather see the devs spend their time on :)
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2012-05-14 00:53:50 UTC
If this ever happens, it should be opt in only. I don't want anyone to know how much isk I have, anon or otherwise.

And with that note, eveboard already offers this, doesn't it?
ModeratedToSilence
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-05-14 00:59:25 UTC
It would be interesting to see rankings etc. It would increase the scope of the metagame on a massive scale.
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#7 - 2012-05-14 01:27:27 UTC
yea you guys are right - maybe corporate numbers would be public - mimicking how our own public reporting systems work (i.e nobody really know how much google was worth until they went public).. THAT could be ranked openly.. privately.. opt in or not even worth doing.

However I'll strongly think having a private view of seeing how rich you are compared against the entire player base would be a serious motivator as value/wealth/currency is best measured relatively

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2012-05-14 03:37:20 UTC
Pointless post.

1. Other guys will always have more isk then you
2. Other guys will always have less isk then you

End result....not everyone is the same.

So who cares really unless you want to have your name on the top right under Chribba for accumulating wealth or perhaps have your corp/alliance a little too close to Goons that you don't want them to know how much you have in wealth (because it only encourages them to smash up what you own and you know nothing can really stop a bunch of guys goonstepping in unison with to much free time on their hands)
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#9 - 2012-05-14 03:47:32 UTC
it's not important to you but it is for some - not to mention this feature also has a minor man hour impact.

Keeping up with the Joneses is a huge motivational force for human beings, some people are only playing this game to see their pile grow - not knowing how it stacks up may make them lose interest or make them take less risks.. knowing they are falling behind could have an impact in their decision making.

This is a sandbox - variables showing status and rank will motivate people to climb them, being nhilist and saying whats the point is almost cheerleading this game isnt worth playing

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#10 - 2012-05-14 10:56:52 UTC
What we really don't need is yet another reason for people to keep making iSK purely for the sake of making ISK.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#11 - 2012-05-14 11:16:54 UTC
True - but adding visualization to the key metrics and comparing them shouldn't be stopped because some people care only about the numbers.

If that were so, why bother with the new upcoming cost of wins/losses in the war reports, or why both put a isk valuation in a kill mail? We care about the numbers, the numbers create the context that inspire us - however some numbers have no context unless compared to something else in the same group.

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#12 - 2012-05-14 11:58:44 UTC
HARD STEEL wrote:
True - but adding visualization to the key metrics and comparing them shouldn't be stopped because some people care only about the numbers.

If that were so, why bother with the new upcoming cost of wins/losses in the war reports, or why both put a isk valuation in a kill mail? We care about the numbers, the numbers create the context that inspire us - however some numbers have no context unless compared to something else in the same group.

True, but KM evaluations are an important metric that (ideally) will be used to judge your success or failings as a mercenary corporation.

Personal asset evaluations serve little purpose whatsoever other than epeen stroking bragging rights. On the very rare occasion that you ever do have to prove your net worth it is already relatively simple to just open a trade window, drop in 10/20b and cancel trade.

A more thorough system just doesn't seem necessary.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#13 - 2012-05-14 12:11:19 UTC
yup - this pretty much a non-issue I'll agree to all the counter points. all I'm saying is beyond the motivation stuff I mentioned before it wouldn't be much to put in and it adds context to loss as well. 3b ship loss? Vs what, how much am I worth, did I just take a 60% net worth loss, or did I just take a 0.5% loss..

mxzf mention there is software to calculate this, Simi Kusoni pointed out there are tricks to figuring this out with contracts. That alone should justify there is a need for it - the game sorting this out for us as its closest to the full set of data in the database which would be the most accurate source.

they could compile it out in the morning index builds at downtime. they then have a valuation per user per day, which you could pull a crap load of stats from

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Jayrendo Karr
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-05-14 15:03:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayrendo Karr
The ten richest people would be NPC alts holding money for mains. I store my isk on an alt because if I don't ill spend it.
Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2012-05-14 15:22:31 UTC
HARD STEEL wrote:
it's not important to you but it is for some - not to mention this feature also has a minor man hour impact.

*plop, sound of something hitting the table* Come on man, lets measure up before it gets cold and starts to shrink.

Oh wait...does it really matter? I did say that some people will always have more isk and others will have less. Do yourself a favor and set your own goals, let your decisions determine if its enough or if you should keep on piling it up....you don't need to measure yourself by other people's standards just measure yourself by your own.
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#16 - 2012-05-14 15:34:48 UTC
Aqriue wrote:
*plop, sound of something hitting the table* Come on man, lets measure up before it gets cold and starts to shrink.

Oh wait...does it really matter? I did say that some people will always have more isk and others will have less. Do yourself a favor and set your own goals, let your decisions determine if its enough or if you should keep on piling it up....you don't need to measure yourself by other people's standards just measure yourself by your own.



What are you doing? Have you read anything I've even written or are just looking for an outlet to be negative?

I'm not super committed to the public ranking of wealth - it could be interesting but like all ideas would be used for greifing - that said, like in real life, when you get to the top you don't really have a say if the herd knows or not because it's interesting.

However a private asset calculation tied in with an anonymous rank against the total player base would be a pretty huge variable for a individual to go out and set a goal.

i.e the guys who just wanna play the market - they might hustle up to 2 bil and be like "yea I did it, aw now I'm bored" however if they say the top 10% being i dunno lets say 5 tril, they'll push harder and make our sandbox even more fun

Compiling this information could mean reports like - "on average, everyone with Mining Barge 5 took a 25% dent to their personal net-worth during hulkageddon x" wouldn't that amuse some?

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.
Simi Kusoni
HelloKittyFanclub
#17 - 2012-05-14 16:28:19 UTC
HARD STEEL wrote:
What are you doing? Have you read anything I've even written or are just looking for an outlet to be negative?

I'm not super committed to the public ranking of wealth - it could be interesting but like all ideas would be used for greifing - that said, like in real life, when you get to the top you don't really have a say if the herd knows or not because it's interesting.

However a private asset calculation tied in with an anonymous rank against the total player base would be a pretty huge variable for a individual to go out and set a goal.

i.e the guys who just wanna play the market - they might hustle up to 2 bil and be like "yea I did it, aw now I'm bored" however if they say the top 10% being i dunno lets say 5 tril, they'll push harder and make our sandbox even more fun

Compiling this information could mean reports like - "on average, everyone with Mining Barge 5 took a 25% dent to their personal net-worth during hulkageddon x" wouldn't that amuse some?

a) I don't think calculating a player's net worth is as simple as you claim. Some third party programs can do it, but for CCP to do it once daily for every single player in Eve? Sounds like a massive waste of processing power.

b) Alts render the entire process somewhat meaningless. Anyone with any halfway decent amount of ISK in this game has it spread across multiple accounts. Especially if you are counting assets as well as liquid ISK.

c) It doesn't really serve any purpose.

d) If you want to compare yourself to others CCP Diagoras releases some interesting stats every now and then. I believe the last time he released data on the average player's wealth was in February, he also included anonymous stats on the most wealthy players at the same time.

[center]"I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings"  -MXZF[/center]
HARD STEEL
Caldari Capital Construction Company
#18 - 2012-05-14 16:34:14 UTC
yup, you've all convinced me through this dialog.. probably not worth doing because of cost. However if it was simple tweak it would be cool - i know with the new unified inventory there is isk estimations. You're right if it extended downtime - f it, not worth it.

Staxed coined it in my mind - "I think it would be neat. Though, I have to admit...plenty of other things I'd rather see the devs spend their time on :) "

ONLY THE HARD.  ONLY THE STRONG.